The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area Engine Shop Timing TDC Help Please

Ok, I have done searches and come up with a few answers, but I need help

I have had way to much going on lately and seem to only work on the 52 Chevy 3600 when I get some free time and even then only in spurts.

Its a later model 235, casting numbers say its 58-62. I am having the hardest time finding top dead center. I have done the way the manual says for a disturbed engine, thus placing a finger over the hole until compression comes up blows finger off hole then about a third of turn, and you should see the timing steel ball. I can see this, at least I think, it looks like a BB embedded into the flywheel. Also I would say about 10 degrees clockwise from this, I see what looks like a cast triangle.

Now by this I also know that the intake valve should just start to close, and the exhaust valve would have gone thru its cycle. This should be true TDC. But it acts like its 180 out. I could really use some help here.

Now My question what is the sure fire way (No pun intended) to find TDC, wire it up and not be 180 out?

I ran out of daylight and hung it up for the night.

I did have it running earlier in the day quite poorly, but I made a very important discovery that caused me to tear it back down again. There wasn’t any oil coming up thru the head into the rocker assembly.

I read the manual but discovered nothing, I took the dizzy back out, ran the drill with a flat blade adapter on it, (this was with the head back off, I found oil, it pumped like a champ. Now the important discovery, two of my head bolts have a groove in them from the bottom of the bolt all the way thru the threads, thus letting oil pump. This was not how I had it assembled.

So Now its assembled again, pumps oil to the top, and now of course I am having some timing issues.

Other things to not I am using Pertronix I did have it running so spark is not the issue, the issue is got to be timing.

Any help would be appreciated they are calling for sunshine tomorrow. If I get up early enough I can make church, rip the xmas lights off the house and then tear into the truck.

Thanks Guys
Birge

If you are on TDC, both valves at #1 will be closed and valves at #6 will be at various stages of open. If you are 180 out the #6 valves will be closed and the #1 valves will be open.

If you get to the "finger to blow off the hole" point, you've gone past TDC. You need to back the engine up to find TDC,
Scott

Birge,

You have it figured out already. If I recall, the BB embedded in the flywheel is considered TDC, but actually, from a timing standpoint it is about 6&deg advance. I believe the triangle pertains to the valve train. You time to the BB with a light.

For your purposes, the BB is TDC on #1 cylinder. The flywheel is keyed to the crank, so it cannot be put on wrong. If you feel the air rush past your finger as it is held over #1 plug hole, then stop and roll the engine the few more degrees until that BB aligns with the pokey pointer, you are all set.

If the distributor is already in the engine, you merely line up the tip of the rotor with the location of ANY tower on the cap, call that plug #1 and insert the remaining wires in a clockwise rotation following the firing order 153624. Turn the key and take a spin.

If you had the distributor out, make sure it's seated in the oil pump slot when you reinstall it.

Don't lose yourself in the techno-maze...just do it this way and success will follow...I hope!

Stuart

Oh boy, Just start with any wire and wire it to that. It will run that way. :hammering:

Why not wire it the way it came and is posted in all the books. Makes it easier next time you work on it.

Especially handy if I have to work on it after some previous owner has wired it "his" way.

It does look a little strange on a pristine show truck to see #1 wired to a nonstandard position. I have noticed this in some of the gallery shots.

But Cletis, what way is that? I thought I was there but I kept missing it, The way it came out the rotor bug was pointing towards the driver side sitting position. I am not sure how exactly to get it back thr but I would guess that the dizzy will only drop in two ways while at TDC, so it would be eithr right on, or 180 out.

I am going to try all the good stuff metioned above tomorrow, andpost again, thanks guys I appreciate it.

Thanks
Birge

pull the plugs and the valve cover. undo the linkage to the foot starter so that you can bump it by hand. bump it until the intake valve opens then turn the fan until the exhaust valve closes then
take a good flash light (a drop light wont work) continue to turn the fan and look in the # 1 spark plug hole with the flash light
you can see the piston come up and it will stop for just an instant
at tdc. now you can aim the rotor button at # 1 and drop in the distr. you may need to aim the oil pump slot with a big screw driver.

i just read my post i meant turn by hand until the intake valve closes

also cletis is right dont just pick a spot on the dist and call it #1 this will cause crazy problems down the road use the correct number one on the cap and follow my earyler post it works every time

Birge,

Cletis might be confusing this issue for you! If you align the timing mark at TDC, insert #1 plug wire in the cap directly over the end of the rotor and follow with the remaining wires in a CW rotation in the firing order, you will succeed.

Granted, if #1 wire isn't in the factory location, you might not win first prize in the Concours d'Elegance, and you would probably confuse most mechanics in Parker County, Texas.


Stuart

Birge, sorry if I confused you but it sounds to me several others may be confused here too.

Aligning the BB or whichever mark your flywheel has with the pointer gives you a 50/50 chance of being on TDC of #1 cylinder.

And yes, even if it's 180 out, you can wire it to run. Apparently doing things this way impresses some people on this board.

According to Motors Truck Repair Manual, the clips on your distributor should be forward and aft. The number 1 wire should go on the middle outboard hole. That being the furthest hole on the passenger side.

In order for this to work, you must be sure you are at TDC of cyl 1 and not cyl 6.

Cletis,

If you read the very first post, Birge has determined that #1 is coming up on compression...he has his finger over the plug hole with air rushing by. If he now sees the BB on the pointer, he is TDC on #1...no 50/50 chance at all. Now that impresses me.

Birge is concerned with getting his engine running. It has him frustrated and his feels confused about the timing issue. My guess is he isn't concerned about where the clips are or which hole in the cap will get him the gold medal.

To insinuate that there is only one to achieve this end is going to frustrate many folks who aren't as accomplished a mechanic as some.

I might be wrong on this..it wouldn't be the first time, but I would like to give Birge the benefit of the doubt.

Stuart

I have read the first post. In it he says,

"Now by this I also know that the intake valve should just start to close, and the exhaust valve would have gone thru its cycle. This should be true TDC. But it acts like its 180 out. I could really use some help here."

This shows me that he does not have the #1 cylinder at TDC. Both valves should be closed well before the pistons hit the top of the stroke. This is the compression stroke. You won't get any compression if the intake valve is just starting to close.

I told him how to determine by looking at the rocker arms which piston is at the top of the compression. You told him he could wire it to run no matter which piston is at TDC. I agreed it could be wired that way. How do you figure I insinuated there's only one way to do it. I merely stated if you are going to do it you might as well do it right.

Birge, during all the confusion I thought of something that might be throwing you off. Be sure the slot in the oil pump is turned so the distributor will go in the slot when it's oriented correctly.

Hey Guys, Thanks, I got it, and to answer some questions, the reason I figured it was a 50 50 shot was because I could noever get the darn shaft to line up with the slot in the pump. Never thought about lining it it up, and no I am not gods gift to mechanics, I don;t do too bad, but this one had me flustered.

ANyway she runs well, I let her warm up , and then adjusted the alves, she runs much better, I nned to go thru them again. I also now need a starter, or a solenoid haven;t determined yet.

Thanks Guys

Birge

Glad to know you got her going.