The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area Interiors Window run channel clip installation?

I'm getting ready to install the new window run channels in the doors of my '50, 3604. first let me say that I do not want to use pop rivets, 3m weather strip adhesive or flat head screws to install them.
I have a new set of clips from Steele for the ends and up around the window opening. They each have a few triangular pointed tabs that are punched out and raised up about an 1/8 of an inch and perpendicular to the clip. They are the same as the original clips which were punched through the corrugated metal and bent over. Has anyone ever successfully installed these type of clips and if so do you have I'm looking for any suggestions for installing them with out destroying the channel?
Denny Graham
Sandwich, IL

Pop Rivets LOL!

Wha'd I say Wilber???? "first let me say that I do not want to use pop rivets, 3m weather strip adhesive or flat head screws to install them." I know, yur just tryin' ta get my goat, aren't ya! And I also know there are others out there, hiding in the shadows, that are a anal as I am about this stuff, and I’d sure like to hear their stories.

I'm well aware that there are fifty ways to attach your channel. But I don't want a new plan Stan. What I'm trying to figure out is how to do it the correct way, in other words the way the factory did it. Just the purist in me coming out. I've been thinking about machining some Maple blocks that will fit inside the channel and trap the legs to keep them from spreading. That would act as an anvil to drive the barbs through the corrugations. Then I could use something similar to a rivet set to roll them over inside. These materials are so expensive I feel I only have one chance at it and that there isn’t any room to experiment with it. The clips alone are a couple of bucks each not to mention what it cost for the channels. With a dozen clips to install, I think it’s worth figuring it out. Then the next few will be easy. I figured out a way to staple the cat’s whiskers anti-rattle strips to the garnish using the original holes, now I need to get this one nailed down.

I would imagine that the factory had something similar to a stapler that drove the clip through and folded the barb over all in one operation.

Denny Graham
Sandwich, IL

Denny, Did you have any luck with this? I am about to attempt this myself.

Hi Eric. It's been a while so it's a little hazy, but yes, I
managed to get them in like the original ones but it was a real
pain in the ars. they are very difficult to get thru the
channel and there isn't much of the barb sticking thru. I broke
the points of the barbs on a lot of them when I tried to bend
them over/crimp them. The reproduction clips are not properly
heat treated and they break off when you bend them over. I had
to cut some of my own with longer barbs from annelid spring
steel that were not as hard as the reproductions. The factory
had specially designed dies to drive them thru the corrugated
channel and bend them over like a staple.
Although not authentic, I would recommend attaching them like
the other guys have suggested, i.e., pop rivets, or flat head
screws. The pop rivets have a large head which will show but
small #4 flathead screws will embed themselves in the fibers
and almost completely disappear. Some have cemented them but
I personally wouldn't use that method.
Denny Graham
Sandwich, IL

I used small #4 round head sheet metal screws that disappeared almost completely.

Thanks for the reply. Now when you talk of attaching them with screws or whatnot, are you talking attaching the clips to the channel? or forgoing the clips altogether and just screwing the channel to the door? I found some #6 x1/4 screws that look like they may work to hold the clips on the channel without too much sticking out either side, but not sure how much room I have to play with there. If its just a matter of drilling a few holes and screwing the channel to the door thats an easy one.

No, just forget the clips and screw the channel to the door,
works just fine and no one but you will know the difference.

DG

thanks Denny. Wouldn't have gotten as far with this old truck as I have without guys like you and several others in this forum.

Ok guys, my turn to do this with my truck. How/where did you place the screws and did you screw the run channel to the guide that is bolted inside the door?

I used the 3M weatherstrip adhesive in the lower channels. I used 5 screws around the upper frame the first a couple inches up from where it goes down inside the door. Then worked my way around maybe every 5-6 inches or so.

