The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area The HiPo Shop Straight 6 turbo diesel in a 55.2?

Out of curiosity, is it possible to swap to a 6 cylinder turbo diesel engine into a 1955.2 Chevy 3100? I've seen a V8 diesel but not a straight 6. I saw an old Toyota FJ with a straight 6 diesel that ran on bio fuel made from restaurant oil and thought that would be pretty cool. It got pretty good gas mileage too.

It's possible yes,

Some will be simpler and some better than others, what engine do you have in mind?
Also depends on what you want to do with the truck.

In general a 1/2 ton is on the small side for most 6 cylinder diesels you'll readily find. lots more suitable 4 cylinders though. Or step up to a larger truck and stick with your 6 cylinder ideas.

Grigg

I've got an Onan/Cummins inline 6 Diesel with a turbo that dyno checks at 120 HP at 3,600 RPM. It was used by UPS in their delivery vans, interchangeably with Ford 300 and Chevy 292 engines. It's set up to use the same motor mounts and transmission as a 292 already, but it's somewhat heavier, so it would be best if used in a 3/4 ton or higher-capacity vehicle. I'm planning to use mine in an 87 Ford F-350 flatbed with a 12-foot bed. It's already gone through two 351W V-8's and two C-6 transmissions, so maybe the diesel engine and a New Process 235 4-speed from a late-70's GMC will hold up better. I've already got a Chevy 14-bolt limited slip rear axle under it. Talk about a Ford with an identity crisis!
Jerry

A couple years ago I saw a 58 or 9 gmc on ebay with a dodge cummins turbo diesel. They even managed to somehow adapt a 270/302 valve cover to work on this engine. I'm not sure what was involved in the swap.

What got me on this idea was a National Geographic show about the "end of oil". The premise was is that the world suddenly ran out of oil and they created scenarios of how people would cope. It seems that diesel engines win out as they can run off of reclaimed vegetable oil. My wife turned to me and asked "can you put a diesel in that thing?" (the thing being my 55.2 Chevy 3100 Napco 4x4).

Jerry,
Do you think the original Thriftmaster 6 weighs close to the Onan/Cummins you are talking about? I don't think a 4 cylinder diesel would pull my 4x4?

BigBadSwingDaddy,
Is it this truck you are thinking about?
58 diesel

Killer truck, but it must be a 3/4 or 1 ton.

Not that I am about to do this swap, but it is interesting to think about the possibilities.

Now that I look closely at that video, that is a straight 6!

The Onan engine is a little heavier than the stovebolt 6. I sold one to a guy who put it into a CJ-7 Jeep, so other than adding a few spring leaves, you probably wouldn't have much of a problem adapting it. I definitely wouldn't try it with one of the wuss IFS suspensions like a M-II. A Diesel engine is for serious truckers, not somebody with a pantywaist street rod.
Jerry

I think the right one will.
Not the right choice for your truck, but the 4 cylinder in my 2 ton will have no problems going down the road and hauling a load too.

If you're serious about a Diesel swap I suggest you look closely at a Cummins 4BT, which is essentially 2/3 of a Dodge Cummins engine.
Lots of reading and ideas here at www.4BTSwaps.com

One issue you may have is axle gears, if your NAPCO front axle is geared slow with no faster options you may or may not be able to get enough overdrive in there to make it worth while.
Proper gearing is the key to a successful diesel conversion, before buying a single part ensure that you can make the gearing work. Typically Diesels run slower than the gas engines they replace and need faster gears to be both economical and enjoyable on the highway.

Grigg

Grigg,
Never thought of the gears being an issue. I don't know exactly, but this truck has high gear ratios. I'm guessing I would need a pressurized gas tank too with return lines?

Thanks for all the information!

To figure the gear ratios and speeds you need to know a few things,
Gear ratios in the axles, and any other ratios available if any.
Engine you desire to use, and the RPM where it makes peak torque.
Tire size (actual outside diameter).
Transmission OD ratio if any, or ratios for possible transmissions.
How fast you'd like to cruise on the highway.

With that info you can plug the numbers into one of the many on-line gear calculators to do the math for you.
http://www.onlineconversion.com/bigger_tires.htm

For example My truck can use 3.54 or 3.73 axle gears. Has 38" tires, a 0.80 overdrive ratio, likes 1,800 rpm and I want to go 68 mph.
A 3.73 axle ratio in OD gives me that.
Or more likely I'll use 3.54 to give 2,000 rpm at 65 mph in direct for towing, and in OD can cruise comfortably at 70-75.

There is a lot to learn and figure before starting on a diesel conversion. I suggest you spend some time browsing 4btswaps.com.

No, fuel tanks need to be vented, yes you'll need a return line as well as the pickup line.

