The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area Engine Shop Jumped Time?

I have no previous history on this truck as I just recently bought it. It's a '59 with a 235 truck motor (solid lifters). Motor was stuck, I filled the cylinders with penetrating oil several times over a span of about a week to ten days. I then put it in 3rd gear and rocked it until broke free. Turns out that it also had 3 stuck exhaust valves which bent the push rods.

I pulled the head and had it rebuilt by a reputable automotive machine shop. It now has all new exhaust valves with hardened seats. All new valve guides and seals, the intakes valves and seats were ground. I took my time putting it back together and installed new plugs, wires, cap, rotor and points.

It has good spark, and it's getting fuel, but it just won't start. That's even after priming the carb with gas and trying starting fluid. I have double and triple checked just about everything else (firing order etc). I even by-passed the ignition switch by running a hot wire straight to the coil just in case the wiring in the dash was causing problems.

Is it possible that it could have jumped time when I broke it loose? It doesn't act like it even wants to start. Right now I'm suspecting a bad timing gear, but don't want to pull the cover unless I'm a little more certain.

Any thoughts on this?

John

John,

How did you set the timing?
You might want to check the timing again. Rotate the engine until the ball on the flywheel lines up with the pointer on the clutch housing - make sure both #1 valves are closed (open lash - rocker arms loose).

What is the firing-order of your ignition wires (clockwise rotation)?

Where are you observing "good spark"? At the spark plugs?

It is easy to check cam timing.
When number one is firing the number six exhaust valve should be just closing and the intake should be just starting to open. At this point the rotor should be pointing to the number one plug wire and the ball/BB on the flywheel should be close to the timing pointer.

I never had the distributor out. It supposedly was running when parked by the last owner.
Good spark was observed at (and through) the #1 spark plug. Firing order is clockwise from number one. I have even tried rotating the wires on the cap one peg each way.
Tomorrow I'll check cam timing as you both suggested.

Thanks

John

Timing gears rarely jump, no chain in that engine. If the gears jump, you have a major problem.

Like the guys above said, pull the valve cover and rotate the engine watching the #1 valves or pull the #1 plug and hold your finger over the hole till you feel compression. Once compression comes up, watch the for the timing marks to align. This is where the rotor and #1 wire should be aligning.

Keep rotating the engine till the timing marks are in in alignment. Ground out number #1 spark plug with the wire attached. Loosen the distributor hold down enough to rotate the housing with out pulling it out.

Turn the ignition on but don't rotate the engine. With ignition on, twist the distributor housing back and forth watching for spark at the plug you have grounded. Keep twisting till you narrow in on the spark, you should be able to get really close to right on the mark.

Lock the distributor back down, install the plug, and see if it will start. Timing should be with a degree or two.

Joe

On my 216 I can remove the oil filler cap and watch the valves on #1 Cylinder. I find that very handy for installing the distributor.

One thing I will mention is this make sure you are looking at the timing mark on the Flywheel through the correct inspection hole. I speak from experience. The timing mark is to be viewed thru the inspection hole on the passenger side. There is one on both sides of the engine. It took me a couple of days of trying to start my truck to realize I was looking at the wrong viewing hole. I know I am not the only one and I won't be the last. Good luck to you.

The timing checked out fine, with the flywheel dot on the pointer both valves on #1 were fully closed and the rotor was pointing directly at #1 plug wire. Tried again to start but it didn't even pop.

At least one more possibility eliminated.

Thanks for the info

John

I would try another new set of spark plugs.
I can't explain it but sometimes when plugs get flooded with gas they will never work again. I have been where you are and new plugs did the trick.

Ever wash something with gas? We all have. Ever let it dry and see how much "film" is left on it? That film is conductive. Made up of left over hydrocarbons. Not burned off ash. Carbon is a conductor. All it needs to be is fewer ohms than the air gap at the plug and voltage will follow it to ground and not jump across the plug gap. The path of least resistance don't care about distance. From the center electrode to the ceramic to the shell. Less ohms is all it wants. Try some new plugs like Dave said. After it starts you can put them in one at a time and they will get better. Then you have a spare set. Yes I am cheap. That is not a crime.

check your compression, make sure your valves aren't too tight, etc. Pretty sure you'd know if your cam was broke too,
Scott

Dave, Steve and Scott,

Good idea, I just might pick up another set of plugs in KC. The plugs are new, but they came with the truck. Anyway, it can't hurt.

The valves I purposely set loose (cold engine) .010 intake and .020 for the exhaust. I noticed that the carb is seeping gas so I pulled it off tonight. After KC I'll give it a good going through. Heck, maybe I'll just bring it with me, buy a kit and rebuild it on a picnic table at the show.

Anyway, I'm done with it for now until after "Bolt Fest" as I have some outdoor chores to do before leaving for KC.

Thanks

John