The Stovebolt Site Forums The Parking Lot Big Bolts Need drive shaft information

Good morning, everyone. I previously posted a few pics of my 1959 2 1/2 ton firetruck. It has now been de-firetrucked, body is off and pump is out. Removing both of those pushed my 30hp Kubota and loader to its limits.

Anyway, now that the pump is out I need a drive shaft to go from the center support bearing at the back of the cab to the rear axle. Is this something I can find at a junk yard, or will I have to get it made? I can supply both ends, just need the right length shaft to go in between. I called my closest junk yard and of course they said they would have nothing like that. I measured 91.25 between the centers of the u joints. I was hoping to find one out of an old C60 or C70 that would fit.

on a side note, I have zero luck at junk yards. I have sought parts for everything from a landcruiser to k10 truck and have ALWAYS come up empty. Plus they always treat me like I am asking stupid questions and am a nuisance to them. what am I doing wrong?

Hy Gene_Spartan80, if I'm remembering my training correctly, no single shaft should exceed 72" (six feet) in length. There should be a cross member in the frame that another support bearing could be mounted to (unless the fire body installer removed it, but I doubt that). If your truck is still a factory wheelbase then there would have been a driveshaft system created for it, but I don't think your chances of finding one at a wrecking yard would be very good. You could try posting an ad in the parts wanted forum, make sure to include the year, make, and size of the truck and the driveshaft tube diameter. I think you'd be better off to have a good driveshaft shop fabricate shafts for you, hope that helps.

Depending on your wheel base you could have 2, 3 or 4 driveshafts.

What's your wheel base (first two numbers on your serial number plate)?

8A = 132
8B = 144
8C = 156
8D = 174
8E = 192

The carrier bearing supports have different length hangers to keep the angles right. Not knowing what the fire service installers did and exactly where they moved or put bearings your best bet might be to find your local big truck drive shaft/suspension company and talk to them. I don't think you want a drive shaft 90" long. Seems like GM kept their shafts under 60". The last drive shaft I had made cost about $80, so it's not worth finding a junk one unless you need the jokes, and even then what's your time worth?

Hope this helps,

Mike B

My truck is an 8D

ok, that is all good information. I believe all cross members are in tact. I can definitely handle a couple of $80 drive shafts. How about the support bearings are they standard or will they be difficult to find? Is the angle built into the support bearings or will I need fabricate them?

Also,does the drive shaft start angling at the cab or does it start the angle at the last support bearing?
Gene

correction. I just went and looked and my truck is missing a cross member where the firetruck pump had been. I would guess finding that crossmember will be next to impossible so making one for the purpose of holding the support bearing is now necessary. One illustration I found shows the use of U bolts along the length of the shafts between bearings (page 5-85 in the 1958 chevy truck shop manual). this seems like it would be a source of significant wear. is this the way your drive shafts are mounted?

One of my existing drive shafts will work if I replace the missing cross member and mount a support bearing. that means I need one or two more shafts. depending on the remaining length. anyone located in upstate South Carolina? It sure would help to see this in person on a similar truck?

Thanks for your input so far. maybe I can get this sorted out and put this thing on the road soon.

You'll find some excellent manuals and advice from Spicer on driveline angles and everything else driveshaft related in the links here
http://www.stovebolt.com/techtips/driveline/setup/index.html

I think the u bolts are a safety feature to keep the drive shaft from dropping due to u joint failure.

Regards you luck at junk yards, they will never know what you are talking about if you ask for a '59 GMC driveshaft. Need to look yourself by dimension, driveshaft length, crossmember dimensions, etc. just get in the yard and start looking yourself.

The old pump location is a good location for a Brownie if you need the gears. I just got a '54 firetruck(GMC) that has a new two piece driveshaft made. What engine and trans do you have now?

Your truck originally had 3 drive shafts with a Front and Intermediate support bearing.

All of the parts you need can be found at your local drive shaft service shop.

Mike B

Gene, if you are in the UPSTATE you need to talk to Tom, the owner, at Carolina Driveline. He's been doing shafts for about 30 years. I've known him for 15 years. Located here in Spartanburg. If he doesn't have what you need he can get it. I've worked part time delivering all kind of shafts to customers here locally and over to Greenville, Easily, Mauldin and the list goes on. You should have seen the one I delivered to a trucking company today.....his prices are the best around and he does quality work. He can build it, repair it, custom make ect.

Now that I've bragged on him give him a shout. I'll be there 9:30 in the morning! Be SURE to measure TWICE.....and its equally important to know WHERE and HOW to measure.
Where you located?? The shop is on Howard street just below the UPS big terminal.

