The Stovebolt Site Forums The Parking Lot Tons 'o Fun Single wheels for '57 3800

I'm going to convert my '57 one ton to single wheels. I haven't yet found any 19.5's but I'm still looking. I know where I can get some 16's but I know there may be issues with clearance in the front. I've read somewhere that the backspace needs to be checked to make sure they'll work. Can someone tell me what the backspace dimension should be to fit correctly? Any help will be appreciated.

Jeff

I would think the best approach would be to swap front hubs to the single wheel type. Then the backspace dimension needed would probably be the same as the 19.5 inch wheels you're likely to find.

My '55 1st GMC single wheel 1-ton had a set of 19.5 wheels on it when I bought it. They fit fine. I no longer have those wheels.

If you have dually type hubs up front any single wheel type wheel is going to mount far outside the fender.

I plan to remove the extensions on the front hubs so I can mount directly to the hubs. I think tie rod interference is what I have to look out for.

Have you verified those are extensions? On an Advance Design truck it's the complete hub that is different.

I know I've had this discussion before, but no one has ever convinced me the Task Force trucks have a bolt-on extension instead of a dually hub.

Plus the trucks I've seen apart from the 60's and 70's have a complete dually hub.

On an AD truck it's the bolts that hold the brake drum in place that make it look like the 'extension' would unbolt, but really all that unbolts is the drum.

Can you post some pictures of yours? I sure could be wrong about this, but until you take it apart and show some pictures I'll remain a doubter.

I won't be able to get photos for a few days but I'll post them when I get a chance.

jfnar,

If you have one near you, look for a place that parts out motorhomes. Many of them have the 19.5" rims you are looking for.

You may have to look at motorhomes after 1998 or so, but there should be some available.

Lane

As oldsub says they are not bolt on extensions, but a complete hub assy. The front hub from a single wheel truck will go right back in its place though.I have swapped them back and forth and made Disk brake set-ups for them numerous times, Especially on the "Texas Beast" Cummins Bolt---------------

Welcome!
You've got my interest,
Please start a new thread and fill us in on the process, pictures would be great,

Thanks,
Grigg

I'll bet TriumphLeroy with the Texas Beast is GMC Leroy over at OldGMCTrucks.

Check out his old thread there Texas Beast.

For those that aren't members at OldGMCTrucks, you'll probably need to join to view that link.

I went by the shop last night and looked at the front hubs. They appear to be some type of bolt-on extensions but the holes on the hub side are on a smaller diameter than the wheel holes. So even if they'll come off, the hole pattern won't match. Now I'm considering two options. (1) Change the front hubs to single. I'm having trouble finding parts for TF one tons so hopefully other years will fit. (2) Get some adapters for the rear so I can use one dually wheel turned just like the front wheel. Here's some adapters I'm looking at. http://www.arrowcraft.com/arrowcraf...=catalog&category=3&pagenumber=1
Adapters about 4 1/2" thick should put the tire in about the right spot. The adavantages of #2 are that I aleady have the wheels, I would keep the big truck look, I won't have to track down scarce parts, and I won't have left over parts to get rid of. Any thoughts or suggestions for either option will be appreciated.

Jeff

Can you post a picture of these hubs with adapters? I'm pretty sure the factory did not use adapters and that the bolt pattern that would appear to be the drum side of an adapter is the same as the lug bolt pattern.

And that leaves me wondering what yours is...

jfnar bought two 19.5 wheels from me today. I have a 53 one ton that had the factory 9ft 6 inch pickup bed and single wheels. We where wanting to know if the single wheel front hubs and componets will fit his 57? Maby someone has done this swap or has a hollander manual and can answer the question. Thanks OldWolf

I have a link to a picture that says '53 to '59 dually hubs are the same. Its part of a series of photos of a disk brake swap on a 1-ton. I don't know that the caption is actually correct, though I'm inclined to believe it is.

Dually Hub

And that would mean your single wheel hubs would fit Jfnar's '57. To be sure I'd suggest comparing part numbers on all the brake parts because it might be necessary to replace more than the hub and drum, but also the backing plate, shoes and stuff.

Someplace like Rock Auto can be good for checking those kinds of numbers.

We where just mainly concerned with the front hubs. I kinda figured that the swap would require all of the componets backing plates ect. Probably be best if he just stripped all of his parts down to the spindle and I do the same with mine. He then could bring his parts over here and see if they would fit on my spindle. He dont live too far from me.

Sounds like a good plan.

The axles are different, so while just swapping axles might seem a good short-cut that approach won't actually work.

The information in the picture caption about the hubs is out of the 1959 Chevrolet parts book.

The part number on the rotors is no longer listed at NAPA.

The rotors are Dodge D250 & D350 '89-'93. Available as
Delco 18A33 or Raybestos 70238

The studs used to bolt the rotor to the hub are Dorman 6102561 rather than the 641555 shown in the picture. This stud provides a shoulder into the hub to keep the rotor centered better.