Grigg

Another thing to consider is the RPM range where the engine reaches its horsepower and torque peaks. Generally speaking, an engine should begin pulling in any gear at or just below its torque peak, and wind up to near the HP peak before shifting to the next higher gear. The Detriot diesels Grigg likes have a very narrow power band, aboutt 400-500 RPM between shifts. The Detroit, being a 2-cycle engine, sounds like it's running twice as fast as normal because the cylinders fire on every downstroke of the piston. Most Detroits have a maximum governed speed of about 2100-2300 RPM, and a minimum loaded speed of 1,750. Detroits DO NOT like to be lugged down! The Onan/Cummins engine I have has a rated speed of 3,600 RPM, with a torque peak near 1,800 RPM almost the same as a similar gas engine, so gearing isn't as much of an issue for it.
Jerry

Maybe instead of swapping the engine out of my 55, I'll just have to start a new Toyota FJ or Jeep project! I would love to have an old Toyota FJ with that Onan/Cummins 4 banger. Probably could tow my 55 with it when the world runs out of oil! Anyone have an FJ crew cab pickup they want to sell? My wife would just love that.

Do some more research,
The Onan/Cummins Jerry mentioned is a 6 cylinder, model 6AT, some more info here:
http://www.4btswaps.com/forum/forum...ariants-Sponsored-by-Proffitt-s-Cruisers

The popular Cummins 4 cylinder is a model 6BT.

Grigg

I would say that for a '55-2 pick up, one should look more at a car diesel engine, smaller, lighter, powerful and driven pretty much like a gas engine. What I would consider my dream engine for my '57 Suburban is the Mercedes diesel engine found in mid-size Mercedes cars as well as in the Dodge Sprinter vans. Depending on the years, it is an L6 or a V6: plenty of hoomph, very thrifty to run, quiet... And not a heavy monster of an engine: ideal for our smallish trucks! And a loaded Mercedes sedan can cruise all day at 160mph no sweat... This engine is also available in the Jeep Grand Cherokees, I believe...

I thought the mercedes diesels were only 5 cylinders.

Now, we are dreaming, the german manufacturers have really cool diesel engines for their big sedans, V10 or V12, twin turbo, 300hp and up, and smooth enough for the comfort of a big Mercedes or BMW... Oh, and did I mention the top speed on those cars is usually electronically limited at 250kmh (or 156mph)! And they use very little fuel and have very clean exhaust...
Diesel are not just for trucks!
When I grow up, I want one like that in my '57 Bel-Air!

But why use a foreign made, hard to get parts for, and overpriced engine when there's plenty of AMERICAN MADE Deisels avaiable that are just as reliable (perhaps even more so) and that can make as much or more power?

I did say I was dreaming, these engines are amazing but indeed not available here...
Still, being car engines, they would be easier to install that a heavy American-made diesel. The typical Big-3 truck diesel engines are very heavy (requiring suspension/brakes upgrades), very big (may not fit everywhere), have way too much torque for most hobbyists (requiring big and heavy trans/rear-end), so they are not the best to fit/drive in an old truck. Hence my suggestion of using the Dodge Sprinter engine, easier and more common here...
Still, 300hp twin-turbo diesel V12, I am drooling just typing it!!!

Well, you could always try an Electo-Motive railroad Diesel! 14 and 16-inch pistons, depending on the model number!
Jerry

I would like to see some small VW diesels. My 2006 gets 45 mpg and stock has near the same power rating. It would be tough to integrate one though I would imagine.

I don't know how hard it would be to fit one in a 'Bolt, but I have seen the VW deisels used in rock crawler buggies and even a few Jeeps.

I put more than that down with my daily driver dodge diesel! and it only has 6 cylinders not 8 like the durapuke or flowerstroke! I have a 48 Chrysler with a mbz diesel in it and it works perfect in it. if i were to put a diesel in a bolt it would be a warmed over 4BT puttin out about 350 hp, nice small, light weight and plenty of hp and torque.

"Running out of oil"....
Did you know this topic was discussed, with extreme secrecy, among heads of state and industry before?
The major oil companies (Shell, etc.), refineries, tankers, etc. all considered what to do (national defense, heating, lubrication, transport) if the global oil supply ran out.
They decided that the most practical replacement was alcohol, and the major distillers (Seagram etc.) were brought in for studies on how much would be available, changes, costs, logistics.
Sound a bit familiar?

It was 1916.

I posted that as more of an example of what can be doen with an American Deisel engine, rather than plugging particular one. BTW, that engine in the vid was DETUNED to 800 horses, the truck wouldn't hook up otherwise.

Lets say we didn't run out of oil, just had another shortage, a diesel that can be run on cooking oil would be pretty cool. If I had the money I would buy this baby:

Icon FJ

There is a 2.8 276trq 4 cylinder intercooled turbo diesel capable of 25MPG+ available for it.

The $90,000 + price tag is a bit out of my price range though!

Just a thought, if we ran out of oil, what would we use for engine lube?

Good question. Can you add a thickening agent to vegetable based oils? Might get 30 weight out of it.

What is synthetic motor oil made out of (Mobil 1)?

All lubricating oils start out as the same base stock, regardless of conventional or synthetic. There's a common misconception that synthetic oils are made from labratory created materials, they are not. The main thing with synthetics is that they are refined further to get a uniform molicule size, making for a better lubricant.