The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area Engine Shop Badly need timing help

I have no Idea how to time an engine. How would I time a 216 in my 46 2ton. From what I have been told its way out of time all it does is backfire when I try and start it. Any help would be appreciated.

I hope the following information is useful.

1. Locate top dead center on the compression stroke of cylinder one. (There should be a divot in the flywheel with what looks like a bb sitting in the center of it.) Line up the bb-mark with the pointer in the opening that lets you view the flywheel.
You can open the valve cover to watch the valves to make sure they are closed.

2. If you have a manual advance adjustment set it for 0.

3. Using a continuty checker (on a voltmeter) rotate distributor untill the points are just starting to open on the cylinder one spark wire.

4. Make sure that the wiring matches the correct firing sequence. Should be (1-5-3-6-2-4) moving clockwise.

5. This should be good enough to get it started. Once started you can use a timing light to get it dialed in.

I hope this is helpful. I am sure if I missed anything or anyone has anything to add they will chime in.

Good luck with your project.

Now the question is were does the wiring start? (the 153624) which post on the distributer cap is 1?

once you locate TDC of cylinder 1 the distributor rotor will be pointing to the terminal in the distributor cap that belongs to #1. On my truck that terminal is at approx 5 o'clock. http://chevy.oldcarmanualproject.com/booklets/5204mts00.htm

thank you I'll see if I can get this engine running now

what pointer are you refering to on the flywheel opening? I think I'm missing that piece

This pointer is supposed to be in the hole in the bellhousing:
http://www.pbase.com/dennygraham/image/110692411

DG

Akguy,

Frankly, the hardest part of timing these engines for the uninitiated, is finding Top Dead Center. I'm sure a search on this site would reveal better instruction than I can give, but what the heck - I'll jump in.

The "timing window" that Denny is speaking of, is low toward the rear of the passenger side of the engine. Silver-dollar sized hole, with a pointer in the middle of it. At TDC, there is a mark on the flywheel that will show up in that window, assuming it's not totally covered by grease or dirt. I believe the timing mark you're looking for is a bb (you know, a round ball) which is recessed into the flywheel.

So how to turn the engine to get it lined up? First, remove all the spark plugs to relieve compression and make it easier to turn. Second, know that the engine turns clock-wise as you face it from the front, ie: staring at it between the headlights. Third, be sure the truck is in neutral.

Now - some people speak of using the starter to "bump" the engine over to find TDC. In my experience, this is a very imprecise exercise, and it moves too fast for me to follow. So try this: standing on the driver's side of the engine, use your right hand to push hard against the fan-belt to maintain tightness, while using your left hand to pull the fan toward you over the top. If you can keep the belt from slipping, this will turn the engine.

If this doesn't work, I suggest borrowing/buying a hand-starting crank. This fits into a whole in the harmonic balancer, and allows you to turn the engine by hand (it will only turn in the proper direction). Not sure if NAPA or such sells them, but Jim Carter and Chevs of the 40s probably do. It makes turning the engine for timing rather simple.

Finally, the engine can also be turned by crawling under the truck, removing the flywheel cover behind the oil pan, and using a prybar on the starter ring teeth to turn the engine. Easier with 2 people, and still awkward, in my mind.

NOW - how do you know when you're close? Well, first off, know that there are 2 Top-dead-centers. That is, the piston for each hole is at TDC twice for each complete cycle: once is at true TDC, when it fires, and once during overlap, when the valves are opening and closing.

So once you GET the BB lined up in the window, there are 2 ways to know if it's the right one: The first, is by pulling the distributor cap off and seeing if the rotor is pointing toward the tower leading to plug-wire for number 1 cylinder. This assumes the engine was at least close to set right when you started.

The second way to know is by watching the valves for number 6 cylinder (rear-most 2 valves)as you turn the engine. Turn the engine until you see the #6 exhaust rocker arm push down (that's the farthest one back). Start turning slowly at this point. Now, watch carefully for the #6 exhaust valve to just start to come back up, and at the same time, the next closest valve, the #6 intake, to just start going down (or opening). When this happens, you are very close to TDC for the number 1 cylinder. Keep turning in very small increments until you see the BB in the window.

For what it's worth, this is all MUCH easier with another person helping. And, I wouldn't panic if you just slightly pass the pointer - if the BB is in the window, at all close to the pointer, you're close enough to get it running half-decently.

Once you're confident you've found TDC for #1 cylinder, you can adjust the position of the distributor to be just opening. I can beat that to death next, after you've found TDC. Post back with your progress!

-Michael

Good advice, Mike! Another way to move the engine a little at a time is to put the transmission in high gear (3rd. or 4th. depending on the transmission) and gently roll the truck forward a little at a time while watching the distributor rotor or the pointer and flywheel. Once the BB is lined up with the pointer, or close, turn the distributor housing clockwise until the points close, then turn it back CCW until they just barely open. Lock the adjustment down and reinstall the distributor cap. Put the #1 cylinder wire in the distributor cap tower the rotor is pointing toward, and follow in a clockwise direction with 5,3,6,2,and 4. If the firing order is correct, the engine should start.
Jerry

Question: On a 216, I thought that TDC for #1 cylinder was a small triangle stamped on the flywheel. At least, I think that's what I saw. When the fixed pointer was on the triangle, I adjusted the distributor so #1 was at the 12 noon position - pointing at the block, and set the wiring sequence from there. Then, when I timed it, I lined up the ball with pointer, and it runs great. Am I missing something?

Sounds OK. You most likely are off a few degrees since most engines were not timed to fire at UDC/TDC.

What year is your 216 (car or truck engine)?

What year is your flywheel?

Usually there was also a ball embedded in the flywheel and that is the "timing mark" and that is a different location than the triangle (or other TDC/UDC) mark.

http://chevy.oldcarmanualproject.com/chevyowner/51tom100.htm

Ok, it is a 1952 216 AKCA793894. I understand that the triangle is just the starting point. Here's the process I used, posted initially by Pete. I found it very easy to follow:

1- remove #1 spark plug
2- turn engine over by hand ,with youre finger over the hole when you feel air pushing out
3- take a flash light and look at timing hole in bell housing
4- turn engine SLOWLY until you see the triangle on the fly wheel
5- line up triangle to the pointer on bell housing
6- install disy so that rotor is pointed in a 12 oclock position you may have to move the oil pump alittle one way or the other use a screw driver
7- install disy cap and install #1 plug wire at the 12 oclock position
8- install all the other spark plug wires in a clock wise order
1-5-3-6-2-4- 1 being front and 6 being the last one
9- it should start you are going to have to set the timing with a timing light to the ball on the fly wheel after you get it started

Sounds/reads good.

If it's popping and backfiring you may have some plug wires out of order. The most common mistake is going the wrong direction around the distributor cap. That would make it fire on two cylinders, 1 and 6 most likely, causing the popping and such.

Okay I got it to run! mostly it was me going counter clockways instead of clockways on the distributor cap. It actually sounded pretty good for probely sitting since the window tag expired in '66 now I need to get the fuel pump and carb working right and to hook up the driveline and I think it will drive, will not be street legal but it should move under its own power.