The Stovebolt Site Forums The Parking Lot Big Bolts Lug Nut Trouble!

I can't for the life of me get the lug nuts free on the driver side front and rear of my '63 L60. 424 ft/lb rattle gun, no movement. 1" Drive breaker bar with 4'galv cheater pipe, bent the breaker bar.

The local Les Schwab shop supposedly had these off in 2004 when they gave me an "borderline satisfactory" inspection when I bought it and prepared to drive it from Montana to Washinton.

I've squirted it down good to work the corrosion. Suggestions? Would heating up with small MAP gas torch help?

Are they stud centered BUDD wheels?
If so the drivers side should be left hand thread, try turning them clockwise.
Also look on the end of the inner nut for an "L" or an "R" sometimes they'll give you a little clue like that.

If you've really overtightened them you may be in for some new studs and nuts and inspect the holes in the wheels carefully.

Grigg

Really? Would that be common and/or factory? I'm fairly confident other than the 80's era SB350 and maybe the Brownie aux 3sp everything else is original as built. I will try afterwork. That would be excellent if my ignorance to that has me simply turning the wrong way.

RW

It's not uncommon to have LH threads on the driver's side of the big rigs. Look at the threads sticking out of the nut, wire brush if necessary, and try to follow the helix of the thread to see which way the nut would tighten. Most of the time, the stud will have a big "L" stamped into the end of it if you've got a wrong-handed thread!
Jerry

All stud piloted Budd type wheels are supposed to have left handed threads on the driver side. However it is not uncommon to find a right handed thread on the driver side because someone broke off a stud and either didn't care or he only had a right handed stud on hand. I wouldn't tackle a stud mount with wrench of less than 1200 ft. lb. if its been exposed to salt or corrosives. You can rattle all you want on the outer nut to get it off, but be careful with the inner nut. I prefer to use heat on an inner nut on an older vehicle that has inboard drums because if I brake a stud, it means pulling the hub and then running into the possibility of not finding the correct. Inner nuts are an over the counter item at any truck or trailer shop and only cost a buck or two each.

NO "L" on the ends and looking at the helix of the thread portion that I can see appears pretty clear they are unfortunately RH threaded. I was attempting to turn the correct direction. So the truck is currently not movable as I pulled the master and slave cylinders and removed the brake cylinders from the passenger side for rebuild (the whole reason this topic came up). Doing this outside at another property I have where I park the truck. I don't have a way to get 1200 ft/lb on her. (Even if I borrowed the tool from a buddy, I assume a portable pancake compressor will not feed the need of a big impact wrench).
I'm off tomorrow and will try some heat with cheater bar and if no luck maybe get a service truck call out to break em free. Any other suggestions? Still seems odd though, the passenger side was tough but I did it by hand (and leg) using the 18" breaker bar and did not have to use the 4' cheater pipe.

RW

Ok, I'm not sure if this is "working truck" safe or not, and I know the issue isn't rust since they were supposedly off recently, but how about some good ol heat? That is what I would try. Heat em up, tap em while they are hot and then try the breaker bar. I don't know if this will compromise the strength, but sounds like you may have to replace them anyway.... I don't think I'd go red hot unless you intend to re grease, and be careful of the shoes. Even moderate heat should expand things enough to give you the edge you need.

I'm surprised you can't get them with a 3/4" drive breaker bar and a cheater pipe?
In the spring Billy, Cosmo, Sweet and I removed a set of wheels from a truck for John, in a junk yard in a brier patch. It took us half the day, but a 6-8' pipe and they all eventually came loose. They were Budd wheels and did have left hand threads on the left. Some of them were extremely tight, took two of us bouncing on the pipe at once

Before you call the service truck I'd get a stout breaker bar and a longer pipe.

