The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area General Truck Talk ride quality

....looking for general thoughts as to why my '47 1/2 ton rides like a lumber wagon. I thought the rough ride was due to straight axle / leaf springs but then realized that modern Jeeps (CJ, YJ etc) all use the same style front suspension. And most modern 1 tons use straight axles and they all seem to ride smoothly. So any thoughts as to how to soften up my stock suspension would be welcome.

you might consider installing new shocks, removing some leaves from the springs, or getting new after market springs, or installing a better seat, but mostly these old trucks do ride pretty rough, especially short beds, and particularly unloaded .... depends on your expectations and what you're comparing to, forget about "modern" anything

Bill

Mine got really rough and twitchy, even with new shocks and two leaves removed from all four packs, when I pulled all the old bed wood, strips, etc, out. It was probably at it's smoothest when I was transporting a 12A Wankel and manual trans out of an '83 RX7 ... added maybe 450lbs to the bed.

If you are looking for a "new" truck ride, then you need to swap out the suspension. Otherwise enjoy the ride for what it is - an old truck.

My 53' 3100 rides quite well I think. All that has been done is basically to use radial tires. They make an amazing difference. In fact I would call it cushy.

The reason for the "lumber wagon" ride might be the lever action shocks used in 1947. Modern tubular shocks were not introduced on these trucks until 1950. I have both, a 1947 and a 1953, and my '53 rides much smoother, even with 16" bias tires.

http://s1291.photobucket.com/user/RdLessTaken/library/RdLessTaken%20Trucks

I have a "modern" jeep Cherokee and it rides like a lumber wagon. I have a 50 AD with radial tires, stock suspension, stock seat and the ride isn't that much worse than the Cherokee. I agree that the factory seat is a very important part of the quality of the ride. The bounce that you get from these trucks is very nicely moderated by the spring action of these seats. Kind of like the complex shock absorbing seats in modern big rigs.

Compare the weight of your truck to a modern truck with the same type suspension and you will see why the new ones ride better. Yours will carry the same load weight but total truck weight is a lot less.

Mine rides better with teflon liner in the leaf springs, modern soft tube shocks, and factory seat.

Add sand bags to the bed and see how it rides.

Joe

Joe has a point about using teflon liners between the spring leaves. A friend of mine put liners between the springs on his truck and if I put my foot on his bumper and push down real quick, the truck squats two or three inches and returns real smooth, more like a modern car. If I push down on my truck it's like the thing is sitting on concrete blocks. Both our trucks are the same with original springs.

I don't think he ever figured out why I kept bouncing his truck. Just kept giving me a funny look

Can anyone show a photo of the teflon liners in the leaf springs? Not sure where to get them or what they look like.

looks like what it's called

Bill

I really am a rookie - thanks!

I have a 1951 3600 and Its all stock. I just cleaned up the the leaf springs and joints really good in the rear. Greased everything back up and I can tell the rear end is much more functional. Not so stiff. Tomorrow I am taking off the original tires and having them replaced. In the mean time I will be Cleaning up the leaf springs and joints in the front. Installing new shocks. Once I get everything back together Ill let you no if there is any major improvement. If you haven't done so already Its worth a shot!

Justin

http://s272.photobucket.com/user/ju...y%203600/photo1.jpg.html?sort=6&o=10

Justin, I just looked at your truck and that’s one of the most original appearing 3104’s
that I’ve seen. That’s quite unusual since most of the mid-sized trucks were used pretty
hard. Many of the 3104s seem to have had an easier time of it.
That’s the only 216 that I’ve seen in recent years that seems to have what appears to be
its factory paint still intact and I’ve been lookin’ at them for about a couple of decades
now. I don’t know if you are aware of it but that is extremely rare. Every one of the
unrestored 216 engines that I’ve seen is missing all of the original paint. I’ve only seen a
few chips of the original dark gray paint that hadn’t been washed or blasted off. The
original gray color is a subject of major discussion on any old truck forum that I’ve ever
been on. You really should carefully clean it up and take a bunch of well-lit photos of it
for documentation purpose.
If that truck hasn’t been restored and that’s the original paint on it and on the engine I’m
sure there are a bunch of us purists here that would be forever grateful if you would post
a few more detailed pictures of the engine compartment when it’s cleaned up. The
original belt line stripe is often in question also as far as its width and placement.
I’m thrilled to see it, can you tell?
Thanks
Denny Graham
Somewhere north of Sandwich, IL

Justin and Denny -

I'm getting off of the original subject of ride quality, but I agree with Denny's assessment of a beautiful original truck. I would like to see as many pictures of it as you want to post.

Maybe some of us can send you some paint samples from the various manufacturers of Chevrolet Gray Engine Paint so that you can compare them with your engine. Then we can have our own "Stovebolt Approved" paint for early AD truck engines. We'll let the VCCA sort out the question on their own time! I'll make a sample of the gray from The Filling Station for you.

I believe that is also the original fuel line to the carb. You can see how it was re-bent to install the Durex 986640 gas filter - which is correct for 1951. The installer used two 90-deg fittings instead of straight into the carb from the pump and a 60-deg at the carb as specified by GM. It was probably cut on the other end to install the new fuel pump. You may not need the additional filter before the fuel pump.
> Justin - I can send you a pattern to cut a new cork gasket for the filter. Send me a PM with your email address.

Also, note the decal on the oil bath air filter. It is curved and orange colored instead of the rectangular decal pictured in numerous Chev accessories books.
> My quest for a decal

What is on the inner fender next to the replacement fuel pump?

Thanks for sharing your pics.

