The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area General Truck Talk 1958 Apache 31

I put a deposit down on this truck, but would love for you to pick it apart and tell me everything that’s wrong, aftermarket, incorrect etc or just worrisome
I have not seen the truck in person yet. Comes with cab corners and rockers.
Truck runs, drives, stops and is on the road.
Dash is cut up for radio, speakers in door panels, aftermarket steering wheel and seat…
Missing the name plates on fender, but I assume it’s an Apache 31.
261 engine
3 on the tree

https://photos.app.goo.gl/rLSKpyHEhteBsTiw7

Thanks!
Andy

I replied to your thread in the Welcome Centre. Didn't realize you had one here also. Sorry about that!

The hood emblem is for a 59 with a V8
It depends on what a person is looking for and how much work you want to do to it as well as the price.
Jim

Oh really? I didn’t realize there were different hood emblems depending on engine.
I’m just trying to find out what is aftermarket or incorrect at this point. I enjoy period correctness. I’d like it to be as correct/original as possible.
I will replace cab corners and rockers.

Way better condition than most. Several extras, rare big window and possible deluxe cab. A few non original items but a great buy. Very good Andy. Shipped from Washington. Ouch!
From what I see, your rust repairs are easy. Original floor matt is really neat.

Oh I see it now: the “V” shouldn’t be underneath the bow tie!
Thank you!

It’s already in NJ!
Could you explain deluxe cab and several extras?
And the non original items?
Thank you!!

A long ways from being factory stock. Not a stock seat, looks like a normal rust bucket. But then everyone thinks they are full of gold. I personally would not want it less it was super cheap.

Could you elaborate just a little bit on “long ways from factory stock”?
I already noticed the seat, steering wheel and speakers.
I’ve had a rust bucket before and I don’t consider this being one, but I certainly appreciate your thoughts!!

The hood emblem can be sold for good money if you choose to.
It is a possible deluxe cab. Some are real, some have been cloned with parts. Doesn't matter, there is no documentation or record to tell if ordered. You have the rare big rear window. (panoramic) Probably a person who orders that would order deluxe cab. In general the "custom cab equipment" was chrome bumpers. grille, headlight bezels, chrome windshield surround trim (missing but could have been there). Chrome wing window trim chrome and around side and rear windows. Chrome dash knobs, vent grilles, driver arm rest..... other "extras" you have are deluxe heater. Radio and overhead radio speaker, both arm rests (one gone), side spare? Dual visors? can't see it all.

Non original, you have already mentioned: steering wheel, seat...... bed floor, inside rear view mirror?, side markers, tail lights?, Hub caps ..... The 261 was not offered in series 31 and was green. Seems to have a 235 air cleaner.

I don't know, but how do you know it's a 261? Search "captains bars".

I am NOT an expert on stovebolt 6. But I've done a lot of TF's.

Thank you very much!!
Yes - 235 would make a lot more sense! The seller doesn’t know and it was a poor guess on my part. Non- original stuff appear to be fairly easy fixes.
I wonder if these came with cowl tags that indicated paint color, trim etc.
Deluxe cab is fantastic and good catch on the overhead speaker!

Really appreciate your input!

Andy, I have two '59 Apaches, a '59 Viking 40 and an extra cab. I suspect that the rust is much worse than it looks. Hard to tell until you crawl underneath. I love the big back window and the step side box with the spare tire mount.

If you decide to sell the hood emblem, send me a PM as I'd be interested in making you an offer. I would also include the correct emblem for a six cylinder truck.

Looks like a good project. Good score.

John

Thanks John!
Any specific areas you’d look at while under the truck?
Frame, cab floor etc?
I’d have to find a correct hood ornament as well as fender emblems first, but I’ll let you know?

Look for the GVW tag on the door post, it should have the paint code stamped on it. There won't be anything marked on the truck telling you it's a Deluxe Cab.

Not knowing what your looking for makes it hard to say if this is the right truck for you. If you're good with driving a rusty truck and just want it mechanically sound this might be the truck for you. Redo the entire brake system so you know it's all new and working correctly, check the front end, put new tires on it, give it a tune up and drive it.

