The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area Engine Shop Wheels wheels wheels...what are split rims?

Newbie question here...but it seems there are different uses of the word 'split' on the internet.

What are split rims and how do I identify them?
Will my '65 C30 1ton have split rims? (They look funky to me, but then they are also dually wheels.)

Also, can I get 8 bolt replacements from a junk yard?
What measurements do I need to worry about?

Lastly, can the bolts on my hub/drum/thingy be replaced? (They are really rusty to the point that they last turns of thread [near hub] are rusted off) I don't feel like trusting them.

All of these questions seem to impact my moving forward with the work on the brakes. Don't want to rebuild the brakes if I am going to have to do something drastic with the wheels/drums/etc.

(Please tell me something that isn't scary... )

Dave

Hy sablesurfer," split rims " is a term that refers to wheels which are not one piece, they can be two piece, or three piece, or split in the center. As to your wheel mounting studs, yes you can get new ones, take a sample with you to a good parts store and they match them up for you. Non split wheels are available for that bolt pattern, I believe in at least three sizes 16", 16.5", and 19.5", hope that helps.

Split rims have a completely removable outer rim on the outside face of the wheel. It is designed to be pried off of the rest of the wheel after the tire is deflated. This way the tire is easily slid off or on to the main part of the wheel with out having to pry it over the rim. It is really handy for extremely stiff heavy duty tires.

Be VERY CAREFUL with split rims. The down side is that the split rim its self can explosively blow off of the wheel while the tire is being inflated if the split rim is not perfectly seated in its grove. People have been killed by these. There are other threads here discussing this aspect.

I just went to my local tire place to have the ancient rubber of my original split rims removed.
Turns out they don't really like to do it, because it can be dangerous and very time consuming with old rubber.
So they only do it charging by the hour...

I also spoke to the guy in the back and he wasn't too happy about it either, showing me the super-heavy duty rig that is used to get the tires off of split rims.

Guess, I will be selling them with the tires included.

Most tire shops won't touch split rims anymore, too much liability, and ther just isn't enough of them on the road now to justify having the equipment, unless it's a shop that does alot of big rigs and construction trucks. Like Kip said, not very safe to work on. You actually should only inflate them in a certified explosion proof cage.

Split rims are not only dangerous when changing tires on the rim but can be dangerous when fully inflated and on a moving vehicle. I had a friend get hit by one that the ring flew off of when the truck he was standing next to spun a wheel in some mud. If he hadn't put his arm up it would have taken his head off. Luckily he only got a broke arm out of the deal!

Bring 'em on over. I'll do them for you!

A local Les Schwab truck center did mine, no questions asked. They even sold me a decent set of tubes/tires when I 1st got my truck. I have since had new wheels custom built with my centers by Stockton Wheel so I can run good radials and still use my hubcaps.

Do splits only use tubed tires?

(I still not sure what I have on my truck.)

My current tires say they are tubless.

Dave

Sablesurfer,

Go to http://www.accuridewheels.com/safety_manual.asp
and click on Section IV. It has some good pictures and text to help you identify if you are running one of the several types of older model split rims. ( There are modern rims that some people call split rims, but they are actually multi-piece rims that are designed completely different than the classic "widowmakers" )

Another way to check is to look at the valve stem. If it is press fit into the rim, it is likely tubeless. If it is poking out through a hole or slot slightly larger than the stem, it is running a tube. Some tubes also use a knurled nut around the stem to tighten it to the rim.

Also, most modern tires are classified as tubeless and are stamped as such. This doesn't mean that you can't use a tube and mount it on a tube type rim. (Heck, if you wanted to, you could pull the valve stem from a modern rim and run a tube. I've done it in a pinch.)

The problem with using a tube at highway speeds is that it generates more heat than a tubeless tire alone.

Post up some close up pics, that will help us help you too.

My local Les Schwab did mine too. They even put on tires that weren't theirs. They charged a flat fee and it was well worth it.

This was on my 1 1/2 ton which doesn't go over 50 mph.

I used tubes as my old rims certainly wouldn't be airtight.

Also forgot to mention that Les Schwab had 8 bolt modern steal rims in stock. These allow for modern, easy to get tubless tires. I'm thinking of getting these, powder coating them, and putting them on my 46 1 ton.

I have been looking for 8-hole wheels that will fit my 3/4 ton. I found some Chev wheels from a 60's or 70's Suburban. They fit fine except the clearance on the back side won't clear the tie rods. The rear wheels fit fine. A friend of mine gave me some cut-outs from two 8-hole chev rims that I can mount on the hubs before putting the Suburban wheels on. These should clear the tie rods, but I need to be sure the studs are long enough to accommodate the extra plate and the wheel. I have a local Les Schwab and will be checking with them as well, but I am curious as to whether you are going to have trouble with clearance on the back side with the Les Schwab rims. I had seen some black Daytona wheels in the LMC catalog awhile back with 8-holes, but they are no longer advertised.

Ok...pics

http://www.voiceinthewild.com/graphics/wheel.jpg

Are these split rims?

Now, as for my question about the bolts on the hub/drum

http://www.voiceinthewild.com/graphics/hub_drum.jpg

The bolts are pretty rusty. Also, they have that flat part so they aren't studs that screw in. Can the bolts be replaced?

Thanks

They could very well be two piece rims. There is no doubt that they are tube type rims. There is one way to tell easily on that type of rim if it is split. There is a lip on the outermost edge, from there it recesses toward the inside of the rim and meets the next lip. Scrape the paint off where that recess meets the next raised rim. If it is one piece, the metal will be smooth in the transition to the lip. If it is split, there will be a valley or obvious joint.

For the wheel studs, you can drive them out with a hammer, a brass drift or a press. Insert the new studs in from the back, spin a lug nut on, tighten it down and it will draw the new stud into the hub.

Good news on the studs!!
Thanks

Put a stack of flat washers under the nut before you draw them in. That'll save damage to the nut by acting as a thrust washer.

that accurride site is pretty good last section has tire to wheels size charts.

MNSmith i take it your in MN? where abouts i have 6 rims i need broke down so i can blast them and repaint, then mount new hoops for them

Yes, those are split-type rims with tubes. Another way to tell is to look at the inside of the rim, behind the flange where the lug bolts attach the wheel to the hub. If it's a classic multi-piece rim, that area will be straight, with no drop-center for the tire bead to go into while mounting the tire on the rim. A lot of the older trucks have brake drums big enough that a drop-center rim won't fit over the drum unless you go to a much larger tire size, like replacing a 16" tube-type wheel with a 17.5" tubeless tire.

There's nothing wrong with those wheel studs. Give the rusty section a good shot of PB blaster or Liquid Wrench and spin the nuts on and off a few times. They're not deteriorated enough to weaken them at all.

Find a good big-truck tire shop, and they'll probably work on those rims with no complaints. If there's a farmers' Co-Op with a tire shop in your area, they are probably accustomed to working with split rims as a matter of routine. It's the big-city tire shop wimps who have to sit down to pee who get all flustered about sectional rims. Us farm boys and/or big-truck guys don't have a problem with real truck tires!
Jerry

whereI live, split rims are illegal

sablesurfer,,i run splits on several of my trucks. cross midwest tire in north kc works on them all the time. i think they even like them.

Hey....coolness.
I may swing by there to get some input. Nice to hear of something in the northland.

:^)