The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area Engine Shop Motor Stuck-got any tricks?

Could be a bummer or a good reason to toss in something a bit bigger, I guess.

Long story short, I took the hood off my 46 1 1/2 ton to have it cleaned up. The truck sat for 9 months with it's mouth open, and now the motor won't budge. I tried Marvel mystery oil in the cylinders, no luck. Next was three cans of PB Blaster. At least I won $20 bucks, a buddy bet me it would work. Then an old guy comes up with this weird idea of filling the cylinders with diesel fuel. What's next, strawberry jam?

I tried using a breaker bar on the flywheel to move it, no luck. We even tried pulling it with my car and popping the clutch in first( going reeeallly slow), no luck. That was the one I figured would have the best chance of working. We're gonna try the last one again with another truck when it gets a bit warmer. I figure we get the two trucks up to 40 mph or so, pop the clutch on the broke one and tear the bumper off the tow truck. Then i can talk the wife into two new projects!

Any ideas or tricks appreciated. My dad back home says a five gallon can of gas and a match...

Yes, try the diesel fuel or ATF in the cylinders. Instead of popping the clutch, rock the crankshaft back and forth with the breaker bar. Don't force it or you will break a ring.

Take your time with it. Use diesel fuel, as it will soak past the rings easier than ATF will. If the head isn't off, I'd take it off. Keep the cylinders full of diesel fuel for a week or so. PB Blaster should work, but will be co$tly because you will need quite a bit of it. Then, as Josiah suggested, try rocking it. Also try your 5# sledge hammer, using a large piece of wood on top of the pistons, not getting too carried away. The 235 that was in the '51 was stuck when dad got it. He used this method, and it wound up running just fine. Just make sure the cylinders or rings aren't pitted (they shouldn't be in that short of time).

The world's best penetrating oil is Kroil, made by Kano Laboratories in Nashville, TN.

www.kanolabs.com

Get a can or two of this stuff, drain the oil out of the crankcase, and pour 3 or 4 ounces into each cylinder. Replace the spark plugs, and wait about a week. Pull the oil pan drain, and you can get almost all the Kroil out of the pan. It penetrtates the rust, and drains right past the pistons. Pour the Kroil back into the cylinders, and let it drain thru again. After a couple of these sequences, the engine should turn freely, or at least be able to be rocked free with a breaker bar or by putting the transmission in high gear and rolling the truck back and forth.
Jerry

My 53 had the same problem, the PO left the hood off for 2 years. I put a hay bale on the back, popped the clutch, nothing. Tryed diesel, help a little. Tryed penetrating oil, helped more. Removed head and whole frend end. Welded big nut onto flywheel. Played with it for a little while everyday for a week. Got it unstuck and she runs like a champ!!! also, did not have to rebore or new pistons, rings and all that stuff, just had to redo the valves. good luck

I'm not much into motors, but it looks like I'm going to be. If it comes to it, I imagine the shop manual details how to pull the head off and put it back together. Kinda weird how the hood being off caused this, I did at least tape over the intake and make sure that was sealed all the time. It's a full pressure 228, so I suppose those aren't going to be to easy to find.

Figures, a 60 year old truck that's been running the whole time, and guess who messes it up!

That oil looks great Jerry, got some on the way.

I would try soaking it a bunch more before you remove the head. It shouldn't be bound up that bad from just 9 months, unless somehow it got frozen and the block cracked (you did say you live in CO). You may want to remove the valve cover and back off on all the rocker arm adjustments just in case a valve is stuck. You don't want to break a rocker arm or bend a pushrod if you can avoid it. Put some of the penetrant on the valve stems, too.

Next time you store an engine fill the cylinders with a few teaspoons of motor oil and put the spark plugs back in to keep it from rusting up. Also, don't forget to cover the exhaust to keep vermin out. The best way to store it outside is to watch the valves and store it on a spot in the cam when they are all shut so water doesn't get in the cylinders. If you can't do that back off on the rocker arms to get them all closed. This also saves the valve springs.

