The Stovebolt Site Forums The Parking Lot Big Bolts 1959 GMC 860

Well, I figured it was time to start a thread about my new project.
After I finished my 1946 Chevy COE 2-Ton Flatbed, I started attending a few local shows and it wasn’t long before I had the opportunity to see a 1959 GMC 860 and I was hooked.

It is owned by a fellow ATHS Balt / Wash Chapter member. The more I participated in the ATHS, the more I started thinking about having a Big Big Bolt to transport my Big Bolt.

I looked for an 860 for a while and finally found the older brother of one in the form of a 1972 GMC 9500.

I had some fun with that truck for about a year and a half but the desire to own an 860 was still there. I actually ended up with 2 of them but this is the truck that I am restoring and will one day be my transporter truck

(There is a cool tow vehicle that we used to do the 1200 mile trip in. Its a 1959 Reo with a cummins and a 10 speed Road Ranger)

The truck was in the beginning stages of restoration when I got it so it wasn’t hard to take it all apart again to get it painted.

It will be painted to match my ‘46 Chevrolet.
I got it in late February and am making progress but have a long way to go.

I just picked the cab and other sheet metal up from the painter on Friday and am very pleased.

I figure the progress will slow somewhat from this point but will update from time to time.

Billy

WOW !, Congratulations on that Score Bill. That's going to be an "AWESOME" truck. Those 860's are pretty unique trucks, because they actually incorporated the early Advance Design/New Design round edge early GMC styling, with the later, Task Force '55-'59 styling(the nose of the front clip). I looked at buying a '58, or '59 860 Wrecker some years ago, now wishing, I had purchased it. I sent you a PM.

Thanks Spanky. Yep, they are definitley unique but different and I think thats cool.
Was'nt that Wrecker you mentioned the same one that came up for sale recently on Ebay? I think we may have even chatted about it in a thread.
That truck/Ebay auction was what really got me going again on buying a 860. I wonder what happened to that truck. If I recall it was in NC, maybe Raleigh?

Billy

You've got some great looking trucks! Not many people have gone thru all the work that you've done to restore these early heavy trucks, the attention to detail makes them really stand out. I especially like the 860 tandem axle tractor!!
I remember the 860 model wrecker recently on ebay, it was marked, I believe, Barnetts wrecker service in Chapel Hill, NC. I think the wrecker was located further west in NC, maybe Lexington, NC??? From what I remember the starting bid was $1700 and it didn't receive any bids.

Looking forward to future pics and details about your trucks...

JAMES

Yeah, that was indeed the Wrecker, I was talking about. It made it's rounds around my area, then went to the Chapel Hill area. When it was on ebay recently, it was located near Reidsville, N.C.(about 20 miles from me).

Look'n good Billy!!!

What shape is the drive train in?

Mike B

James, Spanky-yep that was the one. Wonder what happened to it. It might not have been in to bad a shape. Seems to me the seller had some inconsistances in his listing (I think it was listed as a 1969 860). Might have made a good project truck. I almost went to look at it. James, just to be clear, the beautiful tandem axle belongs to a fellow ATHS chapter member. It is definitley what started the madness for me though!!



Mike B-Really little known about the drivetrain other than the PO said it ran great (don't they all) when he bought it. I plan to have it looked at real good before it goes back together. I am also considering an axle upgrade for the rear (better brakes and something that will give me a little better highway speed, need to plan a trip to Jacksons!)

Billy

Too sweet Billy! The combo of that truck hauling your COE is going to blow peoples minds! Make sure you have it completed by this September so you can bring it to Winchester. You've got 4 months... ready, set, GO!

George

George, it would take several weekends with all ODSS members wrenching away and a nice winning lottery ticket to be done by September. I will do my best to have it ready by September of '11!
The teaser is by the time I got the paint done on the '46, everything else was basically done and it was just a matter of putting back together. This project is a little backwards. The paint is done but not much else.

Had a good day yesterday in the shop listening to some good music and working on trucks!

Billy

When you have enough work ready to go, you need to call a meeting of the ODSS brothers. I'll be there with bells on!
I can't wait to see that beast completed.