I drove a 59 today and discovered what I like so much about these trucks. The ride and looking over that hood an fenders, a truck that actually looks and feels like a truck. I love it.
No need for power steering on them, less maybe its a 2.5 ton with a max load on it.

Thanks Denny and Lonnie

Yeah its all original. I love driving it to. Its awesome. Its cool to when people are beeping the horn at me, thumbs up peace sign lol. The old school feel makes it fun. My grandfather did touch up the rear end years ago but other then that its truly a time capsule. Really no rust anyware. Like I said in another post you guys really made me realize today how fortunate I am. I wish my grandfather was around so I could show him your guys reply's on the forum today. My grandfather has always been about keeping it all original and was so proud of his truck. Today I took off the tires and rims and dropped those off to get replaced. Should I keep the original tires? told the guy I would. Everything under the truck, motor etc is all pretty much coated with grease from over the years. Not sure if Im really gonna mess with things and cleaned it all up. Believe it or not the grease is actually helping preserve everything. I wasn't even aware of the painted gray motor. I cleaned up a little spot today out of curiosity and your right. Its a dull looking gray. I will defiantly take a bunch of pics and post for you guys with a real camera. Ive been just using the camera on my cell phone. Everybody has been very helpful here and I would love to return the favor matching paint etc for you guys, thats the least I can do lol. Over the years everyone was trying to buy the truck off my Grandfather. They always said he wanted to much. In his eyes it was worth a fortune lol. To me its priceless! I will have it till the day I go! lol

Thanks Justin, some good shots of that engine would really be helpful in settling the
"What was the original color of a Stovebolt engine" debate that has gone on forever.
You're quite correct in your observation of the grease preserving the unseen parts of your
truck. When you get it all cleaned up, that's when you will start to see old man rust lift his
ugly head, that is, if you don't get some paint over it right away. Other than the engine
paint, the entire driveline and front axle came from the factory un-painted, they were just
bare metal.
There are many different views about how an original vehicle should be handled. At one
end there are those that believe they should be left completely as is with the dings, dents,
rust and all. At the other end are guys that want to restore them back to the showroom
condition. I'm sort of in the later group, I like the things that I own to look nice. Not to
mean that I want them to be concourse show quality but as it would have been in the day
if it was a well cared for vehicle in regular daily use.
Whatever direction you decide to go in please make a point to document with as many
photos as you can what it was like originally before you make any changes. And don’t
Bogart those pictures only to show them to family and close friends. Pass them around
and share them with the rest of the world so they can see what original really looked like.
Denny Graham
Sandwich, IL

The excitement is almost contagious.

No offense to anyone searching for the holy grail: finding the one and true engine color. Many of us have read "depositions" from people who have found the one and true 216/235 truck engine color. They state that they found their one and true engine color on an unmolested engine (some found that color many years ago, when the color would have been much less distorted by the age of another 20 years).

Only a few of those people have recognized the most likely truth: there is not a one and true 216/235 truck engine number. There were probably many shades of gray/blue and gray:

- There is a possibility (speculation?) that the new high-pressure truck 235 was honored/differentiated with a different shade of gray (the new high-pressure Blue Fame Six 235 was differentiated from earlier low-pressure car 235s).

- There is also the common-sense and expert knowledge that the engine plants would most likely not be exceptionally careful regarding the mixing of engine paint (see the italicized paragraph by this person/expert who had observed engine paint colors on many unmolested engines in collector-vehicles).

So, a new paint-color belief may arise from the observation of a 62 year old engine. This is fine, but it will become boring seeing/reading this one revelation being used as proof of the the existence of a one and true 216/235 truck engine color - a color that people will then argue was used methodically, if not religiously, on all 1937-1953 216 engines and on all 1941-1953 low-pressure truck 235 engines and on all 1954-1963 high-pressure 235 truck engines.

Yes, seeing is believing. But, the belief derived from this sight should be that this engine was painted this color (and probably, other 216 and older 235 engines engines were painted that color, at least that day, and perhaps over a longer period).

Take a sample of the color of this engine and send it to Chevs of the 40s, Bill Hirsch, Jim Carter, and Robert Hensel, and tell them you have have found the correct one and true 216/235 stove-bolt truck-engine gray. Please report back with what replies you receive.

Getting back to the ride,

greasing the springs is only a short term fix. It won't take long for it to squish out and go back to a stiff ride. Mine lasted about a year. Most old spring shops can punch a small hole in the end of each leaf for teflon pucks, or like I did, you can add the full length teflon liner. Cars from the late '30s use grease on the springs. They had the whole setup wrapped in burlap then sheet metal. It all kept the dirt out and grease in, there might have been grease fittings on them to add more. If you choose the liner, the lips face down to shed water. Hunt through street rod parts suppliers, Speedway is pretty cheap place to look, as most of them sell it. Its not just a truck item.

I have read on this site of guys using spray on teflon or graphite to coat the springs with good results. No any industrial coaters?

Joe

I have taken the spring paks apart and ground out the steps worn in to them with a disc grinder. Then painted the spring leaves with POR 15 and greased and assembled them. Seemed to help the ride.
Cleon

From Eaton Detroit Spring, Inc.: Tech Question - Leaf Lubricant, Leaf Liners & Tip Inserts

As far as clean and restoration, and how some say leave it alone etc. No matter what, the rust needs to be stopped. I know its arguable but the factory didn't purposely add rust to any parts, and rust does not make it original. There are cast iron lookalike paints available to keep the cast iron look and protect from rust. What is needed is some good old factory photos of the assembly line, I have seen some at swap meets etc.

Yes, let's do stay on topic. Please discuss the engine color in the engine shop.

Thanks