The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area Engine Shop Stupid mistake

I have been working on my '56 3100 for a while now. The engine is all rebuilt, body work done, painted, interior waiting to be set in after I find someone to re-install the glass.(I'm afraid to try it)
Anyway, I got the engine started and running fine. Now who would have thought that a polar-vortex would affect southeast Alabama, I'm talking 20 miles north of Florida. Well it hit here.
I went to the barn the other day where the truck is and found water all over the floor and ice in the radiator, my heart sunk. It warmed up so I put water in the radiator and it was leaking back out and dripping on the exhaust(I didn't try to start the truck).Trying to find where it is leaking, but I need to crawl underneath and will have to wait for it to dry-out some.I sure as hell hope it didn't bust the block. I'm thinking it's the freeze-plug behind the manifold...sure hope so. I'm surprised it didn't bust the radiator.
I never thought about it when testing everything out, but I'll have antifreeze in it as soon as I discover where the problem is...Any thoughts as to how to find the leaking area? Please be gentle with me, I know now how stupid this was

Oh wow, that is unfortunate indeed. Hopefully you did just pop a "freeze" plug and did not crack the block. I think that might be the case if the water is leaking out that fast. But, keep in mind that normally the "freeze" plugs don't guard against freeze damage. This is true because the "freeze" plugs are actually casting hole plugs that have nothing to do with guarding against freezing.

Now, go heat that garage so you can fix the problem and prevent similar damage in the future. I wont mention anything about NEVER using water alone in the coolant system as you have learned your lesson about one of the two reasons. The other being poor lubrication of the water pump bushing/bearing. Oh crud, did I mention it...

Unless you had pure water in the motor antifreeze is good to -34F if mixed right.

I'm in PA and have seen temps to -10F in my garage... all the motors there have 50/50 in them and are fine.

If you did use water.... that could be bad. With any luck the cold shrunk something that was marginally watertight (like a clamp)and that leaked.

Please post back what you find.. it would be interesting to see what exactly happened.

Yep- - - -he's probably just got a loose clamp- - - - -amazing how one of those things can make a radiator feeeze up!


Jerry

Had a customer bring a vehicle in for me to work on. Running and driving it. Calls me up about midnight one night wanting me to check the antifreeze in it. He had forgotten to tell me he had only water in it. Had been 26 degrees and lower for a few days.

I figured the engine was froze. Luckily he had just enough antifreeze it slushed, but nothing got solid. Got it started and warmed up and added some more antifreeze to it.

Glad I did. Got down to 6 degrees one night here. Kinda rare too.

Maybe some good news, I just went down and checked the oil, looks good, no water in it , but I haven't tried to start it yet. I think it's a freeze plug that is leaking. Need some help to pour water into engine so I can see where the leak is. I am thinking it is the one behind the manifold, so it'll have to come off....again

I have a similar concern regarding my 216.it sat in a feild for lord only knows how long and one day I took it out of the truck and ripped it apart. When I revived the head I found every cylinder was full of water. An odd place normally but the engine did not have a valve cover so rain, dew, and whatever watter is in the air could collect with the head preventing enough evaporation to fully let it dry. This makes me worry about it but I will only know when I send it to a machine shop if it's still a good block.

Spent a day in a junk yard this summer looking at old Buicks
straight eights. Every head that we took off that was not
protected from the weather had cylinders blown out. Apparently
it was from water that had run in the intake and down into the
cylinders that had a valve open.
Consider yourself lucky if you don't have any cracked cylinders Zach.

DG

Years ago when I had a service station, a guy called from a nearby motel. He came to K.C. from California & we had a sudden cold snap. His truck wouldn't start. I went there & opened the hood. All the hoses were pulled away from the outlets about an inch with a column of ice in between. There was a long crack in the bottom of the water jacket. "freeze plugs" were hanging out stuck to a column of ice. It was the darndest thing I have ever seen. The guy says he didn't know you had to put a-freeze in it.

Yesterday, I filled the radiator with water and used a borrowed tool to pressurize the system. It is leaking from a (I guess)a freeze-plug in the front of the engine, right below the water pump and right about the timing case cover.
I know I'm going to have to removed the radiator and maybe even the water pump to get to it.So what's the best way to replace this thing?
And YES, I did drain all of the water of it after I found the leak..

Take a look at this photo. You can just see the front casting hole (freeze) plug located between the water pump and timing gear cover. So, you don't have to remove the water pump to replace the plug. Ensure you get the correct plug from one of the many vendors. It is basically a concave/convex steel disk without a perimeter lip/flange. Remove the old plug by drilling a hole in the center, threading in a screw and pry it out. Clean up the hole and apply a suitable sealant around the perimeter "ridge/step" in the hole. Insert the plug convex out/concave in. Finally, using a ball peen hammer and a regular hammer: place the ball of the hammer on the center of the plug. Hit the ball peen hammer with the regular hammer to indent the center of the plug. This locks it into place.

Hey guys, Don't repeat my DUMB move . When I had engine on stand when installing new rings, bearings and cam, I decided that the frost plugs looked OK, so left them. I installed into the truck, ran in the new cam, rings and bearings. I then ran the 6 mile shakedown trip around the country block and blew a frost plug after installing new antifreeze. I would recommend brass plugs to avoid any corrosion in the future.

I am not aware of anyone that sells brass front and rear "freeze" plugs for the 216/235 engine. Given the design of the plug (having to bend it to lock it in place), I am not sure brass would be strong enough to stay in place. Maybe they exist, I don't know. How long did it take the originals to corrode to the point of failure? If coolant is always in the system, it acts as a rust inhibitor anyway. Therefore, I would think corrosion to be non issue on a well maintained engine/cooling system.

Is this plug different from a regular freeze plug?...It doesn't look the same. From David F's description, is sounds very different

you can get individual brass frost plugs in any size at NAPA, don't think the 235 plugs are different than any others, all of them get peened to spread

Bill

1955 2nd series through 1962 235's use a low mount water pump and do not have a soft plug in the front. Example, another example

Sorry for the confusion Dave. The truck is a '56, but the engine is a '54...It does have the front plug that is leaking. It is a different design than the ones on the side behind the manifold.
I have another 54 engine here that I looked at and it is the same way. It's almost like it is inside-out or something..The ones on the side you can see the "lip" the front one is flush with the block. That why I asked if they are different

Yes, they are different! And, no you do not peen regular plugs to lock them in place. The front and rear plugs are simple disks with no perimeter flange. Because of this design, they are a relatively loose fit until you indent the center to lock them in place.

I think the only way to get the plugs from most of the venders is to purchase the entire set. Usually, the rear camshaft plug is not included in the set.

http://freezeplugfactory.com/expansion-plug-size-chart/

http://www.dormanproducts.com/catalog/hardware2006/127-130_Sec8_Part1.pdf

Get the Dorman number and go to any local parts house, they should be able to order one for a few dollars or less. You want the concave expansion type.

Here is a list for your engine, http://freezeplugfactory.com/chevrolet-constants/ scroll down to 235, you want the 1 5/8" block, concave
Joe

Thanks everyone for the information and replies. I knew there were different size freeze plugs, but never knew there were different styles...cup and disk. I've only ever seen the cup type.Now to get this radiator out and get busy on replacing this thing...Thanks again for the help

The plug mentioned that does not have shoulders is sometimes known as a Welch Plug. They can be found with some searching. Below is a good description for installation.

Good luck with your Polar Vortex victim. The night before our temperatures plummeted I hurriedly checked the coolant condition on all of the machines. Who would have thought temperatures would have dropped so low.


http://www.hubbardspring.com/install_reco.php?cid=45