Grigg

If they are actually stud piloted Budd wheels with an inner and outer nut, both the nuts are across the counter items. You will probably want to buy new ones any way. Go ahead and get them red hot and they will come off. I have seen people get hurt bouncing around on a cheater pipe and still wind up using heat. Back 40 or 50 years ago, before we had impact wrenches, we used a torque multiplier made by Ken tool on our petroleum tankers where we weren't comfortable using a torch. Just make sure you don't damage the studs that are in the hub. They may be hard to find.

When I took the wheels off of my fire engine I used a cross-bar lug wrench with a 6 foot long 3" diameter cheater pipe. I set the outboard side of the lug wrench on a jack stand to keep it level while I stood on the pipe. My 1/2" impact didn't do anything except make a lot of noise.

Good luck!

Mike B

ken tool might have the torque multipler i got mine from snapon some years ago and its done me some good service when i was in the army, a slap wrench is also a option ive used in the past i think mac still has the multiplier for sale in therir catalogue under the no#td100-r for a 2000ftlb model have fun my tools were originally bought for working on tanks and artillery so ive got a eclictic mix for working on my stovebolt joe

Using a large cheater bar make sure all wheels are chocked. With a 6 ft bar and no brakes I could roll my trucks without breaking lugnuts loose. Wouldn't want you to rock truck off blocks or jack stands you have holding up passenger side. Took several sessions of heating nuts and applying penetrating oil to get drivers side steer axle wheel off the 54.

Conway, ya might try giving Les Schwab a call. they have road rescue rigs that deal with big rigs, construction equipment, etc. They have the 1' splined imact wrenches that look like a jack hammer and the air to push them.

I had similar issues with the wheels on my truck. I removed the wheel/s, drum, and hub as one unit, loaded them in my pickup with a hoist, and took them to LS to have them take it all apart at the shop. Total cost: $0.
Back the adjusters all the way down, remove the hub nuts, and slide them out. I had a flat surface and a ATV jack, but if you're in the dirt, with some help, a sheet of plywood, and a floor jack you can do the same without messing up your bearings or hub threads.

If I'm gathering correctly from your name you are in Conway, I'm just over the water on Whidbey if you need a hand.

Success! Yesterday morning I looked things over closely to ensure each stud was RH threaded, they are. Still after several days now of squirting PB Blaster before and after work my 1" Drive breaker bar with 4' cheater pipe would not move any of them. The answer was simply 60 seconds of the little torch with can of MAP gas (not propane). What a difference a little heat makes. They were hot but not red hot. After 60 seconds of heat I gave a squirt of the PB Blaster and then immediately gave slow steady two hand pressure with the cheater bar. Each one came loose nicely!

Additional tricks I was told by some farming freinds in their shops if the above didn't work immediately were to heat, spray with the PB and let sit overnight. Said the heat help sucks the fluid in. Then next day heat again and put the bar or impact on it. Another is to take an oversized deep impact socket that just clears the nut and touches the wheel. Give a few whacks with a 5 lb. mallet to break the seize between back of the nut face and the wheel surface.

I now have all my drums off and verified my left rear brake cylinders were the only fuctional brakes on the rig. Yikes!! Anyone know if brake parts are readily available still? I'll check with NAPA Friday.

Wheel cylinders are still available from Carquest. I'm sure NAPA has them also.

When I brought my beast home from Stanwood only one of the rear drums worked, and only on one of the two cylenders. Fronts were rusted solid. Such a small amount of fluid was needed it explains why the brakes worked at all with a dead booster and a leaky master.

Most of them are still available new, NAPA definately has them as I had to go into the 60's trucks to find parts for my '56. It does make a big difference on who's workn the counter, my local shop has some guys that know those books VERY well.

Front brakes and master are easy enough, back end could depend on what's on it. I replaced my whole system with the exception of the rear cylenders, those I just honed & rebuilt. NAPA here in Oak Harbor had everything I needed, most of it in stock.
Shoes and drums are an issue, the good news is you can have the shoes relined.
I had my park brake (drum on back of trans) shoes relined thru a local truck shop for a reasonable price, you can also get some help for the odd items from the local tractor shops too.