The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area Engine Shop working flat rate

I am curious how many stovebolters are or used to work flat rate? What do you think of it as a means to establish a time frame for estemating labor on a shop project?

I work flatrate now.
It can be a double edged sword!
If you are good, have most of the special tools and are willing to work 50+ a week the $$$$ can be very good. However if the shop or the mechanic is slow it gets hard to pay the bills and can be VERY seasonal.
For the customer it can get high or it can protect them from crooked people riding the clock so to speak. By using the book you cant overcharge as the mechanic will only get that much no matter how long he takes to complete the job.
Brad

I have been a mechanic for hire for the last 10 years. I have never worked flat rate, hope I never do. It seems to me to many things can go wrong on a job. What about broken bolts or defective parts, who pays for that time?
I just put a water pump on a 6.2L GM van. Got it all together put in the coolant and it ran right out the front of the new water pump. There went a hour and a half. Joe

I work part-time as a boat mechanic. Round these here parts (the terrible suburbs of Northern Virginia) most boat mechanics are either sallary or by the hour...very few flat-rate. As for cars, I'd guess it is about half and half.

My opinion on flat rate is this: If I had to take my auto to a mechanic (which is highly unlikely), I would try to avoid flat-rate workers. Flat-rate guys are trying to make money by doing as many jobs as fast as they can. They sacrafice quality for speed...use impact wrenches everywhere and strip bolts.

I know a few flat-rate guys. One of my colleges at work used to do flat-rate motorcyle repairs. He says some of those guys were monsters.

A good repair takes patience and time to do...something flate-raters don't, and never will have (don't blame them thouh, because it isn't their fault).

Jay

PS...I get paid by the hour

Joe
At my shop IF the service desk warns the customer on known problem car types,or gets them to agree to additional cost, the customer pays. A lot of the time the mechanic eats the time. For Defects the shop pays 50-70% of normal rates and covers the parts.
This cost a time on paying tickets but its better than doing it free.
Brad

I use a job clock bill by the .00 hour but everything we do is a prototype.Shop phones unlisted and there's no sign.
In 25 years no ones ever driven buy with a racecar and said 'Gee I just drive-in and get this restored'So works for me......We don't do Ferraris and Porsches.......or work for Lawyers either.

I worked for 3 years at a motorhome dealership that charged real hours when doing all work except warrantee repairs / recalls. The factory set the hours for the warrantee stuff and I pretty much got it all. I remember once we had to replace/add gas tank straps on a bunch of Sportscoach Motorhomes. GM made the straps and they were too light so they gave us 3 hours to replace them on each coach. We had about 30 coaches to do on the lot and I put together a support that would hang on the side of the pit and jack up to hold the tank up and made up a press that held an air drill that could drill upwards through the frame to add additional strap mounts. After about the 5th one, I could do it in under an hour. I got to keep 50% of whatever time I saved. Got a few good paychecks off of that deal. Flat rate works well if you are concientious and fast.

Just starting out in the flat rate world...it most certainly has some good points and some bad points. When you get good at doing a certain job (after many repititions) you certainly CAN make money on it. However, when the occasional "wierd" or unusual job shows up, you can well lose your shirt. As an apprentice, this is usually the category I currently fall under. As for "air wrenches" and "torque wrenches", again the two sided arguement. Speed (productivity) versus proper assembly procedures. Personally, I would prefer to have my vehicles repaired using proper procedures and torquing specs-wait a minute! THAT'S why I became a repair technician in the first place-to justify purchasing good tools and furthering my education so I could fix my own vehicles-properly! Bottom line-most everyday joes CAN'T repair their own vehicles or WON'T repair their own vehicles. That's where technicians come in. I DO however wish that I worked for an hourly paid shop-not so I could slack off, but so I could take my time to finish the repair CORRECTLY and not have to rush it due to ridiculously low book times for warranty (and sometimes retail) repair.

I'm flat rate mechanic now, have been for a while. I like it, either way has its good and bad. I make darn good $$$$$$ at work, don't do side jobs, and enjoy it. Sure, some guys will cut corners and strip bolts. Thats the guy, not the system. We all have incentives to work faster, however I myself have personal incentives to put quality repairs above worrying about my wallet. At least when all's said and done, I can hold my head high and know I did my part right.

Guess I didn't even answer your questions....... I don't use flat rate to estimate anything....... I use Alldata or Mitchell. If a job gets possibly questionable, I advise them UP FRONT they will be notified if any bolts break or any extraneous circumstances occur. Living in Tucson, Arizona..... we charge extra for rusty "back~east" cars. Oh yes, we also charge for diagnosis (lots of shops are scared to) and charge to inspect cars.

I always like it when a shop gives you a time estimate using the Mitchell books or whatnot. Then tell you what they charge per hour for labor.. and no matter how long it takes.. you will be charged for ACTUAL labor.. A good shop isnt going to waste time while doing a repair. They will do it as quickly as is reasonable. I know the books can be way off on their time estimates, as the book said it would take 4 hours to change the timing belt on my 86 Chevy fwd, and my mechanic did it in 2.