ok I know you guys know brakes and I thought I did to being just 4 wheel cyls. and a master cyl. ok so here's what I have done, 4 new wheel cyls.(Jim carters) and a new master (Wagner from Jim carter) I got all new shoes and drums have been cut and adjusted, no hydro-vac,(never had one) I put in fluid and pump up brakes bled them from the drivers rear then to the pass rear and then go to the pass front and then drivers front.. and they work but seem to be soft. then I let the peddle rest for 5 seconds and the peddle goes to the floor, I don't have a pressure bleeder just the old foot and hold and the bled and close and the pump it up again until all the air is gone, I have done this until my foot hurts and it still goes to the floor, ok so what do you guys say is not right? my first guess is the master because the wheel cyl. are not leaking and the master is not leaking either. I have maybe a 1/8 of peddle movement before it engages with the master and I think that it needs 1/2 of play but I just want to let you guys know what I have here, thank you for you help! Dan

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1936 1.5 wrecker,1937 gmc coe,1939 Chevrolet coe,1942 4x4 coe, 1942 coe,1946 dump,1947 2 ton dump,another 1947 2 ton dump,1950 coe,1967 c30,1937 cat 22,1936 Chevrolet 5 window foremans coupe, 1914 ford speedster.