The Stovebolt Site Forums The Parking Lot Tons 'o Fun Wheel Cylinder size?

Okay. So I to put new brakes all around and I start on the rear brakes. I have my new brake shoes and wheel cylinders and such in hand, and I find this...

http://i1226.photobucket.com/albums/ee408/panacchai/wheelcylinder.jpg

I hold up my new replacement cylinder from Jim Carters (great looking product by the way) and realize my cylinder is not the right size. I check my package... 1 Ton Wheel cylinder 14" drum - rear. However the cylinder on the truck is much larger. What size is this? Anyone even know or have seen this brake system before?

http://i1226.photobucket.com/albums/ee408/panacchai/rearbrake-innerds.jpg

Dave

Hy Dave51Chev, according to the Jim Carter catalog your truck should use their part number ME773 1 3/8", what did you order? The picture of your brakes is of pre 1953 Huck brakes.

I ordered just a pair of those. 1 3/8" bore and everything. I haven't measured the others yet, but they seem to be something like a 1 1/2" bore size. They are about 30% larger in size to the wheel cylinders I received from them.

Are both photos of your current rear brake? Looks correct to me.

https://picasaweb.google.com/wmhatfield/BrakesBearings#5529177572240693138

Yes. The master cylinder was said to need replacing by the PO, which I had done by my mechanic. It was pretty well pitted. The brakes worked fine until the leak in the front cylinders showed up several weeks later, so I am replacing them all for consistency.

When I get a chance I'll try and get a picture of the new wheel cylinder next to the current. It's the new one that doesn't seem to mathc.

I'm a newbie to doing some of these repairs. Brakes is a whole new field for me. My mechanic encouraged me to try it myself. He doesn't want to take all the fun out of this for me.

Don't get discouraged Dave, you're just having some bad luck getting the parts - once you have the right ones, its pretty straight forward.

The only difference between the rear cylinder and the front are the geared adjusters. You should check and see what you have on the front.

http://chevy.oldcarmanualproject.com/shop/1948_51truck/51ctsm0536.htm

1 3/8" is what your looking for.

Okay so I snapped a picture with what I got and what I have. The rear drum brake in this picture is of my 51-1Ton panel. I checked it as well. It even has "1 3/8" cast on the cylinder!

http://i1226.photobucket.com/albums/ee408/panacchai/sidebyside.jpg

This is the REAR 1 TON Wheel Cylinder I ordered from Chevsofthe40s. Is it a matter of different adjustment gears? What have I got?

Hy Dave51Chev, what part number did you order from Chevs of the 40s? I think you want 5450071, I think you might have 5300866.

They (I have a pair) are part# 5450071. I think Bigtonka is onto something. I think they may have come with the adjustment gears for front wheels. But I need to investigate more. If spare time permits, I got to check the front cylinders. That's where the leak is, but I first wanted to tackle the park brake attachment on the rear and meanwhile change out the brake parts.

I just browsed through Bigtonkas pics of his reassembled brakes [front and rear], and I think I may have answered my question.

Thanks guys for all your input!

Yes, those are most definitely fronts. You could use them in the front or swap the adjusters from your old ones (if their not too bad) I think you would also have to remove (or swap) that clip that steps the adjustments.

What's your plan?

I am planning on doing all four brakes. I guess now I will do the front first, then the back. I'll be ordering some rear cylinders from Jim Carter. I should call chevsofthe40s and let them know so they can adjust their description for other buyers.

Bigtonka, what did you do to clean up your parts? Blast then paint? I will be having my shoes relined, so I'll be reusing them. But I want it better looking if I'm getting newer parts where I can.

Dave,

My parts looked just like the condition of yours do now. (as you can see from my photos) I bought a handheld siphon sandblaster and blasted them in a home made blast cabinet.

https://picasaweb.google.com/wmhatfield/MyUnnamedToyProject#5523865059123170306

Before blasting though I had to clean off the grease and oil. My wheel seals were done and leaked diff fluid all through the brake assembly. This is a good time to replace them, you don't want to ruin new brake pads.

I cleaned the "dangerous" way - using gas! *insert warnings and cautions* Then I blasted and painted all my parts with silver and black rust paint. This included all the springs etc...