My Bro-in-Law is a retired USAF Jet mechanic and jet shop boss. He always said that jet fuel is ideal for rust situations like this. It is a thin cheap oil. It is a lot less expensive than most of the p-oils mentioned in this post. The only downside is that you will have to drive to a local airport that sells jet fuel, and ask the nice man to sell you 5 gallons, instead of 500 gallons.

Jet fuel is K1 kerosene you can get it by the gallon at places like Exxon stations. or small shops that sell kerosene heaters.

super250six

Just so you don't give up, we have an old International six at our museum that we oiled and barred for 3 months before she budged.

Well, a nice day is coming tommorow, so I'm gonna play with her again. To rock the engine back and forth without taking the truck apart, do you fellas think I could take the driveshaft off and rock the yolk? What gear should it be in?

Hey Fred, I was in Salina a few days ago for a wedding, and I got to looking for a Steak n Shake. Got any there? Would have been worth the hundred miles or so. darn expensive, but good...

So, if none of this works, what motor do you guys think should go in? My Dad in Chicago has a 327 that's been worked over like crazy...puts out 425 hp, think I should try to talk him out of it? It's been on a stand for ten years. Old guy'll never use it....

Thanks for the help so far!

Rock the truck with the transmission in high gear. Any other, and you'll be losing torque by the trans trying to speed up the movement. You'll get a lot more inertia by using the weight of the truck and rolling the rear wheel, rather than trying to turn the output shaft with a bar, etc.

I've got my own little gimmick to keep an engine from freezing up when I'm storing just the engine, not the whole vehicle. Drain as much oil as possible by pulling the oil pan plug, then reinstall it and store the engine upside down. The remaining oil in the crankcase will puddle around the pistons and rings, and will keep the piston rings from rusting to the cylinders. One of my former students used to put engines in long-term storage by dismantling them, putting the parts in a 55 gallon drum with a clamp-ring top, and filling the drum with heating oil. Works for decades!
Jerry

I can't imagine what you are doing to lock up a motor after only 9 months of storage. My 62, 235 sat for 11 years, I bought it, got it restored and running, ran it for two years, then it sat for 14 years! I got it running again and it never locked up.

Was the carb off of the motor or plugs out when you left it without a hood?

They make an aerosol product called, Engine Fog, which I used on some motorcycles. You just pull the plugs and shoot a bunch of this grease inside. It coats the cylinder walls and valves. If you really want it to work, turn the motor over and shoot some more in.

I use that fogging oil for snowmobiles as well. When got my truck unseized, I tried to start it and the valves were still stuck. I bent a couple push rods. good luck.

The wife keeps telling me I'm retarded Fab, suppose she's probably right. Beats me what would cause it. Plugs were in tight, intake covered...do you think it would make a difference if it was parked on a incline nose high? When I filled the cylinders with diesel, the rearmost ones had the most brown colored overflow. Who knows.

I still use the fogging oil for storing boat outboards, I guess I should have used it on the truck too.

"Then an old guy comes up with this weird idea..."

"Old guy'll never use it...."

Not much respect for age or the knowledge gained eh..you young whipersnapper!

Been teasing my Old Man since I was old enough to. I'd better keep going, since some day (soon) it's going to catch up with me. Funny how much my Dad's learned in the last ten years. I'm awfully proud of him and how fast he grew up and came to see things my way...

i had one lock up in my drive way in two weeks it cranked over and i should have oiled the cyl. but i didnt got gas to finely pump up but it must have been water from the bottom of the tank we towed it its still froze i dumped gallons of oil in it someday ill pull the plugs and try again i couldnt believe how fast it froze up if i hadnt seen it i wouldnt believe it

Dan I had luck with the diesel fuel. filled the cylinders let it sit for abuot two weeks had a new battery on it. only had the plugs in loose. friends son's girl friend was walking by when he decided to bump starter. motor turned free and fast coated her in diesel fuel. Had to buy new outfit for her.. If your just going to hand rock it make sure the plugs are out so your not fighting the the compression. squirt penetrating oil around valve stems as welljust keep refilling cylinders with the diesel as it works pastthe pistons and give it a couple of weeks.Have a brother in law down in TN he also recomends the Kroil products mentioned by Hotrod Lincoln

