The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area Paint and Body Shop prep. for galvenized sheet metal

how do i prep galvenized sheet metal so the paint will stick,,thanks,, ron

I have washed it with vinegar and it worked just dandy. What you want is some mild acid to etch the top layer. I think hardware stores have a specific item for this, but the vinegar works just fine.

Stuart

strong vinegar bath is common, but there's stuff made for the job called GalvPrep I think, a dilute muratic acid solution

Bill

MAR-K Advises to " clean, scuff and clean again".

Why wouldn't you weld a Galvanized patch panel?
Just don't breathe the fumes...same approach as welding any kind of steel. Need proper exhaust/ventilation and/or a respirator.

If you're really worried about it, use straight muriatic acid to cut the zinc coating on the edges you want to weld.

Robin,
I know you've got safety in mind here and a concern for other people, and that's a good thing. If you're not sure about something you should always play it safe.

I own a fabrication shop that does commercial and industrial sheet metal work. 90 percent of our end products are galvanized. We weld galvanized steel everyday, of course with proper exhaust systems. We comply to all safety regulations. If I didn't, OSHA would be all over me in a cocaine heart beat.

There is no nationally recognized safety advisory that tells you not to weld galvanized steel.
Breathing zinc oxide fumes created by the process can cause metal fume fever...temporary flu like symptoms. There are no known long term effects.
I have done a lot of welding and have never experienced the fever because I've done it safely.

To avoid the illness, The American Welding Society recommends: "Keep your head out of the fumes and do not breathe the fumes. Use proper ventilation and exhaust. If uncertain about ventilation, use an approved respirator."
It's basically just good old common sense.

Here is the AWS full report on Metal Fume Fever

Steve

A little off subject here, but I think the cleaning has been pretty well covered already.
No robin, that's not what the guys are saying. But having welded my whole life, and still standing upright, I can tell you it's not gonna kill you right there on the spot. You surely don't want to breath the white powdery fumes that come off from welding it, but if you apply some common sense you can weld it just fine. Most welding methods can be used for it because the galvanizing will vaporize before the metal melts. I have gas welded it, mig welded it, stick welded it and welded it with tig. A respirator and a fan pulling the fumes away from the area are an excellent and I would agree a necessary precaution. It is always better when welding anything to begin with a clean joint, free of dirt, grease, paint or in this case metal plating. So a light sanding with a 120 grit disc is really a good idea, not absolutely necessary but a good idea if you are looking at for a good solid joint.
I’m assuming you are looking to use galvanized sheet metal for a patch panel. If it were me I would simply run up to the hardware store or farm supply and pick up some cold rolled sheet, most of them are carrying a selection now days and it will be much easier to work with.
Denny Graham
Sandwich, IL

Yeah...I prefer cold rolled steel to galvanized for patch panels as well. It is easier to work with and produces less welding spatter.

As far as ventilating in your home garage...an open window or door, a fan and a respirator does the trick. It works for me.

You're not saving anything buying galvanized over regular steel, the cost is about 30 percent more.
Also, there aren't any other metals that don't have potential health issues associated with welding them.

Happy safe welding

Well Robin, I assume you are referring to my comment, "a fan pulling the fumes away from the area". Please note, that I said, "pulling", you said, "blowing". Since you do seem interested in the subject let me just poke this in here.
I've used fume hoods for well over 30 years. Some were plumbed in from a central filter directly over my weld area, some were portable units and at home I’ve used some plane old window fans on the backside of the work. Again, I’ve used them with stick, mig and tig. If you do a little searching on the net you find hundreds of devices for removing welding fumes.
The amount of suck is directly proportional to the square of the distance, so a fume hood a few inches away from the weld area won't suck the shielding gas away from the weld area, it will simply gather up the fumes that are drifting out from it, very common in most decent welding shops now days since OSHA came on the scene.
Denny Graham
Sandwich, IL

I believe Robin has good intentions but his info is not 100% correct.I've welded galvanized sheet metal for over 20 years at home and at work with no problems.It is standard industry practice but common sense safty practices should be used.Many things we do in life have inherant dangers.We must try to minimize them all we can.Driving to the store for a loaf of bread is probably one of the most dangerous things we do every day but we take it for granted.I guess you could walk but your liable to get run over!Be careful, Chip

WOW, this thread went from vinegar to sour grapes in record time. Pulling, blowing and sucking....


Stuart

Sure did. Last time I open my mouth on this forum you can be sure of that. In fact I've removed anything I said in this thread and am in the process of removing anything else I ever said on this forum.

