The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area Engine Shop Am i missing parts? ( engine to radiator gap)

Ok.... I have no idea what im starting with here...

1954 3800 truck

My engine bay

The P/O squeezed a 3.5-4" core radiator in my truck by using some wooden blocks. lol. If I change back to the stock (2.5" i think) radiator I'll have probably a 2" gap between the fan and radiator surface.

Best as I can find- stock this distance was 1/2" or so which makes sense to me...

Am I missing a spacer behind the fan or somthing? I can't imagine the gap could have been that big or that the P/O actually moved the engine back..

On a side note: any guesses where this radiator is from? it has '57 or '59 (from memory) stamped on a plate soldered on it. that's all i remember. i cant find a pic of anything remotely similar in the 50's..

Some previous owner cut open the radiator frame/housing in order to move the radiator away from a later 235/261 engine's "protruding" fan blade. This was a very common operation/surgery.

If you want to put a original-style radiator with an engine that has the water pump in the original location, you should look for a 1954/55-1st 1 ton truck's radiator housing.

You could use a 47-53 1 ton truck's radiator housing, but the horn-mounts will not be found on those radiator frames.

What year/size/vehicle engine do you have?


Added later: T54X engine? That would be a regular 1954 3100 truck 235 engine (made at Tonawanda).

T54XA = 3600 235
T54XB = 3800 235

Are you sure the radiator frame was cut? i think the radiator they put in just fit within the existing flange. I'm just going by picture because I don't have it in front of me. Did the original radiator end at the flange closest to the engine or slide down into the channels?

what do you mean by later engine? My understanding is this is a 54 engine in a 54 truck. It's actually T54XB so i think it's original to a 3800.

what do you mean by water pump in original location? is mine modified?

Tj

Your radiator is out of a GMC, and I am pretty sure the wood block is not factory!

Tj

I meant that my engine comment was added later.

I posted the 3100, 3600, and 3800 engine serial number codes. I could not read the right side of the engine serial number (in the photo I found in your photo album).

It looks to me that part of the radiator frame was cut off (the mounting surface of the frame). Then a cob-job side mount for your radiator was put in place, inside the original cut-off frame. This type of adaptation was very common, but much more common when using a newer 235 in an older truck.

I do not recall if the 3100-3800 radiator frames were the same. I will check later tonight.

thanks ill keep looking for some good stock pictures.

brad- i have a friend with a 56 gmc tht said his has the funky elbow with cap. im going to look for pics of that too..

im hoping that they only pieced it together because its what they had and there wasn't some underlying issue..

btw for some reason my core support has 1 center bolt to frame and not 2.... can anyone shed some light on that one?

just found this pic...
truck- not mine!

does the stock radiator protrude last the core support toward the engine? maybe mine ( position wise) wasn't so far off after all. just had the mount flange in a diff spot so the used the blocks to make up for it? lol

You have a 1954 truck that is 59 years old and has been modified to keep it going with parts from other trucks. As I stated the radiator is from a GMC. It is not sitting correctly in the frame, thus the wood blocks and long bolts. It is easy to imagine someone modifying the core support for a single bolt if the others were removed or broken. The proper set-up for your truck should have one bolt on the left side and one on the right. Are those original supports still under the radiator?

Tj,

After studying your photo more carefully, I am questioning my statement about how much might have been cut out of your radiator frame.

I'll post some photos tomorrow: radiator frame and the mounts on the base of the radiator frame. Mine is a 1/2 ton. The base of the 1-ton frame might be different.

I found some pics of GM radiators that match like you said. I'll check to see if the core was cut next Wednesday (my truck day ).

Supports: That's what was confusing to me... not only was it 1 center bolt, but there was 1 center support.... was hoping someone would say some other year or a GM had a single center...

Don't see why someone would put in the effort to cut off and re-weld a center support. if you"re going to put in that much effort you"d just fix both.

This truck has a story to tell and half the fun is listening to it!

Early trucks 1947-mid 1949 had the single center mount. This should still have two bolts in it.

According to the serial number, my cab is from a 2 ton, so i imagine that the first core support rotted out and they were able to find an early one. any difference besides the single center bolt?

No not on the big trucks the single point mount was changed when the factory went to the dual shackle mounting system for the cab. On the earlier trucks there were service complaints about cracking and stress issues with the center mount shackle.

center mount shackle is about the cab mount right? no reason to change my core to 2 bolts really is there?

Here is a previous post on it, but in a word no.


Well the shackle was the factory solution to service complaints about cracking with the center mount style. Here is a description of the problem located here:
http://auto.howstuffworks.com/1947-1955-chevrolet-trucks2.htm
The cab itself, which had previously been attached to the frame at three points via shackle bolts and rubber mounts, was now mounted at four points. The idea of the three-point system was to let the frame flex without affecting the cab. This worked well, but the single forward mount put too much stress on the front frame crossmember, so two smaller shackle mounts were set on the forward chassis rails instead. The cab was still unaffected by frame flexing thanks to the lessened tension of the shackle bolts.
Frame flexing had caused other problems as well. There'd been complaints, for example, that the 1947-1948 radiator support in the 3100s tended to twist and shake loose after many miles on rough roads. This caused splits in the radiator core, and cracks in front-end sheetmetal. For 1949, Chevrolet added X-bracing to the radiator support frame, reinforced the bottom channel, and mounted the entire assembly more rigidly.

thanks for your help brad.

hmm don't recall mine having cross bracing either so that makes sense..

Just looking at your radiator support, I think the correct radiator will probably bolt up to the face of the support just fine. I can't take a picture of mine right now, because it is apart.
Cleon

I agree with Leon. The only piece that looks like it might have been cut is the piece that goes across the radiator frame, forward of the radiator.

Here are a few photos - 54 1/2 ton

i see what you mean.. that was definitely cut... is that part of the core support or a separate piece mounted on top? either way i think ill be ok

i could always re-core the one i have....

It is a separate piece. Do not worry about that piece until after you decide what you will do with your radiator (you might just keep what you have).

Took a closer look... I can post pics later- don't have access to flickr right now..

The top metal piece toward the front of the core support was not trimmed believe it or not... its a very smooth cut and actually has a contour in two spots that match up to the top radiator tank.

I'm thinking maybe it is from an early AD GMC?

Either way it's in good shape so unless I find out that it's some rare piece ic an sell and buy a Chevy version, it's going back in...

Just posted some pics of the core support on my blog side below.