I have a 53 3600. Running 16-inch wheels with a 1/2'' (about) spacer behind the rim. Still experiencing issues with tie rod interference on the rims. My goal is to replace the rear diff and get rid of the torque tube and make the truck more suitable for modern roads.
To start this project would like to add front disk brakes but wanted to ask if the front disk brake conversion will move the wheel outward enough to alleviate the tie rod interference and I can get rid of the wheel spacers?
If you're running stock drum brakes and have interference with your rims and steering arms, then your rims are not correct. Your truck would have had 4.5" wide 16" rims from the factory. If your rims are significantly wider than that, it would be where your problem lies. You should use rims with different offset to move them outward (and ditch the spacers, which are never a good idea from a safety standpoint.)
Moving your post over to Driveline where it'll be more on topic.
Kevin 1951 Chevy 3100 work truck Follow this saga in Project Journal Photos 1929 Ford pickup restored from the ground up. | 1929 Ford Special Coupe (First car) Busting rust since the mid-60's If you're smart enough to take it apart, you darn well better be smart enough to put it back together.
I agree. Different rims would help and get rid of the spacers, just seems like rims that size fall into the unobtanium realm--and just put new tires on the truck. However, the ultimate goal is to get the truck where it will go down the road 60-65mph and would like to ensure that the truck will stop in a reasonable distance before I try to change out the rear end and make the truck go faster.
Unobtanium? Rims what size? 16x4.5? Those are readily available used for probably $20 each. But the issue with them is modern tire sizes work best with wider rims.
You'll need to figure out what the proper width and offset would be needed for your drum brakes (and likely for disc conversions) which normally put the wheel mounting surface in the same place as the drums.
Kevin 1951 Chevy 3100 work truck Follow this saga in Project Journal Photos 1929 Ford pickup restored from the ground up. | 1929 Ford Special Coupe (First car) Busting rust since the mid-60's If you're smart enough to take it apart, you darn well better be smart enough to put it back together.
The only way I'm comfortable using spacers is by installing longer studs and using the spacer as a - - - - -spacer- - - - -between the axle flange and the wheel, etc.!
"It is better to be silent and be thought a fool than to speak and eliminate all doubt!" - Abraham Lincoln Cringe and wail in fear, Eloi- - - - -we Morlocks are on the hunt! There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self. - Ernest Hemingway Love your enemies and drive 'em nuts!
To answer your original question, yes, disk brakes usually move the tire / wheels out some. Some kits more than others. On that note, most of the kits replace the 6 lug wheels with five, 4 3/4 - 5, so your wheel issue may change anyway. There probably are kits with six lug hubs, but I haven't looked. My '37 truck has a newer front axle, early '50s maybe, it has a kit from MasterPower Brake, installed in 1999, uses '70's Camaro/Firebird rotors and calipers. The newer kits are using the later model metric rotors and calipers. What you want is a kit that uses common, easy to get replacement parts. Mine has all standard parts except the caliper bracket which is custom made for the application.
I have a '50 3600 with the 8 lug wheel pattern and have installed a disk brake conversion kit I bought on E-Bay. It was listed for a '55-?? truck but was able to be installed on my truck with a small modification.
My truck had 17" wheels which cleared everything without spacers and I have now updated to a standard Chevy 16" wheel that also clears without a spacer.
I did update the tie rod ends to the modern type which may be the difference.
FYI, I also converted the rear axle to a more recent 14-bolt Chevy rear axle using the tech tip information found on this site.
I also installed the Fleabay disc kit on my 49 3600 - Performance Online I believe.
I forget the measurements, but I worked out what backspace I needed and went down to the local tire shop. We don't have much choice up here, but they were able to order me in rims that clear everything. They don't look stock but that was of little matter to me.
I had in my stash some white spoke 8 lugs that actually cleared everything but they were 16.5", would have saved me some $$ but. Whatever.
1949 Chevrolet 3/4 Ton - Still Solid. Regular Driver OT Vehicles: 1925 Hudson Brougham Super Six 1950 Chevrolet Styline (Parts) 1952 Canuck Pontiac Sedan Delivery (Well Underway) 1973 F250 4x4 Highboy 1977 F250 4x4 Lowboy
Brothers Trucks makes a 6 lug conversion. Also Nostalgia Sid's sells 6 lug conversion kits. I think there are one or two others, but can't remember them at the moment.
