The Stovebolt Site Forums The Parking Lot Big Bolts Detroit Diesel info

I'm looking for a site or sites that would have some good info on the 8v71 and 8v92. If someone could point them out to me, I would appreciate it. I've been browsing for an Astro or Titan with the above mentioned engines to see if this is something I would want. Have found a few. Even came across a '73 Titan!

There are a few members here who play with the big rigs. Do you intend to use them as the factory intended, to haul freight, or as some sort of expensive toy? 2-stroke Detroits are fun to play with, but they're hopelessly obsolete as a commercial option. The fuel mileage is too low, and they're almost impossible to clean up sufficiently to pass smoke-emission standards for commercial use. They do have a unique sound, sort of like a chainsaw on steroids!
Jerry

Yes, fun to play with.

But I take offense to the other bits
Not obsolete, I think we'd all be surprised by the number of Detroit two cycles still running and making money today. As an example a friend of mine runs a big farm and was recently tasked with finding a tandem axle tractor to haul their product, first on his list was as new a truck as he could get with an 8V92T DDEC, and looked at several mid to late 80's trucks. But not a happy ending... for only a few thousand more they bought a nice 10 year newer KW with a big cat.. Detroits may not keep up on the road with new trucks, but I would say far from obsolete, and the later model 2 cycle trucks seem to hold value better than somewhat newer trucks without two cycles.
In fact the military still buys new ones and plans to through 2050! . and another article about new military two cycles.

About the almost impossible to clean up emissions.. Not entirely true, Have a look at this solution
The contact person listed on that site, Don Fairchild, frequents the Detroit Diesel Yahoo group http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/DetroitDiesel/
I expect you'll find a lot of your answers on Detroits there.

Also look at this site for Detroit info http://www.4btswaps.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=28

Grigg

There is not much information out there since Daimler Benz completely ditched all support of the Detroit 2 cycle engines. There are lots of forums out there discussing the 2 cycles. However some information on forums is correct and some not. Every Motor's truck manual that was printed until about 1990 will have a good section on Detroit Diesel. These appear on eBay all the time as other literature about the 2 cycle Diesels. Since there are no OEM parts made any more, it has been kind of a dead subject. Aftermarket parts are still available. As far as the cabovers, they are still around. There is one here in town that is used as a haul truck for equipment. However, not many of the cabovers survived. Even though they were produced for 20 years, they never had much market share and were mainly purchased by fleets that scrapped them when they were done with them because they had such low resale value.

In that press release link in the first quote you can find

I have had no problems getting genuine Detroit parts thus far, and aftermarket parts will be around for a long time to come in addition to MTU's projected support of two cycles into 2050.
Detroit two cycles were not "completely ditched", nor are they a "dead subject".

Grigg

OK, consider me duly chastized! I've pulled thousands of tons of freight up and down the road behind an old Detroit 318, and the last heavy-haul wrecker I drove was on a GMC Astro 3-axle with an 8V-92T engine. When the full-electronic Detroit 60 was introduced, it pretty much spelled the beginning of the end for the 2-stroke engines as freight haulers. Yes, they can still fill a niche for certain types of specialty uses.
Jerry

MTU is a subsidiary of Tognum AG in Germany. They are a large conglomerate that builds heavy engines. Daimler did indeed pull the rug on Paccar and Navistar by removing their ability to support any Detroit engine. That leaves only Freightliner having access to Detroit Parts. Freightliner does not support the 2 cycle engines, but there are a lot of 2 cycles out there and parts are available. As far as military goes, the 2 cycles are still all mechanical which is a big plus in the remote areas of the world where we use them, they start better than other Diesels, and they are very tolerant to operator abuse. GM won big contracts to supply the military for almost 75 years which means there are a lot of them out there and I think they are probably the best suited for the job.

MTU division of Togum AG landed themselves a good deal by supporting the military. In fact if you look at their stock, it is doing better on the German DAX than our domestic engine manufacturers.

As far as feasibility to to be used in todays class 8 transportation industry, Detroit mechanical engines as well as Cummins and Cat mechanical engines have lost their place in the sun.

However, the original question was about the GMC Astro and the Chev Titan. Both of these went into production around 1968 so I feel they belong in this forum. They are trucks, they are GM and they were built before 1972. However the fact remains, very few GM built class 8 trucks built from this platform survived. Support is much more difficult to find in the trucking industry since Daimler got out of the picture.

I'm not sure how relevant military engines, industrial engines and trucks of the 80's are in a forum aimed at pre 1973 trucks.

The two cycles being built brand new for the military today are actually electronic engines, not as electronic as a modern engine, but not entirely mechanical either.

I brought up the military and newer engines to illustrate their continued use now 10 years after we as civilians bought our last new two cycles.
And to show they are not entirely obsolete, or even as close as some may think, and to show that parts are still readily available.

