The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area Engine Shop No spark

No spark on my 59' 1/2ton. I have replaced my dead 59' 235 with one out of a 55'. My first install so I'm hoping I have something hooked up wrong...

Starter: violet wire to side port, black wire from fire wall to main port, battery to main port

Coil: Green wire from fire wall to coil (+), black wire to dist from (-) coil...

[img]http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a8/1tractorboy/starterhookup.jpg?t=1165859528[/img]


[img]http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a8/1tractorboy/coilhookup.jpg?t=1165859680[/img]

tractorboy,

Sometimes wires are switched or replaced, so I am not sure how relevant color would be.

Without a voltage tester you are flying blind. The small wire on the side of the starter switch should terminate on a ballast resistor along with the wire leading FROM/TO the + side of the coil.

Some wire should exit the firewall and attach to the other side of the ballast resistor.

Remove the anti-static capacitor until you get things worked out. With the key on and the points closed, you should see around 12 volts to ground on both sides of the ballast resistor AND the + and - side of the coil.


This is a little more involved than just putting brown here and pink there, but it is the proper way to do it.

I don't know if rigs of your era had resistance wires from key switch to coil, but I don't think so...I think you should have a firewall mounted ceramic ballast resistor in line to the coil.

Stuart

The violet wire should go from the starter side terminal to the + side of the coil so that's wrong but it should run without that anyway. Turn the key on and see if a bulb will light when grounded and touching the coil + terminal. Here's a 1955 wiring diagram that should be close enough.

http://chevy.tocmp.com/1955truck2shop/55ctsm1202.htm

Try to post in the electrical forum for this stuff and going thru the archives there should help you get every wire in it's place. Good luck.

Curt B.

Sorry about this list of questions but I'm pretty ignorant on this stuff..

I do have power on both sides of coil as well as bottom of dist but will find out the voltage as you suggested...however, I know not a thing about points...how to tell if they are closed?

Also...where is that ballast resistor located? If I have one,its on the interior side.

last but not least....what is the aniti-static capacitor on the coil for? Radio?

Pull the distributor cap to see if the points are open or closed. Turn the engine over by hand with the ignition off and you will see the points opening and closing. If the wire from the starter goes to the distributor, it will keep the engine from starting; it must go to the + coil terminal. With the points closed you will read about eight volts on the + coil terminal and zero volts on the - coil terminal with the ignition on and a ballast resitor or resistance wire to the ignition switch in the system. Both coil terminals will read twelve volts with the points open.

The capacitor on the coil is for radio interference.

tractorboy,

Edit my post to indicate what Baldy stated about points open/closed while reading coil voltage...I'm still struggling on this concept!

Keep in mind that the points are the switch that make the coil fire the plugs. Everything can be wired properly to the distributor, but if the 'switch' isn't opening/closing properly, then the plugs will never see a big ZAP.

A down and dirty test is to pull a plug wire and hold it slightly off a good ground while a friend turns on the key and cranks the engine over. You should see electricity jump the small gap as the plug fires.

This basic test tells you that system is intact, although it might need some fine tuning.

Stuart

That clears it up to me...I never really knew what the points did...points may be my problem...If I remember correctly, when I tested the coil (-) side, I had a solid light while the wife hit the foot switch...the light should blink off and on if the points are opening and closing??? right??

tractorboy,

I'm a little hinky to answer this outright, so I will say, I 'think' this test might be marginal. Your light might not be a good indicator of what is happening.

Grab your wife again and do the plug to ground ZAP test! This is a go/no go deal!

If you have a gap gauge, it isn't difficult to just set the points and take them out of the equation.

You might do a search in this forum..use the little 'search' icon at the upper right hand side of this page. Type in a phrase like...'points' or 'how to set points' or 'setting points'...you get the idea.

Stuart

Correct. Put a screwdriver on the points with the key on. You should get a a small spark around the points when you short across them. Each time you break the circuit you should get a spark out of the coil. If you can,t get it started let me know. I might be able to come over & help you. [email protected]

Engine grounded?

Thanks guys..thanks Wrenchbender..this is the one I bought from ya...points look new??

I did a few more checks...I also backed the points out a bit to what I called .016...this I did in "closed" position...

