The Stovebolt Site Forums The Parking Lot Big Bolts Anyone know how to disassemble Barton Pumps?

I wanted to go through the pump on my fire truck. It's a Barton-American model A 3907. I can't get it to go in gear. It's driven off the front of the engine. I have partially disassembled it but I don't want to go any further at risk of breaking something. Any help would be appreciated.

I do not. I'd recommend you call Historian/Archivist: Tom Herman - (804) 590-1239 with the Old Dominion Historical Fire Society. Web site: http://www.odhfs.org/ I swear he knows everything about fire trucks!

"I can't get it to go in gear." I take that to mean that there is a mechanical connection between the crankshaft and pump, i.e., a PTO. I'm assuming a front mounted pump. If correct then that would seem to be where your problem lies. Lots of highway maintenance trucks used to be set up that way before constant drive hydraulic pumps came along. Goes like this:
Crankshaft adaptor flange to short driveshaft to PTO, then out of PTO to pump.
If a frame mounted pump then it still must have some mechanical drive system to operate and I'd look there if it were me.

It is a front mount pump with a gear reduction box mounted to it. It has a short driveshaft coming off the crank pulley to the gear box. The shaft spins freely until the shift lever engages the pump. It seems to me that this shift lever is stuck and it will not move at all. I need to get the pump and gear box apart to see what the problem is. I will contact Mr. Herman and see what he can tell me. Thanks

If you want, you can mention I recommended you call him. My real name is Bill Bailey. Good luck with the pump!

Adam,

My front-mounted Darley had the same problem. Turned out the clutch had completely disintegrated. Mine is off to the pump doctor now being rebuilt.

In addition to Bill's great advice, you might try calling Barton. I called the customer service number on the Darley web site and found myself talking to one of the Darley's -- he copied the manual for my pump, plus found all the paperwork on my pump dating back to 1952 when they sold it. He sent it all to me for postage!

You never know what a phone call or two might do for you -- give it a whirl.


John

I called Mr. Herman and he is going to make me a copy of a diagram for the pump and mail it to me. Maybe that will tell me what I need to know.

Good luck calling Barton! Pump was manufactured by the American Fire Apparatus company, in battle Creek, Michigan, and went out of business in the '70s, I think. Mr. Milliman is, in that regard, lucky to have a Darley - they're in business as we speak, good company.

Good news is, there were LOADS of these pumps made and sold. Even over-seas. Used on trailer pumps during WWII.

Adam, if you've still got the id tag on the pump, front-side below the discharge valve, you can pull the patent numbers. Then hop over to the US Patent Office web site, plug 'em in, and you should be able to get a copy e-mailed to you. I did this with mine 6 years ago. May cost $10 or 15 bucks. The patent(s) include some diagrams that may be useful.

If the shaft turns until the pump lever is raised, the pump itself is frozen for some reason. Most likely culprit is rust and scale freezing the impeller to the body. Spray the heck out of the impeller and work it back and forth by hand until it loosens up.

If that doesn't do it, you're right, gears may be frozen, and tear-down is indicated.


-Michael

Well, once again, turns out I MAY be wrong. Dug up literature for the Barton Pump. Turns out I have an operations manual for Barton pumps, dated 08/87, from AMERICAN GODIVA pump company, which is still in business today, I THINK. They must have bought out Barton/American fire Pumps at some point.

Be interesting to be able to get parts for a pump that was initially created in the 1920s!!!

-Michael