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Esteemed Stovebolters,

I have been following this list for quite a while and have read many of the archives. Some of my questions may seem redundant however; the answers I found have not been complete.
I have a 1936 Chevrolet 1 ½ ton truck; it is as original as a 65-year-old truck can be. I drive it around the airport where it lives and in its present condition that is the only place I can drive it. I want to update the driveline and here is what I have in mind.

The first order of business is more power, a Vortech V-8 or LT-1 engine and an overdrive automatic transmission. Next the suspension- I would like to put in a late Chevy truck cross member and independent front suspension. After looking at my frame and newer trucks I believe it will work with this change, to achieve rear steer swap spindles left to right. The question I have regarding this is, will the steering clear the engine? The rear end would also be from a late model truck and, to stop all this 4 wheel disc brakes with ABS.

I have a feeling several of you will flame me out for this but, I am going to use the truck to haul cars and I need a reliable and safe vehicle.

I have covered the highlights but have not delved into the details and that is what I would like to know about. Are the suspension mods sound and is the steering going to fit and function. The engine and trans should be straightforward and I want to use a hydra boost on the brake master under the cab. I also want to use sway bars front and rear and, perhaps airbags in back. The last of my rant will deal with cab heat and A/C; I think I can mount a full HVAC system under the seat where the gas tank was. I would use floor ducts to route defrost and cold air anybody do this before?

I am putting on my firesuit.

Steve

First question really is; do you have any knowledge of this stuff? or will you have other people do it? and then how much do have to spend on this? Do you have a budget or not? I don't know about the bigger frames, and I'm not sure how many people here know if the change will work or not, but on the smaller trucks there needs to be some changes. But since it is an older truck, the frame is smaller, so just sit tight and have a few, and I'm sure somebody who knows more about these trucks will help you out. A V8!!! Get lost No 292 or 302 Jimmy? No really, it all sounds good to me, but what do I know, not that much (only been into this stuff since I was 12, and I'm only 17 now).

Good luck on your project, and build it for yourself, the way you want to, that's the most important thing.

Nate

Well Dogg,

I've been playing with cars since I was about 13 and that is over 28 years. I will do most of the work myself, I have a shop and make things like supercharger kits for Mercedes V-8's. My background is auto racing and flying and, I do know automotive systems very well. As for a budget, I can buy an Engine/trans, front suspension, brakes and rear end for 3-4 thousand. I have the cash in hand and have several choices. The rest of the items like a radiator, exhaust and, all the loose ends I figured at fifteen hundred to 2 grand. I don't have a hard budget to work from and the best parts are where I want to put my money. I want to use as many factory parts as I can and need parts that will be of the right class for a truck. I have nothing against sixes but, here in L.A. you need to be able to run at 70MPH or you will get run over on the highway. That and I am used to driving cars that go 160+ so the thing has to run!

Dusty,

I looked into that route and, their is more to it than meets the eye. Front steering will not work with this body and the rest of it would require as much or more work to fit.

I know a lot of you are shaking your heads but, I don't plan on cutting anything. The old drive line and suspension could be put back in, I am not going to sell it.

Well there you go, if you can get the eng and stuff for that price, then you're half way there Yeah, I know what you mean with the 160+, my aunt and uncle used to be drag racers (Pontiac), now he just builds HiPo Pontiac engines. I love the speed, and I'm always gonna have to have a vehical that can take off fast and keep going until I say stop, not the engine/rearend.

I was going to suggest looking into those custom frames, but I don't know of anybody that builds frames for 1.5T and up...just 3/4T and below. I don't see why the steering wouldn't clear the engine, since you'll be using the PS box on the outside of the frame...

Just wait until GL gets here, he might yell at you Changing a stock big truck all around I don't know if you'll really need sway bars though, I've seen a lot more trucks redone w/o then than with them, even the hot rods. Since you're gonna be pulling stuff, I guess you'll be going for a 3/4T late model truck, you'll need the heavy duty stuff of course, and with airbags out back it'd be even better to haul things.

This is getting long so I better go now, but since you said you want the money going to the good stuff..I'd just focus on making a great chassis/eng/tranny/rear, forget about the rest (AC/little things) until you get there. Is it gonna be rodded or what? A little lowered, wheels etc?