...with the small dist wire (from coil) removed and with the test light clip on the main starter post- I did not get a light when I touched the point wire or coil side points. I did get a light when I touched the backing plate and the point which is connected to the backing plate. I did get a spark between the points when I closed the gap with the tester needle... The light produced by the backing plate remained solid during engine turn over...I then unhooked the condenser and tried again but nothing changed..

...the opposite happens with the small coil wire hooked back up and the test light clip on the frame...I get a solid light at the coil side point but nothin on the plate side...

To answer your question Beaver...I'm not sure about anything at this point : ) I do have the ground strap from the starter to the firewall as well as the cable from (-) battery to the firewall. I also tried a jumper cable clamped to the frame and engine with no change to the test above....

tractorboy,

Whenever I use a voltage tester, I attach the wire with the clip to a good ground, and probe for voltage with the sharp, pokey end. This tells me the connection I have touched has voltage to it.

Using it with the clip to a power source will indicate the point probed has a path to ground. I don't think this is what you need to prove.

Have I misunderstood how you have the tester hooked up?

Stuart

Ok...sitting here at work thinking....I think my points were not closing all the way before I adjusted them and I know they are not closing all the way now...I'll try re-adjusting them tonight.


Ato...I was trying to follow a test from an old post...cant seem to find the exact one now...

Adjust the points with the point cam follower at one of the high points on the cam. I wondered if you had not done that when I read your penultimate post.

Baldy,

Penultimate! Not bad...one could go a long time without seeing that word.


Ato

once you get it going, you should check the dwell angle.this checks the amount of time the points are open.You will need a meter for that, i'm not shure where you get them anymore.I have three of them that i get from garage sales and places like that.I use them often,one at work, one at home, one at the cabin.There are many motors around yet with points but not alot of people set the dwell on them. it makes them run a bit better as the time the points are open changes things.Tom

K.I.S.S. Run a jumper wire from the positive battery post to the + on coil--wiring complete. Pull coil wire from distributer cap and hold 1/4" from ground, if it arcs spark problems in wiring, if it doesn't problems in distributer.

Ok...I reset the points...still nothing...so I worked the point arm back and forth with a screwdriver and forced it to close...I had spark !!...got all excited and quickly tried for fire but lost spark after a couple tries...I then cleaned the arm pivit and the actual points....I seem to have consistant spark now .... Still working on fire however : (

What is your point gap? What type of plug and what are they gapped at?

I am assuming that you replaced the condensor along with the points. Just for giggles, put in the old condensor and try it again.

Have you tried a different coil. When you get that spark at the points you should get a spark out of the coil at the same time. Also check your coil wire. Some of those resister wires can have excess resistance.

Thanks everyone for taking time to help out. I have learned a great deal from you guys... I think I have good spark now...I'm currently dealing with no fire (no engine start), ...I think this is due to flooding from the carb...having hard time finding someone to rebuild mine so I might just go buy a "new" one form Chevy Duty

Thats a very impressive list Builder... Love those Fleetside 3200s...cant wait to get mine going...besides getting the motor running, I only lack bending the newly installed T5 shifter and installing the freshly cut drive shaft...

Also still trying to decide on wheels
[img]http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a8/1tractorboy/wheelcheck.jpg?t=1166071557[/img]

[img]http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a8/1tractorboy/motor.jpg?t=1166071710[/img]

Beautiful truck ya' got there Tractorboy!

Bring it over Tractorboy I,ll rebuild it. George

Not trying to be funny, but is the rotor OK and installed? Had a guy call me once, same problem. He pulled /pushed that truck for miles. Came to me, I went down to look at it and saw the rotor laying on the work bench. ZOOM ZOOM ZOOM.

Thanks for your offer Wrenchbender....Update...Today was the day!!!...Bought a new carb- messed around with it for a couple hours with no fire...decided everything looked right but since I dont understand points - I decided to mess with them again...man those thing are touchy!!..I moved them a hair in what must have been the correct direction...motor fire right up and purrs...its a beautiful thing!!! Also have been messing with the heater in my down time - it even works now!!!!!!

Not out of the garage yet however...please check out my question on the T5/clutch