George

Billy;
That is some sweet looking heavy metal you got there and a big shop to boot. Nice to see the Mrs. giving a helping hand. She probably already has ideas about driving that rig.
Wish my shop was that clean at the moment.
Keep the pictures coming.
Hey George, I think we can do a NAPCO conversion on this rigG, that will increase the cool factor 10 fold.

Johnny G

I'm with you Johnny G! I just happen to have the front axle and t-case needed for such a swap... at no charge to my brother Billy.

George

Billy...went thru your webshots photos, its obvious you've finding clean, solid units from somewhere other than the east coast area, certainly not found in NC. That 9500 series you sold to John M. looks really nice and solid, clean as a pin...was it restored or found that way? We had a couple of GMC 9500 tractors, both pulling tandems, with 6-71 Detroits that gave good service, even though we constantly overloaded them by pulling 25 ton loads. The biggest problem we had with the 6-71 was cracking the head thru overheating, that long cast iron head won't handle alot of heat. Anyway its good to see you putting together a beautiful and rare BIG bolt that few of us have ever seen. The 860 series has such a unique appearance to it that it stands out by itself, to me much nicer than the Cannonball and other similar style GMC's.

JAMES

A Napco 860?! Now that would be a one of a kind thats for sure.

James, the 9500 came from Tennessee where I think it spent most of its life. It only had 132,000 miles on it when I bought it. All I had to do was clean it up a bit and add some minor things like the fenders, bumper, roof lights, etc. It is a very nice truck which John Milliman now owns.
Yep, I am kind of fond of the styling of the 860. I hope I can make steady progress on it. I can't wait to see the finished product myself.

Thanks,
Billy

DANGER Will Robinson!!

Dude, like, wave off from the offer to help wrench on your truck!!!! They made that same offer to me on my pristine/cherry '53 2-ton I was prepping for Hershey and the AACA Grand National this year and all I had left after the attack of the truck piranhas was an engine block and a small chunk out of the left frame rail ...

It all sounds nice and friendly ... but your truck apparently is the next tasty cow wondering too close to the river!

We finally have the Grand Poobah chiming in on this thread , bout time there pilgrim.
I do detect a bit of envy

Johnny G

JM, you may have a point there and the permanent reminder is sitting in Peg's rock garden. I do need to put this truck BACK together. Not sure if the ODSS can work in this direction.....


JohnboyG, he ain't hatin, hes got his own pretty sweet Detroit, in fact hes working on a second one. Then I will be the one envious....

Willard

Billy;
Bet yours is done first. Now them some fighting words injun.
ODSS or not, darn the torpedoes, FULL STEAM AHEAD with the project.


Johhny G

Billy ... Indeed. Isn't it curious that I was making so much progress on the '53, and then George & crew show up to do the cow in the Amazon River piranha attack on it. And then he goes down and wins the 2nd best truck on the planet trophy ... Not making any accusations, just pointing out facts here.

Johnny G ... Get into a contest with the coal dawg?? I've already lost THAT one. Except ... my dog can kick his cat's butt!

Anyway, pretty safe bet (consider that I'm 11 years and counting into my last project ...) that Billy will get his Detroit project on the road first. I saw his 860 in progress at the body shop and then after the paint was dry and it is going to be tough to beat -- the pictures don't do it justice. It is going to be a heart stopper. Men will look upon it and weep.


John

John and Bill I aint weepin but I sure is droolin, you both have some beautiful trucks for sure. I have to be getting along almost time for work, but I will be making it back here as soon as I have the time to go though all those great pictures for sure. Great work Bill and John I am watching to see what you and Grigg come up with for that diesel swap I am sure that will be another sweet one.

Thanks Grant! It will be a long road but fun!

Billy

Looks great,please keep the pic coming. I hope to get mine started.

Mr. G, will do but I want to see the same from your project!
I wouldn't be surprised if we end up chatting from time to time through the course of our projects, especially since I bought my mine largely dissasembled.

My big accomplishment yesterday was building a box to send my parts (primarily to hold the grill bars) to the chromer.
Baby steps I guess but something off the list..

Billy

Looks like you're making good progress!
Can't wait to see it together and better yet hear it run. Let me know when you expect to start it and I'll see what I can do to help.