If your looking for a restoration project this might not be the right truck, as almost every piece of sheet metal has issues. Check for rust on the inside above the windshield...if there's rust up there than you will find it everywhere. Look at the air plenums on the side of the cab and the door bottoms...are they rusted out? How about the top of the firewall at the panel seam? If you have rust in all of these places I would be looking for a better cab. Front and rear cab corners, rockers/steps and lowed hinge pockets are normal fixes...anything above that is troublesome. It also looks like a lot of rust along the bed side floor ell brackets, this means the bed sides are thin in that area and they are very hard to fix because it's just flat metal.

Mike B

Thank you Mike! This is very helpful.
Could you clarify “every piece of sheet metal has issues”?
I will most definitely look at the areas you pointed out, but based on you stating this might not be a good restoration candidate, you concluded that they are bad?
Thanks again!!
Andy

Mike B [/quote]

Bed side floor L brackets: are you referring to the 45 degree metal brackets that run inside the bed, holding the bed flooring down and run up the inside of the bed walls? About 2” up and in?

You put a deposit down. It has Washington plates. You live in Maryland and you say it's in N.J.

Can you please fill us in before we go any further?
1. Do you own it yet?
2. Do you have it at your house yet?
3. Are you going to buy it?
4. How much is it?
5. Are those your pics or seller's pics?

No use us guessing about rust, originality, condition, motor, vin plates, data plates...........are we advising whether to buy it or what?

Well… I think you answered most of your own questions:
I put a deposit down so I didn’t buy it yet. I live in Maryland and as I stated the truck is in NJ, so it is not at my house yet. I am planning on purchasing should I like what I see and inspect. Seller brought it from WA to NJ.
Naturally those are the seller’s pics since I stated that I haven’t seen the truck in person yet! 10k

Well, I broke down and opened your link. I then read everyone’s comments. There is a lot of rust to deal with. As pointed out there are several things that are not original to the truck. The thing that struck me most was the $10000 price tag. I realize there are large differences in value from one part of the country to another. The asking price may be in line for Maryland but it’s way out of line for my neck of the woods. I’m glad you are doing your due diligence and hope you go for your in person inspection well informed and with your eyes wide open and your wallet tightly closed. Good luck.

Thank you!
Much appreciated. I attempt to look nationwide, but find it difficult to find a running and driving and fairly original truck at $10k or below. I just don’t see them.
What areas worry you most? “A lot of rust to deal with”?

I agree with Martin on this one. The truck is in pretty rough shape for $10k. Looking closely at the photos you can see that the front fender have rust issues, the doors and cab corners as well. It does have the delux heater controls, the wrong seat and steering wheel. It has significant rust in the passenger side step this usually leads to more rust and rot below. There are no pictures of the underpinnings, it has the straight axel so I assume the original drum brakes.

For what it is worth IMHO I would pass on this truck and focus on finding a truck from a dryer region, Texas or Arizona perhaps. I think the that the cost of shipping a good clean candidate would be much lees than the cost of making all these repairs. I am in know way telling you not to purchase this truck, just to weigh your options, this is coming from a truck owner who is doing all of the things that this truck requires. For the record I paid $2500.00 for my truck many years ago..

“What areas worry you most?”. Hidden rust in areas that you cannot easily see. Cab supports, inner cowl panels, frame rails, spring perches just to name a few.

They are out there if you are patient. My 58 is not a big window, but has less rust than that one, all original except for the seat and steering wheel, and I paid under 4k lrss than a year ago.

The front seal on the axle leaks, so I am not putting miles on it until I deal with thay, bit it runs, drives, amd stops just fine.

Wow - that’s a great find. Where have you looked.
I am frequently on Craigslist nationwide, Facebook marketplace and I have yet to find something similar to the one I posted for under $10k.
Fairly original, runs and drives, 3 on the tree, chrome grill etc…all things i like

I assume you can get you deposit back if you change your mind? Anyway, I am in AZ. What year range are you looking for? What are the "must have" criteria?

