The Stovebolt Site Forums The Parking Lot Big Bolts The Stovebolt Volunteer Fire Department Mid-Pump Removal & Driveshaft

Ok, firebolters I've worked out a deal with a fellow bolter who has just purchased a nice low mileage 48 firetruck but he was just looking for a flatbed. The theory is that he's driving the truck up to my place this weekend where we'll remove it's bed, pump, lights, etc and install a flatbed and he'll head on down the road as he doesn't have anyplace to do the swap back home and he doesn't have a place to store the firebolt parts until he can sell them so the bed and parts would have to go right to scrap. The truck is a mid pump setup and he mentioned something today I hadn't factored into the plan. He said it has a short drive shaft from the trans to the pump then another drive shaft from the pump to the rear end. Being that my firebolt has the pump out front and I've not layed under very many firebolts this was a setup that I didn't realize existed I always assumed that the mid pumps just ran off the regular PTO. That said my hope and question here is that when we remove the pump and the associated short shafts can we swap in a driveshaft from a similar wheelbase big bolt? The other factor is he tells me that the truck also has a 5 speed trans.

Here's some pics of the truck where it set.
https://plus.google.com/photos/110211271593344394189/albums/5699849278559087937

Mongo

WOW Steve!!
When you ask a question, You really have a question.
This will be a good one to watch.
Bet ya one or both of the Mike's on here will have the answer.

Don

My 1960 GMC American LaFrance pumper with a 351 V-6 and a Clark 5-speed is set up that way. I'm going to solve the problem by grafting a 3-speed Brownie into the place where the pump used to be. That will give me 15 forward speeds and OD in top gear. The fire bed is coming off, and I'm adding a commercial 5th. wheel and a gooseneck hitch behind the 5th. wheel.
Jerry

Hy KCMongo, depending on the placement of the pump, and what if any modifications had to be made to the frame crossmembers, you may be able to use two stock driveshafts for that wheelbase and the stock center bearing, good luck, I'm pulling for ya.

who's pump is it and who built the truck i may be interested in some stuff if i can use it on mine. i agree with what 3b says. i really like jerry's plan. im just wondering on what type of shift linkage set up he will need since the pump is basically in the center of the truck. my pump is almost three feet behind the tranny.

I'm going to use the standard Brownie shifter that has a second stick mounted in the cab. The linkage is a pair of round steel rods that just hug the bottom of the cab and go back to a pair of shift rails on the auxiliary trans. I learned to drive big rigs on a B-73 Mack with a 262 Cummins engine and a Tri-Plex 5X3 with that setup. It was pretty much standard practice for any truck bigger than a 2-ton or so to have an auxiliary transmission and a second shifter. I've driven and/or worked on hundreds of them.
Jerry

The only details i have so far are the pics above so no clue who the manufacture is yet. got word that he had trouble with a rear brake not backing off yesterday so he returned to the seller for repairs. I will update with more details when I get them.
Thanks guys,
Mongo

Ok, just heard, the firetruck body is a Boyer from Logansport, IN.
Mongo

I would love to talk you out of those fenders If I could. I need them for a wrecker I am restoring.
Thanks
Brad

Sorry guys, but I'm planning on keeping the fire body intact, so not selling anything at this point.
I've posted some more pics in the same album.
https://plus.google.com/photos/110211271593344394189/albums/5699849278559087937

The trucks here and we worked yesterday on detaching the fire bed from it. We decided the best bet is to split the fire bed between the back section and the front (small) section around the pump then remove the front section and pump all together. Looks like we will be grafting a cross member with the normal big truck bearing from a donor 116 frame I have at the lot along with it's drive shafts in place of the pump and inline PTO setup.

More news as it happens.
Mongo

Mongo,

The truck was delivered to Boyer as a "Cab & Chassis", with a standard drive-shaft (and GM tranny, for that matter!), and was then altered by the fire truck manufacturer Boyer who installed the pump transfer case.

I've never seen a commercial chassis of that vintage that had a 3rd-party transmission in it - that's pretty cool. The Clark tranny is probably longer than the original GM 4-speed, which affects the idea of putting in a donor shaft. Not sure what the output shaft is, either, for that matter. BUT, any competent drive-shaft shop could set-up a donor shaft to drop in. The rear-end is most likely stock.

I know the guy who sold the truck here in St. Louis - been on the block for quite a while. Glad it found a home, if only to be de-firebolted. Oh well . . . can't save 'em all!

-Michael

Sunday night Steve.
Time for a update.
Never mind, I just looked at your photo album.
You and Paul are doing good.
Don

Sorry for no update for a few guys. Pump has been successfully removed and the cross member and carrier bearing from a donor chassis I had at the lot has been grafted in place. Interestingly enough the Bearing was a little rough so after consulting the Master Parts we were able to get a replacement bearing from the O'Reilly's down the road and replace it. Got to love field serviceable parts!! We did end up offsetting the bearing a little from it's normal position via a plate we made up. This was done to allow him to use the original front drive shaft that ran from the Clark trans to the fire pump. The original rear drive shaft was a little too short. So we found a longer one in my truck pile and had it shortened about 3" to the proper length. Offsetting the bearing was done to keep us from having to have 2 drive shafts modified and the plate we put in place can be removed putting it back in it's normal position. Lot's of other detail work was handled over the weekend including getting the tail lights working again and removing some of the other fire truck parts.
The plan today was to mount the flatbed but a typical fuel system issue popped up and after a short tow back to the lot, Paul spent most of the day cleaning out the tank, carb and lines. Funny how removing several hundred pounds of weight off the back of a truck kicks up some crud in the tank.
I'll try to get some updated pictures on the link above tomorrow morning.
Mongo

Just got the word from Paul, he's arrived back home in Knoxville, TN from his 700 or so mile drive in his new 48 Flatbed. Along the way the truck rolled over 13k miles and ran great. We finished up the conversion Sunday afternoon. Monday morning Grant(GMC) Mosley and I stopped by to get some last minute photo's and see him off. I'm always excited to meet fellow bolters but to have one come by and hang out at the truck compound for 2 weeks on a project like this has been really fun! Paul's always welcome when he's cruising through town in his 48 and we look forward to meeting his wife in the future.

Updated pictures are here: https://plus.google.com/photos/110211271593344394189/albums/5699849278559087937

Steve
"Mongo"

So where did all the fire bolt parts go? ??

Safely stored away at the Old truck compound for now. Next summer when I go back to work on my firetruck I'll decide if I need any of them or if they need to get redistributed to other firebolters.
Most likely there will be some bits I don't need.
Mongo

The pump looks like a Hale 500gpm with a high presure booster pump on the rear. If you want to get rid of that high pressure pump, let me know. I have the same pump in mine but somewhere in the past 60+ years, somebody removed the high pressure booster.

Look at my web shots photos and you can see my pump as your looks just like mine.