The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area Engine Shop 1952 truck now with 235 motor, is it worth puting 350 small block - opinion

Hello All,

I recently removed 216 and put 235 motor, I still feel it lacks power to be daily driver, is it worth swapping to small block. Old motor a guy is selling for 300 bucks. Considering 1952 truck, my uprades will start from motor mounts all the way to rearend.
Any opinios are welcome. Thanks in advace.

Ganesh

Several people have talked about, "....going the cheap route" and then spend thousands of dollars on let's say IFS, v-8, auto tranny that they end up driving the truck a few hundred miles a year. My '49 1/2 ton is a daily driver year round and with Fenton headers and a H-W 2bbl, 3 sp+od it has plenty of power for long trips, several over 1K trips, fuel mileage, power. I'm DD for ten years close to 40 K miles.

Thanks Cosma, I needs ideas like so I dont endup spending whole lot of money

Ganesh

I my first A.D., a '49 I swapped the 235 for a 327/350 combo. Made a major difference!! It was a daily driver for awhile untill I sold it. In my current truck I did the same thing, only using a 327/700r4 instead. I don't have it on the road yet. I learned that it's much easier to work on them when you don't have to drive it daily. I guess it really depend on your personal tastes and how deep your pockets are!

Ganesh, is is power, or speed that you are looking for. The old final drive could be changed to give you better speed.

As Mobile stated, a V8 and overdrive transmission would be a good swap. These are plentiful as 305's and 350's in many '78 and later vehicles. Even a 250 / 200R4 combination would feel peppy.

If I were in your shoes with a running truck, I would follow something like Cosmo and put in a T5 hybrid and different final drive, then drive the truck, adding intake and exhaust items as needed.

Start at the rear first. It sounds like you would be okay deviating from original. Think of want your final outcome wishes now and then move forward. I had a 235 with a open drive shaft 3 speed and it ran with plenty of power. It was my daily driver for about 6 years. I had a 55 Chevy car 3:08 gears in in with five lug. I put 49 car front drums on it so that I could have five lug all the way around. I took it on the freeway and stayed around 65. Make sure that you overhaul your brakes from the master cylinder to the drums, including new hoses. Make sure your king pins and shocks are good too. Check your steering box, tires, rims and emergency brakes while you are at it.

Good suggesstions, I still have original rear end and which would be 4.54 or something like that, My truck reached about 55 miles top speed , however I am looking to swap rear end with lower gear 3.53 or something in that range. I dont know with original tranny how much that can make. Now a days even with 65 crusing speed is not much in the freeways, atleast a 80 would put me on par with other vechile speeds on the freeways. Well for me this is my first project and everything is a big learning curve and swapping to 350 requires so much work from front to back. I am going to restore my truck with body work and painting and I dont want my truck look sharp and drive like a duck.

With 235 motor with any better upgrades, what would be the top speed I can achieve.

Again thanks for all the suggesstions.

Ganesh

I don't know what your top speed with a 235 could be. With a bone stock GMC 270, SM420 and 3.08 gears I have no trouble running 70+ mph. I don't think I've ever tried to cruise at 80, but I think it would do that.

I don't have an overdrive transmission which would probably increase my speed. Swapping to a bigger six like the Chevy 261 or GMC 270 or 302 is a much easier swap and would give you the speed you are after.

With the original brakes I wouldn't want to run much faster than 55. I've got modern drums on the rear and disk on the front.

I'm not sure what your red line is on a 235, but I would think that with the right gears you should be able to do 65 - 75 mph. GMONIZ is right; if you want to go fast, be sure your brakes wheels and that front end will be up to freeway speeds. A V8 with modern trans and rear differential would be a big step up and make cruisin' at highway speeds easy. If you can do the work yourself, the transplants costs can be kept way down. This is the right place for info on making whatever changes you decide to make.

My opinion,
No 350, leave the six in it with a few upgrades, or a 261.

(edit) I made an 8,000 mile road trip, round the country in 28 days, in a 52 1 ton and a stock 235, had a great time, and no problems.

If you want a swap, do something special, it's a lot of work to put a 530 in and you only have what the other guy has..

I feel that there are two good choices, either mostly stock/stock appearing, or take the time and effort to do a very nice install on something different. And a 350 is not different, and plenty of them are just "stuck in there" (not very well planned or executed), don't be that guy.