The guy is looking for support and encouragement for his Detroit dreams.
This thread started out on a down note, and not entirely true or well deserved.
I'm just trying to cheer things up and encourage our fellow stovebolter that wants a Detroit and is curious if he can get parts and info.

Grigg

Thanks to all for the replies. It would be for pure enjoyment. Most of the trucks I've seen for sale have not been what I would consider expensive. That's what drew me to owning one. But it's not like buying a classic car either. I've loved the Detroit sound since I was a small boy. I'm 48 now. So I'm toying with the idea of owning one. I have stumbled across videos on You Tube of Detroit powered trucks submitted by their owners. To me nothing sounds better than a 8v71 or 8v92. And I've always felt that way. By the way, Grigg, I saw your videos of the '48. Very nice.

The trucks will be pretty inexpensive, since it's pretty much of a given that you'll be buying a ragged-out road tractor with a bazillion miles on it before being put out to pasture. If you can find one with a fairly low-hour reman engine that's got some lfe left in it, you'll still need to give it a thorough check-out for stress cracks in the frame, broken spring leaves, worn spring shackles, transmission issues, brakes, and drive axle problems. A major repair on any of these running gear items can get deep into your pocket in a hurry.
Jerry

kwf, there are more nice old trucks out there than you think. I have found many nice trucks and have bought 3. I just sold my '72 GMC 9500 with a 6-71. It had 130,000 original miles on it when I got it and was in very nice shape. I just bought another '59 860 with the same motor that is also in great shape. Not all old road tractors are "ragged out". You may also consider spending some time on the ATHS forum (as well as right here!!). There are folks over there that are very fond and knowledgeable of Detroits. There are couple of recent threads going on that may interest you.
Hope you find the truck you are looking forward.
Keep us posted.
Bill

I was just going to say just what Bill said. Stop by ATHS for other enthusiasts still driving these great old trucks as well as great info.

BTW, If genuine Detroit parts are no longer available it sure is news to me !?!?

Bill

For what it is worth,

Here in Utah we have a Detroit Rebuild facility. My brother in law is there (has been for years) and they are still re-manufacturing and supplying parts for the older 2 strokes.
(mind you they are doing so on a military contract) but I point this out just to say that the parts and availability will still be out there.
you might just have to change where you look and start looking at some military equipment in the future for parts.

Just my .02 I will let the confusion continue now....

Right now I'm just doing research to see if this is something I want to tackle. Like how much these things are worth, learning to drive one(biggest thing I've driven is a C65 with a 366 and a 5/2), and whatever else I need. I am a quick learner though. The driving end should take care of itself. Are there any websites that have ads for old semi tractors? ATHS, Commercial Truck Paper, and Truckpaper are the only ones that come to mind. Thanks for the help and comments.

How about Ebay? I look there often if for no other reason, just to see whats out there. Some times is kind of like having a truck show at your finger tips.....

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Pete...ptZCommercial_Trucks?hash=item3359c2fdcb

As far as learning to drive a big truck, thats part of the fun of owning one. The first big truck I bought was b model Mack that had a two stick transmission in it. I did not put a whole lot of miles on it in the time that it was mine but I feel like I got the hang of it fast. I have a 13spd in the 860 that is totally new to me but I'm learning..... slowly!

Bill

kwf, If you buy a Detroit with a Road Ranger, rev it high and shift fast,lol. Don't forget to Double Clutch (unless you master the art of shifting w/o the clutch. I have no problem with that, but I prefer to use the clutch).

Bill

ATHS has a few ads http://www.aths.org/cads.cfm?view=view&type=WOT

I have dealt with these people before
http://www.truckpaper.com/listingsdetail/detail.aspx?OHID=1911977
If you don't like the 7 speed, any Eaton/Fuller, Rockwell or Spicer transmission for a class 8 truck will fit.

Any of the older transmissions here will probably go for a couple of hundred. I will probably take a load of engines and transmissions to the Plunk's sale. http://berryhillauctioneers.com/auction.php?aid=531&page=inv

An individual who probably wants to recoup his money because it has been on the market a long time

http://www.truckpaper.com/listingsdetail/detail.aspx?OHID=2174844

Thanks crenwelge. I've seen that '81 Astro. That would be the truck for me but I'm sure the price is way more than I can afford. I've seen a couple of cabovers with Detroits here http://bradsclassictrucks.com/ but they are not GM. One is a '78 Peterbilt with a 8v92 and the other is a '70 Freightliner with a 6-71. I would prefer the 8v92 or an 8v71 if I were buying right now.

Parts are still to be had, Delaney and Alph in Bakersfield Ca. still is Mr Detroit, they can still get parts, they were the people behind Tryone Malone's race trucks for quite some time.
And we have several people on the ATHS board and one of the tired reps is on with us also, he loves them driptroits.