The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area Engine Shop dual master w/ Saginaw

Hey all,
I am thinking of upgrading to a non-power drum/drum dual master, keeping it in the stock location. I have searched the archives but still have questions. I have Patrick's Saginaw 4 speed and want to know if there is enough room to do this. Has anyone done this swap successfully? Are there any differences between the asst. after-market brackets?

Chuck

Bump

Anyone else done this??

Normally,there aren't any clearance issues with mounting the dual conversion bracket and a non-power booster on the AD chassis. However, it isn't just a simple bolt-on application. The single feed stock system has to be split into front and rear and plumbed into the master.

I initially did this upgrade on my 54 with standard transmission. However, with the entire system upgraded, dual M/C, wheel cylinders, shoes, and all lines, I found that the brakes were not up to par with the modern vehicles in traffic. I had to exercise extreme caution when
navigating in traffic....I just didn't have the stopping power for today's flow. I added a front discs, mid 70's Corvette manual disc/drum master (AutoZone) and the required proportioning valve and residual valves from Summit Racing. There is a world of difference.

You didn't ask, but I feel obligated to encourage you to upgrade to front discs. The conversion is not cheap or for that matter easy, but neither is rear-ending some car that ducks in front of you and then does a panic stop or turn.

I've added a couple sites that have a wealth of INFORMATION about brake upgrades:

www.ecihotrodbrakes.com
www.mpbrakes.com

Check them out. There is lot of info on conversions in the search feature on this site and the call will ultimately rest on your shoulders. I hope this helps.

Fla54,
Thanks for your input...I have often looked at your site, great picture trail, and great looking truck !!!

I live in a mostly rural area, drive on two lane and state 4 lanes and rarely travel over 60mph, (most important I don't live in Florida home of speed demons and uncounted senior citizens )so I am just wanting the added safety factor of the dual master. I agree with you though on staying up with the traffic flow, especially on the interstate and in the city, better to have the discs and be safe. Disc brakes and front-end rebuild are next on the list when the $$$$ is available. I have been on those links you mentioned, as well as others, good info there but not with my tranny.

My question comes from reading somewhere that there is not enough room for the plumbing when using the Saginaw 4-speed. I was hoping that someone would chime-in that has attempted this.

I have an e-mail in to Patrick's, but haven't heard back from them yet.

Chuck

Hey Chuck, Thanks for the compliment. My response was based on my seeing the Saginaw 4 speed that was on the 1960 engine that I recently bought. It can be seen(just barely) on page 11 of my Webshots. Maybe somebody will chime in with some more specific info.

When you split your existing system you're going to have to fabricate some new lines....I'm not aware of any that are preformed for such a conversion. The drum/drum master his internal residual valves so if you do encounter any fitment problems you can just form your lines to hook up. When you go to remove the original lines from the brass union on the frame there is a good chance that they will be damaged and you'll wind up having to fabricate new lines anyways. A coil of 3/16" brakeline and a double flare tool are a good investment. When you do the discs it will be absolutely necessary. And double flares are not rocket science.

Your absolutely right about the drivers down here...especially with the snowbirds and their big rigs. You're fortunate to have some rural space left to enjoy your truck.

chuck ...

I have done Patricks Saginaw upgrade and one thing is for certain you do not have enough room for the power booster that mounts in the original location. I don't know the width of the dual master cylinder that you are talking about so can't say for sure.

Give Patrick a call and ask for him. I went down and saw him the other day and he said if anyone had any questions to give him a call. Let him know you found out information from StoveBolt ..he'll be tickled. I know for certain that he uses a remote hydrovac on his trucks with the saginaw conversion ... which is what I am going to end up using.

Let me know if I can provide you some measurements / pictures.