The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area Engine Shop Mechanics mistake or ?

I just recently put over $1500 into my 350 4 bolt main. The entire engine was cleaned in and out, timing etc. Every gasket was changed, new exhaust donuts etc.everything gone through. I told the mechanic to use a torque wrench on head bolts and actually every bolt to what they need for each torque. My engine blew 500 miles later down the highway. I did NOT push the engine whatsoever in my bus. Did this engine blow due to his failure to torque each bolt to specks ? He says when his wrist clicks its tight. Please let me know,....and of course he is expecting even MORE money. Thanx for your information.

You can tell more by taking the engine down and finding out what exactly went wrong. I would hope that the mechanic would stand behind his work and do this for you. What kind of arrangement did you make with him when purchasing the engine rebuild?

When you say "blown", what exactly happened?

I would say that real mechanics have torque wrenches.

when his wrist clicks its tight? yeah if he goes by that instead of actually using a torque wrench, its his fault.

I agree either you or him or someone else take the engine apart and see what happened.

There were three holes blown through the oil pan. So disgusted right now,....I haven,t even taken off the pan. I do know there are parts in there.

Your mechanic might have made a mistake in the rebuild, but I would guess the wrist click comment was just a joke. You didn't mention new pistons or wristpins. Holes in the oil pan says something went in the lower end. You really need to take it apart and find out what happened. Make sure your mechanic is involved in the tear-down or he will claim no responsibility. Good Luck, and let us know what happens.

The wrist click was a true comment. If its the lower end ( problems ) which was also worked on ( tightening bolts ) I,m guessing because of his arrogance that him not torquing things properly above, caused the damage to happen below ? He said its bullett proof and it would make my trip of 700 miles. Thanx for any info guys.

You didn't mention exactly what he did for the $1500.00. No mechanic (or wannabe) is going to cut corners on a rebuild and have it come back on purpose. Loosing the lower end in 500 miles just dosen't sound right if it was redone and put back together correctly, had good oil pressure and ran normal temps.

If his work did not involve refurbishing the lower end and he re-did a weak valve train/heads, the additional stress could have been a contributing factor. I've seen it happen more than once.

I agree with 53monster that he was probably joking. Unless he's a complete idiot he's not going to blab to a customer that he doesn't have the knowledge or equipment to do the job he's getting paid to do.

Stuff breaks.....if he's responsible then he should suck it up and he knows that. If the lower end wasn't done at all, then he's probably going to balk. I'd give him a chance to check things out first. If you're expecting him to pay for a 500 mile tow job to get the bus back to his shop to check it out....well, good luck with that!!!

A really frustrating situation for both you and the mechanic. Hope you can get it resolved without a court battle.

Dave

[censored] on his part due to his arrogance like hes the man of 350,s . In my mind,...all that pressure means every bolt should be torqued at the same values equally throughout the re assembly part. Is this his fault ? And no this will not go to court. p.s this went on for one month. I ended up leaving with a different carb. Mine was still on the bench a month later with a brand new rebuild kit waiting for it. He also sent me away with old hoses. Thankful I had just enough cash to replace the hoses before I left. The logistics are ? He needed to torque them all equally or.......hes a master of the wrist click ? Thanks,....need answers. Cheerz bolterz !

I don't know what he is tightening up with the oil pan off if he didn't replace mains or rod bearings. It sounds like you lost a rod (if I'm reading this right) If he didn't overhaul the bottom end I don't know why he should stand behind it. But if he retightened the rod and main bearing caps, then you have a sticky situation. It could have broken a rod bearing cap stud by overtightening it when he "retorqued" them. Maybe not when he tightened them, but when the engine was started and got to operating temp again.

I'd ask him when the last time his torque arm was recalibrated and how it was done. I'd like to know so I don't have to run to get mine every time I want to torque something.

If his defense is that he has a "micrometer eye" and a "torque wrench arm"....then I'd say he is full of $h!t and hope he admits it in court. Make sure you bring your own professional witness.