The main problem I had was trying to make a decent weld bead the zinc made a hell of a looking weld

I felt the same way a few weeks ago Robin, and I even did the same thing your proposing, i.e., pulled a bunch of replies. I’m sorry I did it now, cuz when I sat back and thought about it over night I decided not to let it keep me from sharing what I've learned over the years.
No one is attacking you, we are simply voicing our opinions, and you have every right to do the same. Take any two people and you are bound to get two different views of the world. Lots of people disagree with my approach, and that's their prerogative, but that shouldn't keep you from your turn up on the soap box. If every one agreed with everything I said, this would be a pretty boring forum.
Hope this brings things back on track.
Denny Graham
Sandwich, IL

I'll 2nd Dennys' take Robin - doesn't hurt to have your safety warnings in a thread that merits it, and no one with sense is faulting you for declaring that you wouldn't do it, and advise against it .... OTOH you should understand the guys who have extensive experience with it are still pounding the keyboard .... and advising caution as well

Bill

red58 all I'll say is I talked this over with local OSHA officials and local welding instructors who without fail urged caution which was all I was passing on.

Simply google "galvanized steel welding dangers" and decide for yourselves.

I'd suggest reading this one for example:

http://www.ballarat.edu.au/vfed/manufacturing/ssc/Newsletter23.pdf

One thing if people would READ what they would see is that WITHOUT FAIL every recognized safety organization, be it OSHA domestically or their equivalent overseas, stipulate they have not studied the effects of LONG TERM exposure to the fumes. The opinions expressed of "everything if fine" is tantamount to stating "I smoked a cigarette and don't have cancer" in my opinion, but like I said, I really don't give a rodent's posterior what you guy do or think.

Denny, it's too late, I pulled all my replies and won't offer advice here any longer.

I dunno, guess its different for different folks-but if I get near galvanized being welded, I get sick, just can't take the fumes. I have worked in shops so thick w/diesel/gas engine smoke that you couldn't see across the shop, changed hundreds of brakes & clutches, & sprayed paint w/cheap respirators, nothing bothers me like galvanized fumes. Brian

Robin,
I'm sorry you feel this way, but I really don't understand why you do. I think it is unfortunate that you pulled all your posts from this forum.

I certainly had no intentions of attacking you and I don't think I did...nor did anyone else. I believe the moderator would have stepped in if that was the case.

I think you're turning things around here a little. Your first post in this thread (which is now gone) was something like "I sure hope you're not planning on welding on that galvanized." To which I posted that you CAN safely weld it IF you follow these precautions. My recommendation was based on my professional experience and compliance with OSHA and the AWS and so were the opinions of a couple other guys who were/are in the industry.

Nobody here is disagreeing with you that caution must be taken, so I don't really understand your rant.

If I somehow offended you, it was unintentional and I apologize.

Steve

That is a shame Robin that you deleted all your posts. Because I'm sure it has really messed up some good info that you have offered in the past. All anyone was doing was voicing their own opinion just like yourself.

This is also a perfect example why there should be a time limit on how long you can wait before you can delete and/or change a post. NOW because Robins posts being deleted it has put a HUGE VOID in the effect posts & important info has been lost. I seen this happen a few years ago on another forum. They had one member that got upset w/someone & they deleted every post(over 3000) that they had. Sad part was he was a library of info, the only good thing that came out of it all was another member had copied & saved all the info so everything wasn't a total loss.

Robin, I am saddened that you decided to delete all the great info you have shared in the past. But I'm sadder to hear that you have decided not to post here anymore because you do have some good info to share. ZooKeeper

Yea, Robin. That's too bad (and a surprise) that you deleted all your posts from other threads.

I know I've had days when I want to delete the entire site. But, I just give it a rest and do something else for a while. Rather than think about the issue that's bugging me, I think about all the guys in here who are relying on the site in order to get or keep their old Bolt on the road.

Like Denny said (and I remember Denny's "bad day"), things always look different after you move back from it for a bit.

Peggy

Sorry Peggy but to me they still look the same.

I pm'd Ghostrider with why I felt so strongly about this. His first reply to my first post in this thread when I brought up welding on the galvanized metal was somewhat laconic by stating "why not weld on galvanized". To me the fact that someone had to ask the question about how to prep a galvanized panel for paint (and possibly install it with welding) indicated to me a possible lack of research on the potential hazards. I felt it was wise to bring this up. The thread to me quickly digressed with all reports being shot down by others and any possible problems of welding on galvanized being minimized.

That being the case, why would I wish to leave my advice here? And more importantly why would I wish to rethink my views on this subject when someone's health is at stake? The average person reading here is a hobbyist and does not have access to full breathing apparatus. To assume they do is dangerous. I strongly feel that when there is a potential health hazard that it should be thought of and even if somewhat a veer off topic, should be brought into the thread if for no other reason than to make sure someone who reads the thread in 6 months time doesn't read responses that all indicate that I was wrong in bringing the health issue up and proceeds to weld away with utter disregard for his personal health.

Robin,

That's a good reason why you should leave it in. We get LOTS of emails from folks who read these forums and who never EVER post. So, you have given some of these folks something to consider.

Peg