It's your cat, you get to skin it, what's it take to make you happy?

Grigg

Well saig Grigg, if had to go for 350, I rather go bigger than that or stay with what I have and do some upgrades.

Appreciated to everyone for lot of opinions and more opinions I want to see

Ganesh

Smokey Truck,
As I read this and being in the same boat. I like what Cosmo and Scott Dansforth have said. I'm doing the 235 w/ T5 to a 10 bolt rear end. Yes I've gone a bit more with the IFS and power boster under the floor. I just got the engine/trans in and drive line is being made as we speak.Next brakes and plumbing. Maybe I may be at the good guys show in Del Mar. BUT I DOUBT IT but I'm getting close.

I daily drove my 52 GMC 3/4 ton with 4.56 gears in back, and I had a 235 in mine too. I agree, I tired of the wheezy power levels, but I could get up some speed on it, even with 4.56 gears.

With the original 1 barrel carb, I could only manage about 60 mph, but once I changed it to a Holley/Webber from Langdon's Stovebolt, I could hit about 72 mph top speed. It made a difference in power, torque, and mpg.

I am now almost done with a 350 swap in mine. There are some problems to overcome if you choose that route. So if you're looking for ease of reaching your goal to be able to go faster, I agree with others. The 235 can be improved to run better. Look to getting a tall rear end in it first. Then consider a 2 barrel carb swap and split exhaust next. If you still don't like the power level, then if you can find a 292, that might be an excellent upgrade. I ALMOST went with a 292, but when it was sold out from under me, I decided to drop the 350 in that I already owned.

If you really want to get exotic, a Cummins turbo-diesel might fit even better than a V8, and even though it would have a similar rpm band as a 235, it would make tremendously more power. I think that would be a very cool swap, and would be interested in hearing from someone who's done that.

There is a guy over on OldGMCTrucks who swapped a Cummins into a 1-ton. Nice swap BUT he had to cut into the firewall and passenger compartment to make the motor fit. I suspect it puts a lot of heat into the passenger compartment, so while it might look and sound cool, being in it might not be so cool.

Grigg went with a four cylinder Diesel. I don't remember if he has said why, but length may be part of his reasoning.

HotRodDad,

I have three things in mind to improve the power

1. Lower the rear end gears as low as 3.53 to 3.73 or 3.90
2. Upgrade the Crabuerator to 2 barrel
3. Split exhaust

None of this make me happy then upgrade to some nastly big I guess since I have to do lot of work to upgrade everything

Desiel is interesting only thing I dont know much about desiel engines to fix

Thanks for the opinions and options

Ganesh

I have a Gear Vendors O.D. with the original 4 spd and 3:90 gears behind a 235. By itself and 2 passengers I have no problem keeping at 75 at 2600 rpm on the freeway. We can even hold a conversation or listen to the original AM radio. Radials are a must and dynomat on the floor helps.
If I would have known what a big difference the O.D. and radials made I wouldn't have started to build a 261 stroker. Oh well, I guess I gotta finish it! BTW, buying a new crate 350 is cheaper than building a righteous inline. That's gotta be why so many people do it.

It's the power. Even a mild 350 can be had for 290 hp for about a grand and a half as a crate motor. That is an awful lot of power for the investment.

Bigmscdaddy,

I was looking into the option you mentioned, Did you have cut the shaft or is there a bolt on modified shaft available anywhere as the first section of the shaft has to be shortened. What did you do with that, OD seems to be pretty good option to make it go faster, all I was thinking about cost and making some things with my shaft.

I would like to hear what you did there

Thanks in advance
Ganesh

I have computer modeling software and some of the dyno charts, and will be psoting some data in my SLURP series later, but I can tell you right now, at least the following:

My SLURP seris truck, "Red" has a slightly warmed 261 in it, the power-robbing original iron case Hydra-Matic, and a 3.9 axle. The computer modeling software says this combo will break 100 mph, desite the Hydra-Matic.

With a STOCK versus modified 261, the software says that it would not break 100 with the Hydra-Matic, but would just barely with a manual tranny. BUT, you'd be spinning 4600 rpm at 100 mph!

The 3.9 gearing results in 2825 rpm at 60 mph, and 3060 or so at 65 mph.

I have to shamefulyl admit that I saw 95 mph on the speedo (actually, 4500 on the tiny tach in my dasboard)recently before common sense prevailed.

Jim G