Well it sounds like the general consensus is for me to pass on this truck.
I take all of your feedback and advice seriously, but I am certainly disappointed.
I see trucks left and right for $6 to $8k without engines and far from being roadworthy…
My intent has and never will be to have a show truck, but a fairly original truck I may work on while I drive it a little. I made many repairs and updates to my ‘46, but I have no interested in a truck that requires a new cab, new bed and other major structural items..
In other words. I don’t want a truck that’s going to fall apart or rot away in the next 3-5 years.

EDITED

Andy, as you can see there are differences of opinion. Mostly because we can't inspect it. I don't think I see anything bad. It's for you to decide after you inspect. My opinion on this is: re: rust:
1. If the floors, foot well and steps are OK. If there are is no 1" think bondo repairs
2. If the frame is OK
3. If windshield surround is OK
4. If you can DIY
5. The cab corners and doors are a standard repair with available inexpensive patch panels.
6. I don't see any other rust-out/rot-out..yet
7. It is a little high priced. if it has been offered for a while and if you ask the owner "is there any room on the price?" If yes, Then go see. Those are the exact words. Don't offer a price until you see it. Then inspect and offer what you think. I can see you know about trucks so you are not a rookie. Our opinions are NOT near useful from pictures. There is a lot to be said, as Martin said, about regional prices and availability. Shipping right now is VERY high and an immediate loss for the buyer.

No one here can see major rust. Structural damage, Need for new cab or anything wrong with a steel bed or temporary plywood bed. They are speculating and advising where to look for problems. You are not going to find a 100% stock truck without rust unless in the "restored" price range.

I am definitely open to any classic Chevy truck, but I do prefer the ‘58 & ‘59 grill over the earlier egg crate style grill. Chrome over painted grills.
Close to original is great. An engine that at least turns over, but running would be preferred. Nothing last ‘59. Not a huge Cameo style fan, although i understand they are desirable.
I’m honestly not overly picky.
Not sure if this helps?
Really appreciate your help!

I had a chance to buy a Cameo back in the mid '80s. They were asking 5k but it was pretty rusty and I really didn't care for that model anyway so I declined. In hindsight, it would have been a good investment, but I didn't have the room or desire to store it for 30-40 years.

I really like the look of the '57 grill. Kinda reminds me of a catfish mouth.

John

I know it's easy for me to spend your money. but if you expand your budget to $15K you might find trucks that are in way better shape and road worthy. In most cases if you buy a $10K truck and do $5K worth of repairs you won't have a truck that's half as nice as one if you had just bought a $15K one for from the start, if that make sense. You need to buy up until you're out of the rust issues as doing rust repairs is not cheap and a nice paint job is north of $10K...I'll take a rust free truck with no driveline over a rusty driver any day of the week, it's a no brainer.

As I said before, if you're OK with the rat-rod look than this might be the truck for you, but if you're looking for something between a rat rod and a show truck it might not be the one...

How good are your DIY skills for repairing rust?

Mike B

Being in California it is hard for me to get my head around big rust repairs, it is so much effort in time/skill/$$$ and there is no return on it as you are just getting the truck back to “normal” condition” starting place, that and rust you see is only a portion of what is hidden and that while you fix what you can fix there is still more you could not get to or find, which will creep out thru the paint later. That and it takes 4x as long as you think to repair.
I know it is hard to walk away when you are on a mission to get a truck, but use your eyes and a clinical mind, keep your heart out of the decision as best you can.
The rule I like is purchase the absolute best truck you can stretch to afford, it is by far the cheapest in the long run as the person before you is the one who got 35 cents on the dollar invested if he’s lucky (instead of that person being you getting the 35 cents)
I look at my truck and think of all those little pieces of rubber and trim and screws/glass/chrome/wood/etc/etc/etc/etc let alone the big things like body paint driveline etc and it scares me to think what previous owners (and myself) have spent on keeping it in fine condition.

IMO, a truck with a good rust free body and fenders but without an engine is a better value than a running and driving truck with rust on every panel that needs to be addressed.
UNLESS, you want to become a bodyman/welder/painter.
It's' easier to find and install an engine/drivetrain.