I´m in the same situation pretty much,my ´51 been sitting since ´67,the cylindres were filled whith diesel by the previous owner some months ago,and I got the engine unstuck two days ago,and it turns freely,but it seems like it´s lacking compression,I ran it on the starter whithout plugs and hade some lube inthe cylinders,and put some plufs in,but it wont start,I´ve checked the timing,carb,breaker points,everything,but it only huffs a little when I use ether,on just gasoline it wont even huff,any ideas?

Swedster, pull the valve cover & check the pushrods/rockers/valves for sticking/bent parts. Brian

swedster, did you pull the head? Check the valves.

3 exhaust valves were semi stuck,so i bent one pushrod,but I´ve fixed that,all valves moves freely,and I straightened the pushrod,I changed all wiring to the distrbtr too,and it huffs some,but now the starter "freewheels" when it makes a couple off huffs in a row,so I´m taking the starter down tomorrow,to clean the freewheel function,I guess there´s a correct english word for it ;o)anyway,what kind of comp pressure would I expect from a 216 anyway?I think I´ll borrow a comp tester too,so I know where I´m at.
and no,I haven´t removed the head yet,it´s a little tricky to get a head gasket over here on a short notice,but that´s my next move.
btw,I got a couple of huffs this after noon whith gasoline.

If your get a compression tester, get one that screws in, not one that you have to hold with the rubber thing...it will give your a better reading

It's amazing how much diesel the motor will accept. Still not budging, but I have faith! I pulled the plugs for the third time and filled em up. Going to try to tugboat it along on Saturday. I've got to get it to downtown Denver, so I figure a few hours and I can get it twenty miles. It really needs to move from its present storage site...

Don't get tempted to cram it in gear and pop the clutch while you're towing. You can break axles, strip gears, bend connecting rods and/or pushrods, and generally make a melluva hess!
Jerry

DanS, did you get your motor unstuck yet? I got my 1952 235 unstuck after about a week and got it running today. My motor had not run for 20 years and even the carb was froze up. I used marvel mystery oil all over everything for about a week. I pulled the valve cover off and squirted this oil on all the rocker arms and valve stems. after a couple of days I used a small hammer and tapped on all the rocker arms to make sure that they were free and boped the top of each valve to make sure the valves were not stuck and oiled them down again. I had all the spark plugs out and kept squirting oil into each cylinder on a daily basis. After a week of oiling I took the flywheel cover off and used two screw driver prybars and engaged them into each side of the flywheel and I was finally able to start rocking the flywheel back and forth from side to side. After about an hour of rocking I was able to turn the motor over one tooth at a time for a couple of revolutions. I reoiled everything again and put in a charged up battery and turned the engine over serveral times. I turned the engine over like this for the next two days while I replaced the fuel pump and straightned out the distributor and wires and got the carb to free up. The compression was anywhere from 30psi to 70 psi, far short of the orginial 110psi called for but it did finally start and smoked me out of the barn. I let the motor run and get real warm twice today and the longer it ran the smoother it got with less oil smoke. I just had to drive it out of the barn and around the 10 acres for the heck of it. This truck was one of those ran when I parked it deals, but i dought it because the dist was off one tooth and the plug wires were not in the right sequence and no gas line to the tank. Never take anything for granted, check everything.
Jamo

Here's some techniques my (old) uncles have used on the old tractors they would unstick. My one uncle took an old spark plug and hollowed all of the ceramic out of it and welded in a grease zerk. He then filled a cylinder with oil (with the valves closed) and started pumping oil through the zerk-equipped plug until he felt movement or felt damage may occur with more pressure. He would work at it for days if the engine was stuck bad.

My other uncle made an adapter for the sparkplug hole to fit his hydraulics from his tractor. He would hook up one cylinder at a time until the cylinder would move and then go to the next one .The last one you would have to stand back. When the last one broke loose, oil blew everywhere when the engine spins over.