Grigg

Thanks Grigg.
I sent a bunch of items off to the chrome shop. Still trying to get some of the fluff stuff done now. Sort of backwards but it will be nice to have this all done when it is time to put it back together.
I want to fire the motor soon but need a few things before that happens like batteries and cables, fan belts, oil and a temporary fuel tank etc. What else do you think I will need. I may need some tips on wiring.
I found a guy right around the corner from me that does soda and media blasting. I am going to take him my fuel tanks this week. For some reason they were painted at some point. I could go the aircraft stripper route but I would have a lot more time and labor than the $100 the guy is going to charge me. These tanks will not be polished or shiney but have a sort of satin or brushed look. I am hoping the soda blasting will give me that look or close to it. We will see.
Need to start thinking about the rear and/or the trans......and what to do with them.

I should have a few more pictures soon.

Billy

If you've seen the aluminum fuel tank on my truck that's exactly the look you should expect. I like it.

We'll want to check the injectors and a few other items before starting it, ensure the emergency flapper works, and have a C02 fire extinguisher handy as a backup.
Grigg

Not a whole lot to update but I did get the stuff back from the soda blaster
Before
http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2092913760083734483iObYSr

http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2772199100083734483fLHRKZ

After
http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2878718280083734483HUxKwV

http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2154158860083734483iCAefA

The tanks are nice and clean but a little blotchy. I experimented with some steel wool and a little mothers polish on the back of one of them and I don't think it will be too hard to accomplish the sheen I want. I saw a video of a guy refurbishing some semi tanks and he used a scotch pad on a orbital sander/polisher. I may try that route too.

I have also been trying to figure out what to do with the rear. One of the concerns is the old style wedge brakes. Maxi's are the preferred route but if the existing are rebuilt with new shoes, for a hobby truck, they may be fine. I also jacked the rear and was trying to determine the current rearend ratio. The 2sp motor is not attached but with the 2 speed "rod" that sticks out of the rear where the motor attaches, pushed to the drivers side, the yoke turns 3 1/4 turns for one tire revolution (10-20's). With the rod pushed towards the passenger side, the yoke spins 2 1/3 time to the tire. Can any of you rear and gear experts tell me what this means. I was expecting a 4:11 or higher ratio this doesn't seem right...

Billy

Billy,
Did you have one wheel turning, or both turning equally?
If both together then the numbers you have are your ratios, but sounds way to high.
If you leave one wheel still and count turns on the other let it turn twice, then the number of yoke turns to do so is your ratio.
Doing this with a factor of 10 and then dividing makes for a more accurate figure. (so let one wheel turn 20 times and divide yoke turns by 10).

Grigg

Grigg, only one wheel turned.

Billy,

The gear tooth count should be stamped on the end of the pinion shaft. It should look like 6-39 which equals 6.50:1 and would be the "High" gear ratio. If you have a Eaton the low range will be 1.36 times the High range, so in this sample the 6.50 high would have a 8.84 Low.

Mike B

OK thanks. I am going to go back out to the shop and see what I can find.

Billy

I first rotated the wheel twice and pretty much figured it out that it is a 4:88. Then I scrubbed off the end of the shaft and confirmed;

EATON 48819 8 39 J H 22 48


Thanks Mike and Grigg.
Looks like I still will be in search of a new rear if I want to be able to keep up with the convoy....

Billy

Billy,

Do you have OD?

With 10.00x20 at 42.25" tall and Direct Drive (1:1) at the trans with you 4.88 rear you'll get about 51mph at 2000 rpm or 64 mph at 2500 rpm. If you have .8 OD it bumps up to 64 mph at 2000 rpm (way better!).