Of course nothing was painted when it was new - so this is purely to feed my obsession!

Who's doing the shoe relining?

Page Brake. They're a brake supplier out of Salt Lake City. They have a local store I can drop them off at. It's about $20 a shoe.

My uncle used to always use diesel fuel to clean with. It had less of an odor, but it still is flammable!
Why not just use brake cleaner and a shop rag to remove the dirt and oil?

Ya, I used brake cleaner as well - just the real built up parts I let soak in gas.

Hey Bigtonka. Did you buy new shoes or have them relined? I am wondering if it's okay to blast and paint, then send them off for relining?

Hi Dave,

I had the existing shoes relined. When I got them back, part of relining is cleaning and painting. So what you see in my photos is what the shop did. (to my surprise!)

This was the first time I've had this done, so I was pleasantly surprised. Ask Page Brake if the service includes that.

Mark

I'm dropping them off today. I'll ask if that's include. If not, I'll request the service. It's worth it! My assembly won't be as nice as yours, but it'll look a lot nicer than it was.

More important is the function over looks!

i got my new wheel cylinders today! It's a match! As soon as the brakes shoe come back and are installed, I'll load up a few pictures.

FYI... for anyone who is considering having their brake shoes relined, it is general practice that the shoes are cleaned and painted to ensure the friction material has a good surface to bond to. If you can't find new shoes, this is a great alternative. Thanks to the guys at Page Brake in Salt Lake City for the info!

Excellent - bet you can't wait to get them reassembled!

Brakes are done! Newly relined shoes, new cylinders, fresh brake fluid. Went to start the truck to do a rolling test... the battery dies. It's on the charger. Might have to wait til tomorrow morning for that ride.

Great news! Congratulations on getting the big solo project done!

Now can someone tell me if the only difference between the fronts and rears are the adjusters?
There is a $40+ price difference between the fronts and rears at NAPA, and I'm thinking I could just swap the adjusters from the old wheel cylinders over to a set of front ones?

Jeremy
Cheap skate

are you talking w/c. if so the rears are larger
cheap skate in playing with brakes is playing with others lives; yours doesn't count
ron

Wrong - the wheel cylinders on a 1 ton front and rear are the same size.

Napa numbers. fronts UP4358, rears UP9325, they both have 1 3/8" bores, just different adjusters.

If the adjusters are cleaned up they'll swap and work just fine.

mine are bigger on the rear. of course mine is a little newer

Jeremy,
Unfortunately, the rear cylinders are actually "longer" than the front cylinders eventhough they have the same bore diameter (see my pic). The front is a 12" drum and the rear is a 14" drum; take that into consideration as well.

To be honest, the price difference for me was $20. $50 for front, $70 for rear. Fronts were purchased from Chevsfromthe40s and rears from Jim Carter Classic Truck Parts as mentioned above. Best deals I could find. Local Auto Parts Stores are going to list them more expensive, and they'll have to order them anyway. I recommend you order them online from the same place as me. Shipping was fast from both places.

Really? I hate to be a source of miss information!

Now I have to check my old parts. I was told last year that they're the same less the adjusters. :P

why not hone them first and see what they look like. you might just be able to use a kit.
ron

The cylinder length difference is nominal, like 1/8 or 1/4". It just means it'll hold more fluid. For the larger size drum, I guess you can use the rear adjusters and extend the adjusting screws. Oh yeah and that flap for the adjusters.

Padresag has a good suggestion. Hone the cylinder and see what you got. Sometimes a kit is all you need for a repair. Pitting is usually the culprit of a bad cylinder.

If you do swap a front cylinder to the rear, you may find that the brake line fitting looks different since the front uses a hose and the rear has a junction block with a banjo bolt.

Thanks for the input, I'll see what the fronts look like this week. I suspect the rears are pitted, the m/c certainly was. If the fronts won't interchange, I'm more likely to sleeve, hone and rebuild the rears rather than not buy locally.
My NAPA is a nice family owned shop. They treat me well and will always give me a lower price than list. I'll support them for all the stuff they can get for me. I'll save the mail order shops for the stuff no one else has..

Jeremy