The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area Engine Shop Lots of answers on timing here, but I need help.

Hello Gentlemen, I have a 53 3100 216 and looking at the engine code identification (GAA) it appears (to my suprise) it has a 1949 car engine in it, that I had completly rebuilt. The babbits were taken out and insert bearings were cut in. Everything was replaced, pistions, valves, cam, I mean..everything 2 years ago. Below is a response Hotrod Lincon posted a while back when he helped someone else get their truck running, also side question do I use a screw driver to get the oil pump to line up with the correct position of the rotor I want? I actually got it running yesterday after it sat about 2 years but it was at half throttle to keep it running and running very rough. I had to turn the distrubitor no where near #1 to get it to run. I read the timing procedure here on SB last week and used it to line the ball up, but didn't take into consideration if it was on the compression stroke or not. I lined the ball and #1. The pistion was at the top of the stroke because I could actually see it with my flash light and both rockers were slightly loose so I thought I was at TDC. Will I be on the right track if I pull the disrubitior and start over using this below that Hotrod Lincoln typed to someone else previously? Thank god I am not a smoker and there are no matches in the house! Yesterday I felt like making it Haggerty's problem. Also can the distrubitor be one tooth off the cam or could the oil pump drive slot have moved the correct placement of the distributor? I need help, Thanks for any suggestions. MY frustration is at a 10 right now.

Hotrod Lincoln to another Stove Bolter:
>Yes, line the pointer up with the ball, >after being sure the #1 cylinder is on >the compression stroke. When you can feel >pressure in the cylinder by putting your >finger over the #1 plug hole as the >engine turns, you're on the right track. >Once the ball lines up with the pointer >turn the distributor housing clockwise >until the points close, then turn it back >CCW until they just barely open. If you >want to get it exact, use a test light on >the distributor primary wire. With the >points closed and the ignition switch on, >the light will go out. Turn the dizzy >housing counterclockwise until the light >just comes on, and you'll be timed close >enough to start.
>Jerry

Thanks John

I would follow the info you found.And yes, you can align the oil pump slot to the distributor tang with a screwdriver. Also, make sure your ignition wires follow the correct timing sequence. That is, some may be on the wrong plug. After 2 years,anything is possible.

John,
A little bit more precise way to be sure you are up on the compression stroke on #1 would be to take the valve cover off. Rotate the engine by hand, watching the rocker arms. When you see the #1 intake valve closing then start watching the steel ball and the pointer - when they are lined up you should be at TDC. Then follow Hotrod Lincoln's directions on setting the points.
If you had it running but it was very rough it could be that the timing is way retarded, the distributor is one tooth off or the plug wires could be out of order. To tell if it is simply out of time - while you have it running try moving the distributor very slowy to see if it smooths out. If it does, you can, for starters, time it by ear and find where it runs smooth but doesn't kick back when you try to start it (meaning you are too far advanced). If you can't turn the distributor far enough to get it to smooth out they you are either one tooth off on the distributor drive gear or the plug wires are not in the correct order.
If you are off by one tooth on the drive gear just pull the distributor out just far enough to move it one tooth ahead or back depending on if you feel it is too far retarded or advanced. Once you have slid it back in enough to engage the gear on the cam, you won't be lined up with the oil pump slot any longer. So leave the distributor where it is, install the hold down (with light pressure so it won't jump another tooth on the cam gear) and slowly rotate the engine by hand until the distributor shaft drops into the oil pump slot. Then add some tension to the dist hold down and start the timing process.
To check the plug wires, simple find which one goes to the #1 cylinder and then, going clockwise, the order should be 1-5-3-6-2-4,assuming it is the same as the later model 6's.
Hope that helps - I know that timing stuff can be frustrating. Good luck!

Thank both of you. I pulled the whole thing apart and will be starting over. I was very careful to not move the rotor when I was pulling the distrubitor out to make sure that it was driving the oil pump. It wasn't. The distrubitor was on the cam gear but never did drop into the oil pump. I ran it on and off for about 3 minutes when I could get it to run, hopefully I didn't do a lot of damage to the bearings. Only time will tell. Darn it all. Well I am going to Kmart and buy a 6 volt battery charger and a dwell/volt meter to see if I can confirm everything before I try to start it again. darn, darn, darn...also I bought new distrubitor but it didn't come with the vacuum advance. I slid my old vacuum advance on (after I cleaned it up) and then put on the two oil ring seals. Does it mater where the vacuum advance is located on the base or just get it in time and then when all is done tighten it down so the vacuum line that runs to the carb is lined up on the right side? That wouldn't seem to make much difference is that a correct assumption?

On the pad to the left of the distributor should be a Zero center line inscribed.You may have to clean the pad to see it. Line up the center lined zero mark on the vacuum advance base plate with the pad center line, then tighten the plate down. Always make sure you have engaged the oil pump. After you have the dist. installed mark a piece of tape on the dist. side where the rotor points to cylinder #1 in case you have to rotate the distributor to correct the timing. This gives you a temporary reference point to come back to if need be.

OK. I'll clean it up and find the zero mark, Thanks again Drew

If you really think that the oil pump was not turning you should prime the oiling system before running it again. You can turn the oil pump with a drill and a sawed off screw driver.

OK, good suggestion.. I will do that. Thanks

Thank you Drew, Thank you Arpee, Thank you Truckernix... Drew your suggestion about putting a small amount of tape where the #1 rotor should point is a life saver. When pulling the Dist back out and wanting to move it one tooth lets you know if you have done that or not right away before dropping it all the way in and seeing where it ends up. Great little tech hint. Well as you know Murphy came with my truck also and now the water pump is leaking out of the vent hole. I ordered a new one but I see no reason the ignition system will be any more trouble. It is such a good feeling when it bottomed out in the oil pump and it was pointing to #1 that I yelled out in the garage, I was home alone, but hey.. it felt so good! I ran a cut off screw driver on the oil pump for 2 minutes or so, hopefully the running woth out oil didn't hurt it to bad. If he used white lithium grease on the bearings when he put it together I think all will be good. Arpee that was a great way of verifying that it was on the compression stroke and not 180degrees out, thanks. I had it rebuilt 2 years ago and I guess I should have gotten it running long before now, but hey at least it is now on the road to running. I searched why my amp guage was showing discharge when it did run for those few munites. I polorized the generator according to a search I found here. Hopefully that is fixed also. Slow but sure everyday I feel like I am making progress, Thanks for your assistance. I would have been mired down in old motors manuals for days. As soon as the water pump arrives I will see if it will start but all is hopeful right now. Thanks. I am another one that will be donating to John and Peg for keeping this site alive. That was such a good idea.