The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area Engine Shop tools for stuck engine

Hi,
What type of tool/ breaker bar do you guys recommend to use order to try to turn my 46 216? I am hoping not to have to remove radiator etc at this point.
Thanks,
Andy

Some PB Blaster, Time, and a Snap-on A144A would be a good start.
http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item.asp?store=snapon-store&item_ID=12061&group_ID=1619

Be sure the valves are free before trying, or remove all the pushrods and deal with the valves later.

Also be sure the oil pump turns, we've sheared the tang on a distributor because of a locked up oil pump when turning over a stuck engine.

Grigg

If you don't want to remove the grill, radiator, etc. find a hand crank. I used one to turn my '51 after soaking the cylinders and valvetrain w/ Wynn's Xtend for a couple weeks. Runs great now.

Kroil or PB is your friend...and time. Let everything soak and try to knudge it a little at a time. was the truck received as expected?
Dan

Yes! Love it. But my question is about how to knudge it, without removing radiator etc!?

Put some KROIL in each cylinder and let it sit for a week.
Do it again.
Then try. If you aren't concerned with it too much. Tow it (slowly) and drop the clutch a few times.
If that don't work either. Yank the engine. It's stuck and/or broke or will be if you keep it up.

You could also use some marvel oil. I would take Griggs advice about dealing with the valves first.. I bent a pushrod freeing mine up.

Good on lubricants, just looking for a good suggestion for an effective tool to gently try to turn engine.

You could pull the flywheel cover and use a flat prybar or an old (big) screwdriver wedging between the flywheel teeth and the side of the bell housing. Go easy, you've got a lot of leverage there. Work one side then the other. After it budges a little I would hit it again with Kroil or PB, wait awhile, then pry some more.

x2

I was taking a little liberty with that statement. WHat I would rephrase it to say is;
If your engine is too stuck to get loose fairly easy with KROIL (or other), Then I would resort to pulling the head off to clean up the cylinder walls at a minimum. If it is stuck that bad, I think the probability of bending, breaking or just creating a big oil burning engine is quite likely.

There are a couple threaded holes in the balancer for mounting a puller that are 3/8" coarse IIRC. Clean them out, put a couple bolts there and then find a suitable bar to turn it.

Click the link I provided in the first reply
A cheaper method

Prying on the ring gear is a lot better than dealing with anything on the front of the engine for several reasons; it's easier to get to, more leverage, and less chance of harm to the engine/balancer.

Grigg

I agree with the snap-on flywheel tool.it also makes torqeing the flywheel bolts a breeze.Don,t try a cheap nock off flywheel holding tool unless you know a good hand reconstruction surgeon.

Ok.
So if I understand everybody correctly, I should drop the oil pan. Check the valves and if they seem ok, pull the transmission and slowly start working to get the engine turned from the flywheel?
Andy

Leave oil pan and transmission alone for the time being.

Grigg

I like to use the flat-tipped end of a carpenter's "shepherd's crook" wrecking bar applied to the flywheel teeth after removing the sheet metal cover at the bottom of the bellhousing. Nudge it a little way in each direction and stop if things get tight. Be careful not to break any teeth off the flywheel!
Jerry

You don't need to pull the transmission to get to the flywheel.
If you have a flywheel dust cover mounted, remove it to expose the flywheel.
There, you can pry the teeth against the bell housing to rotate the engine.
Also, you don't need to remove the oil pan, there is a side cover on the engine that can be removed to check the action and condition of your pushrods and lifters.
Jerry

There is, but I'd recommend you start with the valve cover, it's a lot easier to remove and you can see all you need to see.

If it's a particularly nasty engine then you may have some concerns with stuck lifters and could remove the side cover... I wouldn't at first, lifters don't usually stick unless there's water/rust involved.
If you're getting to stuck pistons, valves, and lifters chances are the engine's coming out for a rebuild/replacement.
If you think it'll run mostly as is then stick to the simple and easy stuff for now and see if that does the trick, don't get into it any more than necessary.

Grigg

The last6 cyl that I worked on that actually turned over real nice, had the valve cover full of mouse nest.
I agree with Grigg. Pull the valve cover and check. Lube the valves at least.
Try putting the truck in high gear and rock it forward and back with a friend to see if you can break it loose.

don't know if this will help but it's worth a try. mine sat for 30 years but was not stuck. i took the plugs out and poored a quart of power steering fluid down the intake. (any thing light would work just so it seeps into the rings) and then filled each cylinder full with a small rubber hose to make sure it was in all of them. maybe try that and let it set for a bit. then try moving the truck in gear like was suggested before.

Valves are not moving!
Now what?

I'm going to give you something to think about. When trying to free up a stuck engine, you want penetrants. Not oil. Oils will not dissolve, they will lubricate. Use penetrants on valves, pistons, timing chains, rods and crank shafts, nuts and bolts that are rusted or stuck. Not oil.
Marvel mystery oil ....is oil. tranny fluid is oil, power steering fluid is oil.

