The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area General Truck Talk new wheels hitting tie rod ends

Hey guys, I have a small problem that I know many of you guys are very experienced with. I got new wheels for the truck and they are a little wider than the original. The back wheels are great but the front are hitting the rod ends. Is the best way to fix this sort of problem is to look for a spacer or to modify the truck? Any guidance would be great.
Thanks

if it aint hitting the tie rod ends by much, a spacer will do, as long as you have the clearance to the outside of the wheel and tire, from rubbing the fender lip.
i had this problem when i first installed my lowered front axle. i used a 1/4 or 1/2 spacer and it worked just fine. cant go too thick, or you wont have enough grip on the lug stud.

another option is to remove the steering arms, heat them and bend them in to get your clearance. then you would need a narrower tie rod.

leonard

Thanks Ratrodking. Do you know where I can find a narrower tie rod? or should i cut and shorten it myself?

I have never had this problem but I understand if you still have the old style tie rod ends with the adjustment plug changing to the new style will solve it. It seems if you have to shorten the tie rod there should be enough adjustment in the ends to reset the toe-in.

Don't the spacers move the center of gravity as it relates to wheel bearings? I was under the impression that it did and that it could cause bearings to fail. Maybe not in a short period of time, but over a long run.

You can have longer studs installed. We had to do that on drag cars to have the proper amount of threads showing for NHRA safety inspection.

I've had 1" adaptors to space mine out on my 1950, 3600 for close to 10,000 miles and haven't had any problems, handles like a dream. Wheels are off of a 1970 Chevy 3/4 ton with 16.5" radials and bumped the stock tierod ends. The front end was completley rebuilt stock when I brought it home 5 years ago.
Adaptors are counter bored to use the stock studs and the new mounting studs are staggered between the original holes.
Denny Graham
Sandwich, IL

If you heat up the steering arms and bend them, the toe out on turns will be incorrect.

Denny, where did you buy longer studs?

Guess I din't explain it good enough Fred, I'll try again. I didn't replace the stock studs. The adaptor is counter-bored so that you use the full thread of the stock stud. The second set of studs are installed in the adaptor offset 22.5° so they fall in between the original holes. The second set of studs are the same length as the stock stud. These are adaptors not just a spacer.
Oh and I forgot to mention I'm using the original ball bearings with no problems also.
Denny Graham
Sandwich, IL

Many don't stop to realise that the bearings/spindles/knuckles/ and other suspension components were designed to withstand prolonged use with the truck LOADED. 99% of the re-done trucks will never see a load again other than a beer cooler so even with spacers the bearings and the rest of the parts are well within their design range. It's a different story if the truck is going to haul at it's maximum capacity and has spacers on it because that does increase bearing load beyond design.

If you choose to use spacers, please don't get the pot-metal ones that some aftermarket vendors sell. I've seen a few spacers that I'd be reluctant to be within two blocks of any vehicle running them. A good piece of machined steel custom-fabricated for a particular application might be OK, but don't cut corners on something as important as keeping the wheels on your truck. Cutting, bending, or grinding on steering parts can have some deadly consequences. The position and angle of the steering knuckles is engineered into the front end geometry, so don't go altering them unless you can do the math necessary to get it right.
Jerry

A small difference in spacing is not going to effect the wheel brgs. A few years ago when the fad was to put the wheels sticking out the fenders it put a heavy load on the brgs & caused failures.

I am having a similar problem with a dropped axle and newer style tie-rods. I talked to Sid Drapal and we came to the conclusion to remove the 2 lower bolts that hold on the backing plates / control arms, replace them with a little longer bolts, spacers between the spindle and control arms,to move the control arms in, and new lock nuts on the bolts. Of course we will have to run the tie rod in to compensate, but it is good for the length.
By the way, 15" rims, but with same offset as the stock rims!

I am thinking along the lines of what Bowtiefan (Dan) said, just unbolt the arm and space it out equal amounts front and rear and side to side. Use grade 8 bolts and steel spacers. Toe-in will have to be adjusted, but steering geometry will not be effected.

Wheel bearings should not be effected with your wider wheels, it sounds like you still have plenty of wheel under and behind the spindle. What will hurt them is a wide wheel with all of the offset to the outside, think of a low rider wheel.

Joe

Now that's the first time that I've heard of doing that Dan and I've been a regular here for going on five years. That sounds like a real good mod really easy to do if you have access to a lathe to make the spacers or you could make a one piece in a milling machine or as far as that goes that could be made in a drill press with a little care.
Generally the clearance problem is only 3/8-1/2", beats the hell out of the hundreds that I spent on the two adaptors. And mine were machined on a CNC from 6061 billets Jerry, and I'm sure that's why I've had absolutely no problem with them.
DG

I see a lot of these adapters made from aluminum. These are the ones with the second set of studs. Something bothers me about not using steel for this application.

And what woulod that be Fred?? 99% of tha cars today come with aluminum wheels now days stock from the factory.
6061-T4 or T6 is vastly different than cast aluminum or the softer grades of aluminum.

Denny Graham
Sandwich, IL

Yes Denny, that is just my own prejudice against the material! I think te adapters have aluminum studs too! I have a set of the steel ones that I bought early in my project, but which I didn't use. I must say they are really heavy.

I have a related question - is there any reason not to buy larger wheels (say 18") so that they clear the tie-rod? Assuming that the backspacing did not hit anything else, is there any reason for the tie rod not to protrude within the wheel diameter as long as it does not hit anything?

Yeah I can understand that Fred, but when you've pull 9g pull-ups pointed straight at the ground at 800ft altitude with aluminum fittings that you built your self, you develop a different feel for properly made aluminum components.
Denny G

re 18" wheels: That is the way everything fit with the original 17" split rims. The lip of the rim is in a different place where it doesn't interfere.

I think you guys are confusing spacers with adaptors, just spacers will never fail, made from aluminum or steel. Adaptors made from cast aluminum or pot metal could fail, but billet aluminum is unlikely to fail.
But for adaptors I think I would prefer steel even though a stud pulling through a billet aluminum adaptor would be very unlikely if its tightened properly.
And huge wheel offset would be a lot tougher on spindles than just spacers.

The spacers will work great but now a new problem. The lugs are to short... haha. I should be able to get these from my local parts store right?

Should be able to. They'll have to cross reference them by knurl size (diameter and length), then see what's available in a longer thread length. It won't hurt anyhting if you have to go .001" to .002" larger on the diameter on the knurl, same for length of the knurl, just don't go smaller. You may need to check into race spec studs to get a longer thread.

I bought some rear studs for my 1 Ton from LMC. I believe they have the same knurl as the front but they are longer studs.

Thanks guys. I have been looking around for the specs. I live a good bit away from a parts store so I was going to order them. Can anyone give me the specs on the stock stud. Knurl size? Or what I should order? thanks for the help guys

the rear studs worked like a charm with the half inch spacers. Thanks a lot

Did you find an answer to your question about larger wheels? I am thinking of getting big wheels/tires for my 3800 for better speed.