Anyone can take an engine apart and most can get it back together. Some of them will run OK.

A real mechanic has the correct tools and finds the right person who does to do specialty work. He knows not only how it goes together, but how and why it works. He also stand behind his work.

Your trouble is that he "didn't" rebuild the bottom end. THe thing you have going for you is that he worked on the bottom end with his torque arm (if I read this right).

$1500.00 to 'clean' an engine, new gaskets, etc?! it sound like you're getting an expensive education, and if the details of the work weren't spelled out beforehand.......did he even check compression during the 'rebuild'? check with your local bbb

sorry to hear about your engine,,

just another reason to consider a crate engine, not that much more money and a warranty to go with them..

...as a mechanic I always spell out exactly what my estimates entail...

My customers always know what I'm doing and what they are paying for. I wouldn't make the "Torque wrist" comment to a cusotmer, ever ever ever.

Sounds like you are dealing with a shady mechanic, and in his defence you should know exactly what your money is buying.

I'd get with him, be present for the tear down, hell, bring a friend with you. Leave the courts out of it, two gentlemen can always work out a situation and keep the money out of the lawers pockets.

Good luck to ya.

does Canada have a BBB?

.... if he did nothing more than tighten up stuff in the bottom end then its gonna take a hell freezing to get him to pay for anything since he did not put bearing ect in it. I also can't believe he would go that far and not take the crankshaft out and mic it, get it turned if necessary and a new set of bearings. Around here you can get a shaft turned and balanced for $125 plus the bearings.

Keep us posted. It will be interesting how he handles it.... and like everyone says, you or someone you trust be there when its torn down.

If you want a vision of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face - forever.
- George Orwell

He has also took my truck away from my girlfriend for 5 days who needs it for work. I,m out of town for awhile. Its almost time to call the cops first. He used his key to start my engine somehow. He likes to keep a box of ford keys handy,....now I know why.

I agree. I could do a cheap rebuild for less than that. I think this guy took you to the cleaners. No, the engine blowing may not be his fault, but he probably didn't do anything in that $1500 to fix any problems your engine already had going on.

Finally. I have photos uploaded to show you bolters my bus. wooot ! wooooot!!! ....lol.

Getting back to the original work,
Why did the "whatever" in the bottom end of the engine need tightening?

I can understand torquing the rods and mains as part of reassembly after some repair or replacement work where they were previously loosened.

But I can't understand re-torquing them on a used engine just for the fun of it.
Perhaps he over did it on the "re-torque" and overstretched a rod bolt or stripped the threads out of a nut, perhaps he did actually cause the failure.

What did he actually do under there, or what was he asked to do?

It may be time for a new mechanic, a good one, and have him carryout the tear-down and inspection while the old "mechanic" watches with his hands in his pockets.

Grigg

The guy "stole" your truck? I'd have a theft warrant sworn out within minutes of it leaving the property without my permission! If you let him touch anything else you own, consider yourself an idiot!

Chalk the experience up to a very expensive lesson. Get another engine built by a competent mechanic, and sue the pants off that shade tree wrench jockey! Definitely don't let him anywhere near anything else you own, and badmouth him all over town!
Jerry

How was the entire engine cleaned in and out
with the pistons and crankshaft in place?

After he "tore the heads off to see the pistons",
Is that all he did was LooK. What did he say?

When he went underneath and tightened up bolts,
did he say if any of the bolts underneath were loose.
What tool did he use, a 3/4" breaker bar or what.

If he did "overstretch" a bolt
how are you going to prove he did it.

If you were there "every step of the way",
why did you let him continue
the job without a torque wrench?

Sounds like you should get as far away from him
as possible, before you loose any more money.

Forget taking him to court. Get all your stuff away from him. Don't let him touch anything else. Buy a crate engine. Have a blanket party.