Nate

There was an article in Custom Classic truck mag several months ago about 3-4 COE redo's. Most used either 1 ton dually chassis and fabbed mounts for old cab/fenders or used motorhome frames if you need extra length as a car hauler. Either way it beat trying assemble all the parts needed as engineering work was done and proven by GM.

Steve, I don't know how many of these project trucks you have built like the one you are talking about,but your budget should be closer to $60,000 than $6000.I have a 51 chevy c.o.e. on a 96 chevy H.D. chassis and I am using a cummins in it behind the cab.It has 4 wheel disk brakes and 19.5 low-pro tires.The old frames will not hold the torque of newer engines.Keep us posted on your progress.......Have a good one......

My biggest concern would be the frame. Is it strong enough to handle a V8, disk brakes, heavy suspension, etc.? I'm sure what you want to do can be done, but pay close attention to the frame. I'd box it whereever possible to increase strength and rigidity.

As far as the parts go, it's probably possible to mount late model stuff with a bit of fabrication. It's going to be harder to find off-the-shelf mod kits for that heavy a model, so you'll probably have to do a lot of it yourself, including figuring out how to get stuff to mount.

You might want to buy a trashed out late model 1 & 1/2 ton and use its parts as models to see what work you'll have to do.

OK, now I am getting some answers. Regarding the frame I could box the frame but, is that going to be enough. I still haven't ruled out building a Grain Bed and towing a trailer. The cars I plan to carry are 3-4000 lbs. My biggest car would be a 55 Nomad or Mercedes SEC.

If I use 3/4 or 1 ton front suspension that cross member should stiffen up the front, with boxing the frame would that be enough. I plan on only using factory parts for the simple reason that repair and replacement parts have to be available.

I went junkyarding today and it looks like a van steering box would work best for rear steer, anybody use this? The major parts are all coming from late trucks and I will only use undamaged factory parts. I can pick and choose what I want, try it out and swap it if it won't work. My truck will not work with front steering because the front of the fenders would be behind the steering gear. This is the biggest issue with using a late frame and believe I have though about this a whole bunch. I agree that going to a late chassis would be the fastest route and perhaps the best way to get what I want. That said if anyone has a good solution to this problem I am all ears.

I really do appreciate all the comments and keep em coming. I will scan some pictures if anyone would like to see the old girl as she looks now.

A later 3/4T or 1T frame would be perfect, I've seen that done, but I know it was a lot of work. Some really nice COE's up here (custom ones, GL would hate them). Slammed to the ground, paint etc, but used later stuff. Steve do you read Classic Trucks Mag? 2 issues ago there was a feature on a '56 F*** COE that was redone real nice, if you haven't seen it; he used a 86 F--- 1T frame, and most of the stuff off that truck. Your truck is a normal truck right, not a COE?

Nate

Nate,

I have seen late frames with newer bodies but nothing this old in big trucks. My truck is a conventional; I think 37 was the first year for cab overs. I don't think I saw that mag but I did see a couple of really cool Ferd cab over car haulers at a Pomona swap meet. One was a crew cab and it was slammed, they were both 39's my favorite year Ferd COE.

What do I have to do to post a picture to this board? I have one small picture on this computer.

I hope this is a good link.
http://us.f1.yahoofs.com/users/45eef418/bc/Yahoo!+Photo+Album/36+truck---1.jpg?pfyYrO8AxqwsiuJU

Let's see if this works
http://us.f1.yahoofs.com/users/45eef418/bc/Yahoo!+Photo+Album/36+truck.jpg?bcJiyi8A_7DbsdBr

The other links should work, however go here the only pictures in the album are of the truck, they are both the same picture.
http://photos.yahoo.com/capnlindy

It definitely sounds like you know where yer going with this project. Just remember what you said, it's a 65 year old truck with a 65 year old frame. I hope you keep us posted on this project. Maybe you can put your story in the forum devoted to projects with a chronological story and picture to boot?
It's called the break area.

[ 01-08-2002: Message edited by: 6T2Burb ]

Steve Nice truck. I think if i was going to do it i would also go with a newer chassis.Your on the right track.I would maybe flip the spindles and try a rack and pinion steering deal.Maybe a beefy rack like the ones in your Mercedes .This is not going to be a real easy ,look at somebody eleses deal cause there are not a lot of them done yet.Most guys are on the COE copy cat deal.(we hated friggin COE's when we drove trucks,why i allway had conventional"s who the hell wants to ride on top of the front axle) I would also look at some R/V chassis cause the steering box is low and on the side of the frame(think the fender would clear) Dont be afraid to look at all the brands for the frame(nobodys gonna know what it is anyway LOL) Keep us posted as i am getting ready to build my daimond -t slider in the future.

