The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area Driveline Trouble Shooting the T5 / Bellhousing

Hello Everyone,
I dropped the trans today and a slew of other items came about. This all starter because the clutch would not open enough to be put into gear. I also needed to give the trans a once over and in the process of doing that I will be checking the spines (need lengthening) on the input shaft and check the drive gear. I'll take apart the clutch/flywheel and get them cleaned up and reinstalled.
I had to loosen the trans cross member in order to pull the trans out. When I started to separate the trans from the bell housing, the engine started to sag in the rear. I quickly put a small floor jack under it to keep it in place. I had to remove the bell housing cross member because it was interfering with the engine/trans initial installation. I figured that with the trans cross member I wouldn't need a the other.
If need be, I'll figure out how to mound bell housing mounts.

Open for comments, opinions, suggestions, questions and guidance.

This is what I'm working with:
'39 truck
'54 235 w/side motor mounts
'55 bell housing w/o mounts
T5 trans w/ trans mounts
Trans and Clutch - Photobucket

Bread
.

I think most folks retain the original bell housing crossmember and mounts and let the T-5 just hang out behind, unsupported. Supposedly there can be an issue if you have the extra point of support at the transmission in these trucks.
Carl

Bread,
I am in the middle of installing my T5. The cab is off the frame and that means I can't test mine, but everything bolted up OK. Take a look at my BLOG -see my signature.

I'm guessing you have 14 splines on your T5 input shaft, right? It doesn't look like a Jeep shaft swap.

Your bearing retainer is about the right length. The sleeve part should be about 2 + 5/16".

Rather than cut the shaft to make the splines longer, maybe you could drill out about 1/8" of the inner splines on the clutch disc (on the tranny end of the clutch hub). Make sure the disc can slide freely on the shaft before you put it back between the flywheel and pressure plate.

I agree that most folks run the T5 just hanging off the back of the bell and retain the factory bell cross member as a support.

Carl,
I have been thinking along the same lines that by not having the bell housing supported, it might contribute to the trans not working like it should. I'm still going to try to figure something out. Maybe side mounts for the bell housing instead of a cross member.

Jay,
I have been reading your BLOG and you have a good source of info on the T5. Thanks for putting in the time; the community will benefit from it, I know I have.
Yes, the T5 has 14 splines on the input shaft. I don't know what you meant by the sleeve part; what will it effect with the current measurements? Is it too short or long? I took your advise by cutting down the inside spines of the clutch pressure plate. I didn't drill it down, I used some kind of bit that gouged out majority of the spline. It is a pretty aggressive bit so back off and cleaned up with a dremel. I checked the plate on the trans and it went on smoothly. Now, all I have to do is find the alignment tool.

Thank you gentlemen for your inputs,
Bread
.

How much of the inner spline did you remove?

Sir,
I removed about 1/8 of the spline. - picture -

.

The input shaft bearing retainer has a sleeve that the throw out bearing slides on. You have cut yours shorter. If I recall, you have it cut to about 2.25". That's a little shorter than the recommended length but it might still be ok.

When you put it back together, leave the pressure plate off. I know that it will be extra work but it will help you to be sure things will work.

With the tranny bolted to the bell, make sure the clutch disc can slide away from the flywheel. Also make sure that when it moves away from the flywheel that the end of the bearing retainer sleeve doesn't contact the clutch disc.

Then pull it all apart and reassemble with the pressure plate.

Jay

Bread,
Here's a photo of a Camaro T5 bearing retainer.
Camaro bearing retainer.

It looks like you cut the tip off the S10 shaft. Here's a photo of my 1965 3 speed manual shaft and the length is exactly the same a a V8 Camaro T5 shaft.
3 speed input shaft

The bearing retainer should be about 3.25" in total length when you measure from the face of the transmission case. Here's a picture of my original 3 speed bearing retainer. As far as I can tell, all of the older 3 and 4 speed 2WD trucks had these same dimensions.

Bearing retainer TOTAL LENGTH.

Jay,
I have put the trans back in the truck minus the pressure plate. The clutch disc does indeed slide away from the flywheel. I had the Mrs. step down on the peddle while I watched it move away from the flywheel.

The through out bearing sits right up against the bearing retainer and it also touches the spring fingers in the clutch disk. -picture- , -picture- There isn't any play in between the trans and clutch disk, is this normal?

I'm going to take it all apart and completely put it back together.... More to follow.

Bread
.

Bread,
I'm not sure I understand what you mean by "isn't any play".
With everything together but no pressure plate you should be able to move the clutch disc away from the flywheel by hand. It will slide along the shaft splines. It should be able to move a few millimeters off the flywheel and still not make any contact whatsoever with the bearing retainer sleeve. I call it a bearing retainer sleeve but others might call it a throw out bearing sleeve.
I am 100% certain that you have cut the sleeve short enough.

One more thing to check while it's all together without a pressure plate. Spin the shafts of the T5 to make sure that the pilot tip spins freely in the pilot bushing. If you still have the old bushing in the end of the crank then I think it will spin just fine. These are things to check just to have peace of mind.

Sir,
The through out bearing will not move forward or backwards; this is what I meant when I said that there wasn't any play. Once I have put the pressure plate back and start to tighten it up, the diaphragm springs compressed inward and once the clutch was good and tightened, the through out bearing could move an inch or so. The sleeve didn't get caught up with the through out bearing. It did slide back and fourth and didn't get caught up.

When I put the trans/clutch disk on the truck, minus the pressure plate, I did see the clutch disk move way from the fly wheel. That part did work.
I didn't spin the shaft of the T5.
With the trans in neutral, I'll give it a spin and see what happens.

I think I blew out the slave clutch. When I was engaging the clutch and watching the clutch fork move back and forth a few times, on the last try, it lost all its pressure and remained pushed in. It is stuck with the push rod out. -picture- , -picture- , -picture-

I'll take it off and replace it with a new one and we'll move on.

Bread
.

You can't push the clutch pedal with a hydraulic clutch without it all assembled. The Slave cylinder will over extend as you found out. Best to replace it now. What was meant was to move the disc by hand to make sure it slides freely.