The fit of the 6102561 studs into the rotor is just the lightest of interference fits or the rotor will crack.

Hi John, good to see you here!

Do you have your brake conversion put together?

I don't often use NAPA for parts, the local one isn't very good and the online catalog is awful. I did find those rotors still readily available on Rock Auto.

Hey Steve,

My '55.1 project is pretty much where it was when you saw it. I did figure out the remaining problem for the brake conversion.

You have to remove the tab on the steering arms that limits steering travel in order to get the calipers mounted. I looked at my early ('62)Corvette and lo and behold, there is a steel plate with a slot in it that limits the travel of the pitman arm that serves the same function (limits steering travel). I plan to fab up a 'steering travel limiter' similar to the Corvette for the '55.

I'll see about getting some pictures in the next few days.

My projects are all moving in slo-mo too...

If you're going to be close to my neighborhood over the holidays you're welcome to come by and I'll give you the tour and a beer or coffee and lunch.

We can compare brake swap notes then.

Here's a picture of one of my front hubs. I haven't taken it apart. http://i305.photobucket.com/albums/nn214/jfnar/57%20chevy%203800/DSCF1012.jpg

As far as I know it's factory original.

jfnar,
That's a picture of the front hub from a dually 1-ton truck or a 1-ton single wheel truck? Reading the other forum on this that's posted above it looks like the other guy's truck is from a 1-ton single wheel truck. Probably wouldn't work on a 1-ton dually stock front axle would it?

Jfnar that hub looks to me just like the the dually front hub in Olblue's pictures.

The hub is a single casting with a flange to mount the wheel and a second to mount the brake drum. You won't be able to take that apart and easily convert it to use as a single wheel hub.

I just got home and looked at the front hub on my 1 ton dually. Could see it pretty easily through the hand holes. Looks like it does use a spacer to offset the dual wheel.
That's definitely unorthodox but is good news.
Now to try and understand how his disk brake conversion works.

From what I'm seeing he's installing a custom made bracket to hold the calipers, then just replacing the drum with a bolt on rotor. Are the calipers from the same make and model as the rotor? Do you think the rotor bolts directly onto the spacer with no modification? I wonder if using the old dual wheel if it's just a matter of swapping the drum for the rotor and making the bracket (not that hard to make the bracket).

Skybum are you referencing Olblue's brake conversion? He was definitely working on a dually front hub, and it is a hub not a spacer. I've seen his with my own eyes.

The only dually spacers I've ever seen are aftermarket items that I would not trust on a working truck. I suspect you are seeing the same thing everyone else does until they start taking it apart. The brake drum bolts to the rear of the hub. That gives the appearance that the outer portion of the hub might be a spacer, but in fact it is not.

Look at the outer bearing. If that piece is a spacer you need to replace the piece that mounts the bearing. That would make a single-wheel hub a two-piece hub, or mean machining something special.

Take it apart and look. If I'm wrong I want to see pictures. This comes up pretty often but so far no one has ever come back with pictures of a disassembled hub with a spacer.

OldSub,
My hub looks just like the pic that jfnar posted. I misunderstood the how the assembly worked. I thought the hub was part of the drum assembly and that they used a spacer to get the right offset of the dual wheel. Apparently the 1-ton front axle is the same whether or not it's a single wheel rear or dual wheel rear, correct?

I'm wanting to keep the dual wheel on the front, so this project is still doable right?

In the end, all the project entails is swapping the drum for a rotor and adding calipers via custom bracket, right? I know I'm making it sound simpler than it really is, but the only parts swap is basically a rotor, caliper, and caliper plate (custom). Then there's the issue with the turn limiter as suggested earlier in this forum, but workable it sounds like.

I'm still wondering what caliper part number to use. Looks like something off of a late 70's Chevy truck.

I'm very interested in this conversion.

Search out John's threads on his conversion. I think the disks and calipers he used are 90's Dodge, but I don't recall exactly. He had not finished that truck and put it on the road yet.

There is a similar thread on OldGMCTrucks.com using Dodge brake parts that is finished and in use. That guy was working with a little older truck, but the hubs are the same '53 to '59 so most the conversion would be the same also.

On a '48 to '54 the axle is the same on both single- and dual-wheel 1-ton trucks. Actually it is the same as 3/4- and 1-1/2 (standard only) ton trucks.

I'm not as conversant about the TF/BC trucks but would be surprised if they were different. The axles change between the Advance Design models and Task Force models, but its the spring pads and probably width that are different.

I may do this swap some day myself, but I'll be doing it a little differently. I've got a set of hubs off a 1-ton dually and I'm thinking I'll put disks on them and mount them on the front of a '51 4400 I have. I'll then put a Dana 70HD under the rear of the that truck. I have enough of the 18 inch wheels to run them on what I think of as a parade truck, so it will never see high speeds, but needs to be very good at stopping in congested conditions.

When that truck is done I'll probably also have replaced the cab with a '50 5-window... The real question is what decade will I start it.