Mike B

4.88 was a common ratio for the 50's because most states still had a 45 mph speed limit for trucks. Although the engines are rated at 2100 most pumps were set at 2300 which allowed close to 60 mph. 4.33 and 4.11 were the fast ratios of the 60's. Is the 2 speed in high or low. If its in low, high would probably be around 4.11 which is as fast as your 671 will break the wind anyway. Are you talking about the truck you posted on May 23? If so, the picture with the cab hanging from an A frame clearly shows S cam brakes. Spring brakes will bolt right on to where the single chambers were. Did someone tell you that they were wedge brakes or are we talking about 2 different trucks. You will of course have to plumb for the spring brakes, but that's no big deal. I'm not so sure that the wedge brakes were available until the mid 60's and were short lived in popularity. Truck frames have been 34" for over 60 years and almost any rear end will fit. However, 2 speeds became obsolete in the 70's when hp ratings and torque ratings almost doubled.

Alright so my lack of knowledge on these trucks maybe showing. So what kind of brakes do I have? The cab on the gantry is the same truck. Here is a closer look at the brakes I have.

http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2645494550083734483dSHNAm

http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2501062100083734483izrZQQ

I guess I need some more education on the difference in "wedge", "spring" and maxi brakes.

Also on the rear, I have determined that the trans is Spicer, 6853C which is a 5 speed overdrive. The literature I have says I should have a Eaton rear axle with 4.87-6.32 ratios. Unfortunately, the speed chart shows the mph with these components at 52! That ain't going to work for any long distance. I have file of paper work that came with the truck and one piece of literature says the hp should be 192 and the other says either 189 or 210.


Billy

I'm not an expert on air brakes either. But I'm sure you don't have wedge brakes.
They look like normal S cam brakes to me.
I understand that you can swap out the single brake chambers for "maxibrake" or "piggy back" or "spring brake" chambers, all used to describe the same thing. There will be some plumbing involved and I'm not sure about different valves?

What injectors does your engine have? Pull the valve cover and look at the little round tag. I can then tell you what the book says the HP should be.

Grigg

I will check to see what injectors I have.

OK, so that is good. S cam brakes are what I want, right? The whole truck needs to be replumbed so I don't see that as a problem.

Billy

Billy,

Good news, you have "S" Cam brakes! The brake actuator pushes on the crank arm which twists the shaft that goes through the backing plate. The other end of the shaft has an S-shaped cam between the brake shoes that when rotated via the crank on the other end expands the shoes out to the drum.

The Maxi Brakes are a second actuator piggy backed on the the rear axle actuators. There is a large spring inside this actuator that pushes against the crank arm setting the brakes on a lose of air. When you see an air brake truck pull in to park and then hear a loud burst of air, that's them pulling out the yellow air switch on the dash that dumps the Maxi brake air allowing the springs to set the brakes.

To set your truck up for maxi's you will need the maxi brake actuators and do a little airline work and add the switch to the dash.

As for truck speed, there are on-line calculators that ask for tire diameter (10.00x20 should be about 42-1/4"), transmission final ratio (direct is 1:1, OD could be .8:1) and rpm (DD should be OK at 2000 I think) to give you mph. See what you come up with...

Mike B

Well, thats good news about the brakes.
I will check into the calculators.
I didn't even think to compare the brakes that are on Freds truck which is still here and has a later model rear under it, so I will take some pictures and some notes on the plumbing for when I get to that stage in the project.

Thanks,
Billy

If you do indeed have a 5 speed with a .80 overdrive, it will go about 64 at 2100. If you want to go any faster, turn up the rpm's. They used to let buses go 2450 with the same engine you have. If you get any faster gears, you will never see high gear anyway. You must remember you have about half the horse power and about a third of the torque of todays engines and no aerodynamics. Spring brakes is the only way to park a truck the size of yours. Before spring brakes, we had to rely on blocks, etc. And the first spring brakes were junk too. It wasn't until the 70's that Anchorlock invented spring brakes that worked. If you want spring brakes, go to any heavy truck or trailer dealer and ask for a pair of 30/30 spring brakes and about 20 feet of Synflex tubing and some fittings. You will need a single spring push button for the dash. They became obsolete in the 80's, but they are still around. I probably have some in the shop I never threw away. Find an air supply, plumb it to the dash button and then to the spring brakes. You can T it at the axle housing. I prefer to put a rubber air brake house at the axle housing to give it more flexibility. In order to drive you push the button in. To park, you pull it out. If the air pressure drops below about 50 lbs. it will pop out and set the brakes. Spring brakes is the only way to park a truck the size you have.