Thank you for tge feedback. My engine is a 366 and has a 4 speed. I know the engine is not original and I dont know about the transmission. I have called carolina drive line and the guy was very hepful on the phone. I also called Cline (they are called Rexnord now). I am working on getting all the right dimensions ready and get them to quote it.

I dont know enough about the brownie to even know if I want one. Honestly, as this is my first venture into trucks beyond 3/4 ton, I had to google it to see what it was.

I live in Belton, SC , only an hour from Spartanburg. I have two things on the list before this truck can go down the road...drive shaft and brakes. At least that will let know if there are other fires to put out.
Gene

Another concern is my parking brake. The fire truck pump had a disk brake behind it attached to the drive shaft. This is no longer there and I read that the big trucks came with a drum brake mounted to the propeller shaft at the transmission. Is this set-up the only way to go or do I have other options. If i need to mount the original type, I need to find it then the front drive shaft will have to be shortened. Any suggestions for alternatives I am a woodworker, I could make a nice set of chocks.

Hy Gene_Spartan80, I'm pretty sure we could install the original type parking brake on the back of the transmission and not have to shorten the shaft (if it was the factory length). There were two different styles of PSPB (propeller shaft parking brake), could you take a picture of the back of your transmission just so we can verify what is or is not left there of the original parking brake system?

I have linked a photo of the transmission. barely visible on the right side in the photo is the linkage attached to the lever in the cab. This was attached to the long linkage to the pump disk brake. Anyway, let me know what your trained eyes see here.
Gene
[IMG]http://i408.photobucket.com/albums/pp165/datagirl79/2015-05-14%2008.37.30.jpg[/IMG]

sorry it is a little blurry

Hy Gene_Spartan80, it looks like you have part of the parking brake system, you have the rear housing of the transmission which incorporates a pivot shaft for the two shoe type of parking brake. So you need the brake drum, shoes, and linkage to connect it all to the handle in the cab. Post an ad in the parts wanted forum, hope that helps.

any where I can see and exploded diagram of this so I can tell what I have and what I need?

Hy Gene_Spartan80, I don't think I've seen an exploded diagram in the parts book, but I know there are pictures of both types of parking brakes in the maintenance manual. I wish I was better with this confusilator stuff, then I could scan (or whatever you call it) a picture from one of my books and post (or whatever you call it) here for you to see, but alas I'm a mechanic not a confusilator technician.

Hy Gene_Spartan80, it would appear I told a fib, I found an exploded diagram in my 55-57 truck parts book, when she who must be obeyed gets home from work I'll ask her to help me get it put on here for you to see. Please stay tuned for further developments.

Send me a PM with your email and I can send you the exploded diagram and pictures of what you need to bolt to your SM420 transmission.

Like 3B, I don't have an account that I can post pictures to...

Mike B

If it is a 366, then on OD trans would be good, or changing the final drive to something higher(lower numerically) , as well as some close ratio trans-540, etc.

Hy Gene_Spartan80, I'm sorry we didn't get back here sooner, but we lost our phone service first and then our internet service for almost two days, anyway here is the exploded picture of the two shoe parking brake, hope it helps.
[IMG]http://i120.photobucket.com/albums/o178/pintos4me/scan0001_zpskyzh0v4m.jpg[/IMG]

http://i120.photobucket.com/albums/o178/pintos4me/scan0001_zpskyzh0v4m.jpg

Thank you, to everyone who helped me out on this. With help of Mike B and 3B, I now have all the information I need for the emergency brake. I just need to post an ad for the missing brake parts I need for the back end of the transmission. I pick the new drive shaft up tomorrow. I found a crossmember from a 1995 chevy 3500 that will look reasonably authentic to support the new swing bearing. It will at least look better than anything I could fabricate. Maybe one day I will run up on the real late 50's 8500 crossmember but what I have will do the job. Thanks again.
Gene

New drive shaft is in, just need to mount the new center bearing. then it is on to the brakes which seem to be more challenging than I first thought.

I believe you will find the ebrake drum is nothing more than a 2" x 12" GM 6 lug brake drum, I've had owned 4 C50's, one '60, a '67, a '71 and a '72 all had similar transmission mounted ebrakes. Don't bother looking for the ebrake cable, they are long out of production, I sold the last one I had to a gentleman in Indiana, IIRC, only to find out I needed one about two months later. Finally endup with one from a military surplus oufit, it is too long and had to be adapted on one end. Now installing a Spicer 3053A out of an M35A2 with no provision for a trans mounted ebrake,,,, back to the drawing board!