These methods were done on tractors, I definately would'nt do the second one on a truck/car engine. The first one seems more controlled though, and maybe worth a try someday.
Scott

Still stuck last week, but there has to be five gallons of diesel in the cylinders. One thing that's hurting is that I can't get underneath it and get enough leverage on the flywheel. I'm going to try this weekend pulling it twenty miles to downtown Denver to a building I've got and see about playing with it again. On the other hand, I sure would like to get it in the garage here...maybe I can sneak it under the wifey's nose.

One more suggestion- - - - -Take the starter off, and use a long pry bar on the flywheel teeth through the starter mounting hole. Just be careful and don't break the teeth off! I've used a construction crowbar as a flywheel turner. The angle on the straight end of the bar, and the chisel shape on the end fit a flywheel just right.
Jerry

Thanks Jerry, the leverage from underneath just wasn't happening, I was kicking a socket wrench that I had jammed up in a hole in the flywheel, but didn't feel like I was doing much. Your idea should be a whole lot better!

this isn't much help, but its been known that coca-cola will unseize a stuck engine. that trick has been used quite a bit on old tractors around here. also, i've heard that Oil of Mint..or something like that, works quite well too. just my 2 cents worth.

.later days.
.desperado.
.sam.

i find that the diesel fuel anti- gel works good.the guy that suggested that you rock it back and forth sounds good.i've dragged them down the road in 4th gear. i had a 40 pickup that the hood had been off for 20 -plus years. i took off the carb and removed spark plugs and let it sit about a week. then took a long pipe on the breaker bar and rocked it. the truck still runs. good luck

I have used diesel followed by a penetrating fluid called Lloyds 'Moovit'. A squirt of Moovit through the spark plug hole every day for two weeks then I use a socket wrench to turn over the engine.

In my 1954 235.5cid engine I could used a 3/4" drive socket wrench and got the engine to turn over. (I inserted where a hand crank would attach, earlier truck engines have a different connection so this particular socket-wrench method will not work).

I have to agree with HotRod Lincoln about pull starting. I rebuilt the engine in a 1962 Austin Healey Sprite, the only engine I've ever rebuilt, so far, and it seemed awfully tight when I was done. Over time I replaced the battery and starter and it still didn't turn over. The crankshaft hub nut was accessible, so I put a torque wrench on it. It took 62 ft/lbs of torque to turn it over. The starter motor was rated at 50 ft/lbs.

So we decided to pull start it. As soon as I let the clutch out, at about 10 miles per hour, the rear end broke.

This finally got me started looking for the real problem. I pulled the engine and found that I had installed all three main bearing caps backwards. I punched marks in the caps when I took the out, but no matching marks in the block. Kind of like finding that great fishing spot and putting a mark on the side of the boat so you can find it again.

Reversed the caps and re-installed the engine. It took about 6 ft/lbs of torque to turn over. It started up find and immediately blew the oil filter off. I had decided to save $1.34 by not replacing the oil pressure relief piston.

Got that straightened out but still couldn't drive it because of the rear end.

I learned a lot from that car.

I did a test a while back with a stuck engine by using different types of lubricants. I posted teh results in the stovebolt pages somewhere.

What I found and will swear by today is KROIL. I also used it on my IRWIPI trip and that really made a believer out of me. Many people on this forum will swear by it too.

When I got home from the trip, I bought a case of it. Here is the web page for KROIL.

http://www.kanolabs.com/

KROIL...KROIL...KROIL....KROIL....KROIL...KROIL

try iodine

Try GIBBS. Good stuff!
www.getgibbs.com
Marty

check old postings i had a stuck 250 motor i had to pull the head and hit the top of each piston with a block of wood and a slug hammer 2x it loosened the motor i took each piston down and cleaned the cylinder walls its running now!

I just noticed that, too, Joe. Who dredged this up, anyway? I was about to post the same response as you did.

Let's not live in the past guys. Oh, wait. That's what this hobby's all about, huh?