The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area General Truck Talk Rivets and Spring Hangers...

Sorry if this has been asked before, but I don't seem to find an answer with the search function...

Just for reference: 1953 GMC 350-24 (2 ton, 161" wheelbase)

I have a need to do some frame repair under one of the rear spring hangers. To do this right, I would need to carefully remove the factory rivets that hold on the spring hanger. Once everything is clear, I can then do a nice solid repair on the frame.

I'm guessing the only real option I have to re-attaching the spring hanger is to use bolts. Has anyone ever done this? I would use only the best grade-8 hardware. I could even use grade 8 castle nuts with cotter pins on the ends of the bolts to insure the nuts never come off. Another option would be to use drilled nuts and safety wire. I'm not trusting something this important to lock nuts...

Thanks in advance for your thoughts on this.

David

The reason those hangers are riveted is to absolutely prevent any movement between the hangers and the frame rails. As a rivet is installed ("bucked" is the correct term) it expands in diameter to completely fill the hole its installed into.

I'd suggest using a slightly larger bolt than the rivet hole, one with a precision-ground shoulder, and reaming the holes for an exact fit. These bolts usually have an Allen head, and they're Grade 8 strength or above. Properly torquing the nuts, and using red Loctite on the threads should assure they don't get loose.
Jerry

Lincoln,

You bring up a really excellent idea. The idea of creating a slight press fit between the shank of the bolt, and the hole in the frame, that would prevent things from walking around when loaded.

I will have to measure the factory holes in the hangers and see what I can find for a bolt size. If I can't find a bolt that is close (I don't feel comfortable opening up the holes too much), I can make some bolts out of 4340 and have them heat treated. If I did that, I could even make the heads round to simulate the look of a rivet.

You know, it just occurred to me that there might even be some wheel studs that might work. The knurled shank would make a great movement free interface. They're also pretty tough.

Worst case scenario, I can fab up some new spring hangers out of plate stock. It would be wonderful if I could preserve the look of the original cast steel hangers.

You have given me some great ideas! Thank you!

Worst case, perhaps best case, invest in the effort and tooling to set hot rivets. This is also what the shop manual recommends for frame repair.

There are several discussions on riveting on this forum and others, and some good YouTube videos out there too.

An easy option short of riveting Would be flanged head frame bolts and flanged self locking nuts as used on newer truck frames. These may not fit because of the large washer head?
Or in my opinion second best to the original rivets might be "Huck bolts" which are a sort of modern cold rivet/bolt requiring some expensive tools. A truck repair shop could help with this. This is primarily how new heavy truck frames are assembled.

Making bolts? Bucking new rivets? There are a whole lot a bolts on a truck and motor. They don't come loose and they are not Gr 8.

Grigg,

It never even occurred to me to even search for "Hot Riveting" simply because I just assumed it was not possible. I'll do some more research and see what I can learn. I did watch the video I posted above and the impact rivet gun they use is pretty big! If I could rent something like that, it might be possible to do in my space. I don't think I could invest in buying a gun that size for a one-off project...

Take care,

David

David, many times I have been surprised when visiting a shop that specializing in a certain repair. That said you may want to ask around a few BIG truck repair shops and get to a person or two. Many times you'll find an accommodating human that will give you some help........it is definitely worth a try. Maybe someone could come to your place and buck a few rivets if you buy him lunch and a 6-pack.....you just never know.

Keep us posted on what you do. I'm curious!

Achipmunk, I think I will do that. After doing only a little research, it seems that hot riveting might be possible for me in my space. I need to learn a lot more about this...

Alvin brings up a good point about inquiring possibilities with a big truck shop. I imagine that if you rolled into the truck shop yard with your sweet baby, some heads will turn and someone would just love to have a chance to help you out.
Carl

Back in the late seventies I worked in a Big Truck shop, on the frame rack; Mostly Kenworths Peterbilts and Freightliners. The crossmembers and much else were assembled with bolts and nuts. I used a 1" rattle gun for assembly and disassembly. Most of what I remember is that the air wrench was heavy and I was a tired puppy at the end of the day. One truck required a replacement frame rail. I gave the factory the VIN and a week or so later a frame rail appeared on the loading dock. All the holes were in the correct places. The job required no riveting but was a riveting experience nonetheless.

I have overload spring perches bolted onto the frame on my 1-ton and they haven't moved in 30 years. When the rivets in the front crossmember on the 1-ton worked loose, I replaced them with grade-8 bolts. This required reaming the holes to 7/16 as they had been 25/64 rivets. I drove the bolts in with a hammer. This was 15 yrs ago and there is no apparent movement or rust around the bolts.

One can also get a straight(not a taper) reamer and machine the pieces to the next size bolt, not as good as hot rivet but sure better than wallowed out original bolt hole.

Ed

Deve,

Thanks for sharing the link! I just looked over this article. If something like this is really possible with just a 4x rivet gun, then I already have all the tools I need to try this! I have both a 4x and a 6x gun. I've used them to set different kinds of aircraft rivets in panels for other projects. I was imagining the gun needed would be a LOT bigger. I could even make and harden my own setter with some S-7 I have in my scrap bin. I will get my hands on some rivets, and try it out on some scrap.

One thing for sure, when I get these spring hangers off the frame, I'm going check them for cracks (magnaflux)...

Thanks for all the replies everyone! It's helping me build a picture of what's possible.

Take care,

David

I honestly can't tell the difference in the factory rivet and the ones I put in. But it's all about the bucking bars staying tight and getting the rivets heated properly. You can do it!