WD-40 is a penetrant (sort of), KROIL is the best penetrant I have found and used. PB Blaster is a penetrant. etc. etc.

Here is a test I did for penetrants a few years back. Read this;

https://www.stovebolt.com/ubbthread...l&topic=0&Search=true#Post215167

Is the crankshaft turning yet? If you're trying to move the valves by prying on the rocker arms, it might be necessary to thump the valve spring end of the rockers with a big rubber mallet after soaking the valve springs and stems down with a good penetrant like PB Blaster, WD-40, or Kroil. If the crankshaft is turning and the rocker arms aren't moving, it's time for a pretty detailed disassembly.

Edit: If nothing else is available, Diesel fuel makes a pretty good penetrating oil.
Jerry

Ok. I will order Kroil.
I have not done anything else on the crankshaft at this point as I tried to follow the advise to inspect the valves first in order to not break anything.
So once I get the Kroil I will spray on the valves, springs and pour it into spark plug holes. Am I forgetting something?

At some point, if the engine doesn't come loose with all this monkeying around we've been putting you through. The engine is going to have to come apart so you don't bust or bend parts.

Like Jerry said, after you spray the valves and springs, "tap" them with a hammer to make sure the valves will move. Let the penetrants to do their job. Let it sit for a day or so after spraying into the spark plug holes. How well your penatrant works may depend on what, and how much you may have already used and what is in the cylinders already. It may not work as well is you have already put oil in them. Leave the truck in high gear and every time you walk by the truck, try to rock it forward and back. Keep trying.

If this engine is stuck pretty good, you might want to really think about taking the push rods out too. If the valves move down and stick in the open position, and then you start to get the engine loosened up and turn it over, you could end up bending a valve.

IMHO, I don't feel you have to work real hard to break loose the engine. If you do, you are probably better off at least removing the head to find out how bad the pistons are stuck. Maybe then go for broke and yank the engine.

Also keep in mind that the test I did with PB and KROIL was on an engine that would need complete rebuilding. It was stuck! IMO when the pistons need to be beat on with a 2x2, it's too late.

We are trying to help, and we are interested in you being successful, so don't get discouraged. I feel really good after I figure out something and/or accomplish a task like you are doing.

Let us know how it is going and keep asking questions.

...and Jerry (Hotrod Lincoln) is the man in the know....as far as I know.

I do appreciate all the help very, very much!! I have worked on classic cars before, but not to this extend. I do consider myself pretty handy, but do have a lot to learn, especially the correct terms etc..
I will take it slow and will try everything I can prior to pulling the engine out completely and go broke.
My other big headache at this point is trying to get the truck out of gear. I posted this on the other forum, but got little response.
Here is the situation: truck rolls with clutch pushed in. Took out shifter. Gears look ok and can be moved slightly by hand. When sitting in driver' s seat, I am able to slide the mechanism (first and reverse I think) back and forward on the shaft. Can not do that on left shaft.
Placed interlocking plate in the grooves and reinstalled shifted (3 times), but can not shift. The shifted interlocking guide plate is permanently fixed to the cover. Am I missing something? What am I doing wrong???
Andy

Do you know if it is in gear? If so, you could jack up one rear wheel, put it on a jack stand and try turning the rear wheel to turn the motor. I have used that method to get a motor to turn.

Yes. It is in gear. That is why I am going through all this. Need to get it out of gear. Rolls with clutch pushed in. Read chapter in shop manual many times.

Along with maybe providing an easy way to nudge the engine over, you could help diagnose your transmission problem. If you cannot turn one back wheel with the clutch pushed in, then your transmission is locked up somehow.

The engine is stuck! Regardless of what gear the trans is in (besides neutral if you call that a gear) nothing is going to turn over with the clutch engaged, unless you can get the engine unstuck.

The only things I can think of are that you either have the tranny in gear and you are not getting it into neutral. And/or you may have two gears engaged at once. And/or you have a tranny frozen too. What did your tranny oil look like when you drained it? Any water whatsoever in the oil?

You are just going to have to figure out where neutral is, and also if the tranny is stuck too.

Do you have any friends or Stovebolters with more mechanical background that live close to you, that may be able to take a look for you?

I know. Thanks. Two separate issues.
I will take the tranny out and rebuild it over the winter.
I was only asking if anybody had any ideas or suggestions.

FILL CYLINDERS WITH OIL AND LET SET AS long as possible then with plugs out turn engine over " backwards". this will push all oil out exhaust and not hydraulic cylinders. check spark plugs for rust-moisture etc. there tattle tales. check crank case oil for water too...... also make sure valves arnt stuck or you will bend them or bend pushrods/ valve into pistons etc.
jmo
bob