Want to thank everyone for the comments and great information. Interesting that there is a 6-lug conversion. For now, believe I will order the 16x7 8 Lug | 8X6.5" bolt | 4" backspace wheels from Coker Tire and use LT235/85R16 tires--staying with front drum brakes. At present, don't believe I will operate the truck much over 55-60 and that would be for the 10-15 miles into and back from town.
The end goal is to do a complete axel swap with a later 14-bolt and maybe an engine/trans swap along with that.
I have worked this problem for decades with various wheels and settled on a solution. But now, with 17" tubeless wheels maybe there is a 8 on 6-1/2 one with a proper offset that clears the tie rods and has 1/2 in stud holes or nuts that can accommodate 9/16 stud holes.
History The first success I had was 16 in Ford steelies which have enough back-spacing and 6-1/2 in. width but I wanted a better look. I finally settled on 16 inch alloys with zero offset and 6" width. They look good but not stock with 10 vent holes. The wider wheels with zero offset will hit the tie rods, while the wider wheels with enough offset to clear the tie rods move the centerline of the tire out too far and make it hard to park and handle at anything above about 35 mph -- worse loaded. The originals had a 7/16 positive offset so zero is acceptable to me, whereas negative 1 in. makes it hard to drive; it follows any pavement irregularities like ruts, etc.
1951 3800 1-ton "Earning its keep from the get-go" In the DITY Gallery 1962 261 (w/cam, Fenton headers, 2 carbs, MSD ign.), SM420 & Brown-Lipe 6231A 3spd aux. trans, stock axles & brakes. Owned since 1971.
I took this picture yesterday. I’m running 15” rims and a 2” spacer so everything fits. Ignore the lack of leaf springs as I am currently installing new ones today.
Will making the front track 4" wider screw up the Ackerman geometry?
'57 GMC 102, Original 347 V8, HydraMatic, 3.08 rear gear, added A/C, disk front brakes, HEI, AFB carb, '98 Honda Black Currant paint. T-boned and totaled 10/12 '52 GMC 152 Stake Bed, Original 228, SM420, added A/C, HEI, disk front brakes, '67 Chev 3.55 rear gear. Gets used as a real truck.
My truck is a 46 half ton, but, CPP has a 6 lug conversion kit. Also, I am going to a modern rim because of the clearance associated with the original rims. I have 16" rims and they do not clear the calipers due to the corners that are present in the back of the rim from the center section. And talking to several tire folk, the modern tires can have issues seating on the older narrower rims.
"it's only old if you can't find a use for it; otherwise it's cool and i'll use it."
Modern tires not seating on older narrower rims doesn't sound right to me. I have LT225/85 R16 tires mounted on the original 4 1/2" rims of The Phantom without difficulty. There may be some exceptions but I've never encountered the problem in my life and all I've ever owned are antique cars.
Your '46 rims will take modern radials without any problems but it's academic since they won't work with your brake setup.
I'm not sure the "tire folks" today have half a clue what they're doing with anything made in the 20th century.
1950 Chevrolet 3100 (Ol' Roy)
1939 Packard Standard Eight Coupe (The Phantom) | 1956 Cadillac Coupe de Ville (The Bismarck) | 1964 Ford Galaxie 500 coupe |1966 Ford Mustang (Little Red) | 1969 Pontiac GTO (The Dishpit) I 1979 Ford F-100 | 1976 Ford F-150 (Big Red) | 1995 Ford F-150 (Newt)
The issue I have had with tires "seating" on old rims is that it is increasingly difficult to find tires with a narrow enough section width to safely install.
It's possible to install modern, wider tires on the old narrow rims, but they might crown (wear excessively in the center) and wander on the road. A modern tire of 6" tread width should be OK on a 4.5" rim tho.
Not saying wider tires can't be installed or won't work, they might just be less than optimal. However if you aren't driving it a whole bunch, it might not matter. Also a slightly crowned, modern steel belted radial will still handle so much better than the old bias tires that it will be worlds better.