This thing is sounding more bizarre all the time. I'm not sure what you mean by "stole". I'm not sure about BC law, but in the US you would be obligated to pay the full amount even if you are not satisfied with the work. Has been paid in full or did you withhold part of the payment? If he has been paid in full, and actually "stole" your vehicle, you should file criminal charges. If he has not been paid, in the US he could hold the vehicle on a mechanic's lien. As for civil litigation, it would be very difficult. I have qualified as an expert witness on several occasions involving actions on extended warranties. I testified as to what is reasonable to expect as a pre-existing condition. However, in your case, you would be throwing money in a black hole. Unless you can prove criminal action, the best thing you can do is distance yourself from this guy and go on with your life.

He wouldn't be able to come and get a different vehicle, or even the original vehicle if he already surendered it to you. Even if you didn't pay him a dime. He can put a mechanics lein on it, but I don't think he can repossess it because money is owed for service.

The term "cleaned in & out, timing ect. New exhaust donuts" Boy I dunno. 1500.00 is what you said you paid him. I think that the expectations on your part are off base some maybe. If a person is hiring a legit mechanic taking about torque procedures for instance like this are not even a reality. I owned a repair shop for better than 20 years and all this brings back memories of why I sold the shop and changed careers. I'm not saying that your at fault or even that this gentleman your dealing with is all wrong. I think that everyone involved, meaning you and him should sit down with someone with some real qualifications and get a educations of terms and procedures and have him look the mess over and tell you both where you went wrong, Then maybe he'll even give you a good idea of what its going to take to put the mess back together. The facts will probably hurt and bruise your ego along with the man who did the work. Maybe both of you will come out of this far better men that when you went down this path of failure.
Good Luck

That so-caled "mechanic" needs to man up and take responcability for his mistakes. As far as I see it, he owes you a new engine, or at least a properly rebuilt (by someone that knows what they're doing) one. Then he needs to give up working on cars, as it doesn't sound like he's very good at it.
I've worked with guys that use the "calibrated eyeball" and "torque wrench arm" bits, and they like to poke fun at me for doing it right with the correct tools and procedures. But then they seem shocked when their jobs come back with loose bolts and the like, but I have 0 comebacks. Those guys usually don't last long in the business, or end up at the local lube shops.

I was told he has done this for 30 years. The shop is somewhat not registered. They,ve been in business a long time on a small island. Theres no lien against my truck,...he took it upon himself to stick another key in there till it started. He then proceeded to use it for 5 days stranding my woman who needs it for work. He was nowhere to be found. She has the truck back now finally. He STILL wants money. Unbelievable. He just don,t get it.

What tool did he use, a 3/4" breaker bar or what. Yes.
After he "tore the heads off to see the pistons",
Is that all he did was LooK. What did he say? Everything looked really good.



Yeah this is quite the gong show. Hes in denial and wants to blame me for the way I drove it. Yeah ummmm,....lets do a hole shot with a bus off the green light. He asked what did you do go up a hill ? B.C is all hills and mountains....lol. Anyways. I kept bugging him about using the torque wrench and he kept continuosly getting upset. I couldn,t stop it because I had to be in The Okanagan for Sept 1st no matter what. I guess I trusted him too much and prayed it would make it at least here. The plans were to put a new engine in it anyways. 700 miles was all I was asking this bus to make. And it cost 800 bucks to tow it.

No more excuses, now's the time!

You paid a lot for the opportunity to swap engines, I suppose all you can do at this point is move on and think about what you've learned from the episode.

Grigg

This whole saga reminds me of the sign we have all seen....

Shop Labor Rate $50/ hour

You Watch $75/ hour

You Help $100/ hour

I was told there are blown rods and the engine is scrap now. Is this true ? Thanx. Cheerz !

If you are referring to a connecting rod that is sticking out the side of the block, yes the engine is scrap.

Heads, intake, carburetor, distributor, and manifolds may be worth keeping, along with any bolt on accessories, alternator, starter, water pump..

So it's about half scrap

Grigg