I never was any good at chess, just can't think that many moves
ahead. But..I can think one move ahead and that's why the
question pops up in my mind concerning the replacement of that
run channel down the road sometime.
I know many of you are thinking that it will last as long as you
have the truck because the original one was in there for 60
years. But chances are that original one let the window rattle
for 50 of them years. A decade looked like a long way off when
I brought my '50 home in 'O5 and restored the inner workings of
the doors, but here we are already, only a year away from the
end of that first decade.
As I like to do, I spent way to much time on the installation of
my run channel and put them back exactly the way they came out,
with the clips, some of which I had to make copies of. I've
only driven old blushing blue about 10,000 miles so I'm not
seeing much wear yet but there is some and I'm planning on
driving her for a few more decades, hopefully more that I have
been.
The use of small sheet metal screws to attach the channel (all
the way round)sounds to me like the absolute best way to attach
it, if you don't want to go thru the agony that the factory
used. Applying glue of any sort to hold them in place not only
may make it quite difficult to replace them but it seems it
would make a real mess of the paint job in the cleanup.


Just my feeling about the subject, not saying it's for everyone.

Denny Graham
Sandwich, IL

With myself or the future in mind I wanted an easy repair or access more than I wanted an easy first install...
I used small allen head screws like those found holding the metal components of vcr/camcorders and the like together. I chose areas of the frame that were dbl thick metal to drill then marked and drilled the channel and frame tapped them. Many extra steps but I found the threads from sheet metal screws wanted to take the 'fuzzies' with them and bind up.

Guys: Thanks for the feedback. I have decided screws it is and not adhesive. I always think of what will be involved when I have to take it apart again...either to replace or do it again in the proper sequence. To that end, I avoided "gluing" the glass in the vent window frame and took the time to find the proper .032" glazing tape online. I cannot tell you how easy it was to glaze the vent window with the proper thickness material. Simply slide right on, no pounding and 24 hours later rock solid in place. If someone breaks the glass in the future, it will be easy to replace and I wont mess up the very nice automotive finish black paint I spent carefully getting just right.

I believe you've made a good choice Dave.

Where did you buy you setting tape from, often the tapes the
vendors carry are the wrong thickness.
Denny Graham
Sandwich, IL

Denny, where else but Ebay. "Vintique Inc." brand. Ebay You can find the tape in various thicknesses. I used 1/32" for both the window bottom track and the vent windows. The window track was the tightest fitting of the pieces and required minor blows with a rubber mallet to set the piece. The vent windows slide right on..one with a little bit of pressure needed and other was seemingly too loose and I did not have confidence it would stay in place. But, the next day it was locked in place. After oil is added to the tape, it gets very sticky over time. Great stuff...way better than the common vendors are selling (cork). Incidentally, I used ATF (non-synthetic) to activate the tape.

Not sure, but I think this is for the same purpose:
http://www.steelerubber.com/search?...p=4#sash-channel-filler-strip-70-2169-57

Dennis

Yes, that is most likely the same thing.

On another note, I was installing the vertical riveted on rubber seal for the vent window and noticed the Tech Tip on this subject has it wrong. The rivets should be inserted from the vent window side and the setting tool used inside the glass run channel. The Tech Tip shows it being done opposite.

David -

Thanks for the info on thin setting tape

Not contradicting your opinion, but why do you feel that the rivets should be inserted from the vent side?

I inserted mine from the window side, then followed the Tech Tip. Don't think that I could have set them if they were inserted from the vent side.

- Lonnie

The holes in the run channel are tapered on the run channel side. The taper is designed to engage the "mushroomed" end of the rivet. Also the nice clean (head) part of the rivet should be on the visible side. That is my take on the situation, nothing more. Yes, you have to be more creative with backing drifts, but it is possible.

I should also point out that when separating the vent window from the frame, I drilled out the hinge bracket rivets from the frame (not the pivot rivet). This way, the factory pivot rivet is not disturbed and the bracket can simply be pop-riveted back on the frame and the pop-rivets are not visible after the assembly is reinstalled.

Sounds like something that others might be interested in,
any pictures guys, just to fill in the blanks???


Something additional that someone replacing their vent
window might be interested in:
http://www.pbase.com/dennygraham/vent_window

Denny G

I came to the same conclusions as DavidF when I did mine.
I think the 'creative backing' I used was a small chunk of 3/8" steel plate standing vertically in the vice.
Thought I shot pics of that project but can't find any...
Still once the channel fuzzies and vent window rubber are installed you can't really see one way or the other on mine.

Thanks, David

Makes sense to me

- Lonnie