Nice truck! I think those truck look sweet hot rodded. There's just something about the fenders, and cab, and especially a flatbed, with a nice low frontend, and a nice "rake". How's the body of the truck? Looks pretty good, from the pics.

Nate

Thanks to one and all who have responded so far. I am reassessing the frame swap with your input. I really hadn't thought about a rack and pinion steering but it might work. The only issue I have with R&P is the road vibration and is there a rack that would be heavy enough for a large truck. I have looked at later truck frames and they don't seem to lend themselves to well to rear steering with a drag link.

As to the trucks condition, she is a sweet old girl. The truck was built in Oakland and I think lived in Los Angeles all her life. The body is straight with only a touch of rust in the bottom of the doorjambs and cab back. The fenders and running boards have a few dents but nothing major and the grill and shell are perfect. The gages all work and it never had a heater, the worst thing on the truck is the seat now just a frame. The truck runs ok but she won't start hot and the king pins are as loose as a goose. The steering is really hard and when I jacked up the front to check the king pins the wheels move a good 2 inches worse on the right.

I am going to take some good digital pictures and put the up over the weekend.

The Mercedes rack is a pretty good rack. I was thinking the same thing about rear steer as i think you will be getting in trouble trying to mount the idler arm and box .Plus the frames usally step up in the back makin it hard to put castor in the spindles with the steering arms .The other thing you could look at would be spindles that had unboltin steering arms,that way you could fab your own steering arms.With the rack that would be a plus cause you could slow the steering down by makin longer arms(within reason) and correct any bump steer.It would also have to take in account were the motor goes as the oil pan allways seems to be in the way with a rear steer deal.

Phat,

You right on with the later frames and rear steer, remember early Nova's with V-8 engines. I made several offset drag links to use a real oil pan for these cars. Do you think a late 1-ton chassis would be ok to use, I don't want the thing to beat me to death driving it.

What can you tell me about the right way to fit rack and pinion steering on a front end? The other idea I though of would be to move the steering box and fab linkage to make it work. I am thinking a rod off the Pittman arm with some bearings going to the new gearbox location and another Pittman arm. Keep all the geometry the same just use a bell crank assembly to actuate the steering.

Steve,

There was a early 90's 1 ton 4x4 running around here with a 35 hicab on it and flatbed. Front tires were way to wide / big and looked goofy with the 35 fenders which are basically identical to the 36. If you do a frame swap, try a few different sets of tires set at the right width and see how it strikes you.

If your scrapping any part of your dash, let me know, I am sqirreling away parts for a 36 burb body that I have stored away. Engine and tranny would be cool too!

Ken,

I am keenly aware of that goofy look; I have already though about that problem. I will be using some kind of dually wheels and I may end up facing the front hub to narrow them. When I took measurements from a late 80's 1-ton the front track was almost 2 inches wider than my truck. The front hubs from a ¾ -ton are narrower but I don't know if dually wheels would clear the brakes. The 1-ton hubs look like I can cut them quite a bit with out a problem.

These are some of the more constraining problems with this early a truck. Trucks just a few years later have more front wheel track and fenders that hide a lot more of the under carriage. I was originally looking for a COE to do this to but when I found this truck I just fell in love with the lines. This truck has great bodylines and you see so few early Chevy's that have survived. Funny thing is a friend called and told me he saw a truck like mine at an Ice company. We went to check it out and it is a 35 not a 36 but a nice earlier version of my truck. This is the only other pre war big Chevy I know of in L.A.

I don't think I am going to do any thing to the dash; I will put my radio in an overhead panel. While I am going to put in heat and A/C, a radio, CD player and all the comfort of a modern vehicle. I want the exterior and interior to look somewhat original. I am removing the gas tank from under the seat but I plan on recovering it and keeping the inside close to stock, at least to the casual observer.

This is the 36 Chevy a friend of ours drove from LA to Cape Cod a few years ago, 45 mph all the way. [img]http://www.mawhobbi.com/truck/images/thornley_truck.jpg[/img]