The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area The HiPo Shop New school engine & tranny for 1964-66 k20?????

I was wondering what size motors i could put into a 64-66 era K20. i was also just wondering if there are any six speed trannies that can be put into a 64-66 era k20? i am fairly positive there is a five speed i can put in. just curious if there is a six speed manual. thanks for any info
Jonathan

Any Chevrolet engine will work fine, 6 cylnder, Small Block, Big Block, they'll all work, provided that you have the right bellhousing and engine mounts. For the transmission, you'll be looking at late model stuff for a 5 or 6 speed. You'll want to check out Advanced Adapters for a bellhousing with the correct bolt pattern. The NV4500 5 speed is a good choice, there was also a 6 speed used on the late GMT800 ('01-'07) trucks that should work, depending on what T-case you end up using as the weather they can be adapted. Again, check out Advanced.

alrighty. thank you bill. so i can put any chevy motor. well that is good news. LOL. now i just have to choose after i find a good k20 to start with. :-) i am swapping axles out for an open knuckle set. so getting a newer transfer case probably wouldnt be a big deal. wish i had a k20 already so i could ask all my questions. so a bellhousing adapter for a newer tranny that is five or six speed. nice to know there is room enough in the truck for that. thanks again bill. made my day.

Jonathan

[quote=LONGBOX55]Any Chevrolet engine will work fine, 6 cylnder, Small Block, Big Block, they'll all work, provided that you have the right bellhousing and engine mounts. For the transmission, you'll be looking at late model stuff for a 5 or 6 speed. You'll want to check out Advanced Adapters for a bellhousing with the correct bolt pattern. The NV4500 5 speed is a good choice, there was also a 6 speed used on the late GMT800 ('01-'07) trucks that should work, depending on what T-case you end up using as the weather they can be adapted. Again, check out Advanced. [/quote

you don't have to adapt anything to the t/c to install a newer trans; you may have shorten that intermediate shaft a little. you could put in a newer married trans and t/c

I have a sbc with a t5 and an independent 205t/c in mine. the intermediate is 10" betwen the crosses. as long if it is in alignment there should be no problem.
the ultimate answer is what you are going to do to the truck after it is together
You can always get tremec or richmond 6 speed which will withstand whatever that you want to put in frt of it for power.
I just took a detroit diesel out of mine with NP 5spd o/d in it and went back to a 283. that detroit did it's share of work in the 18 years that I used it
ron

I mentioned an adapter for a T-case in the event that an integrated 'case was to be used instead of the factory style divorced. A T5, Richmond, or Tremec would be way too light for off road use, gearing isn't low enough. The NV4500, NV560, or ZF S6-650 would be a much better choice. Other considerations would be to check into Clark or Fuller 5/6 speeds used in 1 1/2 and 2 tons. I have seen those (with and without and overdrive) in the standard GM bellhousing pattern in addition to the SEA #2 pattern.

I think on the pre-88 model trucks the front axle comes from the passenger side of the truck where 88 and up is on the left (drivers side). So upgrading components may require the whole drivetrain,
Scott

That is correct. But if the axles are beign swapped for open knuckle units, that can be easily taken care of, either by using aftermarket axles (like from Dynatrac) or dare I say it? ) using an axle from a ford F250HD. Other options would be to use the newer trans with an older RH output 'case using an adapter from Advance. This is, of course, asuming that a later 'case is used. If an original 'case is used, or a later divorced style (fords and Mil-Spec Dodges used them into the '70s) than it will be a non-issue.

"the ultimate answer is what you are going to do to the truck after it is together"
there are different ratio's available in the lighter trans. mine has the 3.7 first. I doubt if I'll get into a position that I will need any more. with my previous setup I doubt if I eever used that 7:1 1st gear. one of the times was when I had to start the truck to start up a hill when i got stuck at a red light. the clutch linkage was broken so I had to start off the starter. the other times when I needed it to lift from a start as I was grossing out over 16,000lbs with a trailer on and I only had 122 hp
ron

ihc also used a r/s drop divorced 205 in their l/duty trucks in the early 70's and they didn't have the odd ball yokes that the dodge's had
ron

heim30 has mentioned in other posts the he plans to do some off roading, so a deper first gear will come in handy.
I've never seen a civvy '70s Dodge with a divorced 205, but I've sen plenty of fords with them. The fords were LH output, though. BTW, the divorced Mil-spec Dodge used a full time 203 'case.
Now if you want a brutally strong 'case, the Atlas2 from Advanced is hard to beat. 4:1 low range. It can be used with just about any trans, but works best with a truck trans. Another choice, if you can find one, would be the Coleman 22/42. Both are divorced style gear drive 'cases, with the 42 having a full time operation option, similar to the Autotrac used on late GMs, xept that has 2 levers instead of a pushbutton/dial.

The quickest , most economical way to get what you want is to find a early '90's K2500 or K3500. The 93-94 NV4500 had the lower first gear. You'll get all the components you need:350 engine,5spd trans w/crossmember,transfercase,axles,bellhousing w/hyd clutch, plus much more. You can swap out to a carb/intake & non-computer HEI distributor. I see whole trucks all the time for less than $2k. Try finding half these items separately for that.
I forgot, some of the one tons had 454's & single rear wheel.

Talking "new school" engine and trans, you need to look into the LS engine family, 4.8L to 6.2L in trucks, plus others in Camaro/Corvette... Choice of cast iron or aluminium block or heads...
A 6-speed manual was available in Camaros/Firebirds, I do not know about trucks manual...
Keep the EFI/ drive-by-wire... and you will have the "newest new school" engine! And dead reliable too!
Check LS1Tech forum for lots of infos.

The '90s K trucks were ifs, so the axles would not be compatible. What you would need would be a V series 4x4 ('81-'87 body), but they did not come with the 5 speed, those were used on the GMT400 and up chassis only.

ok wow that is alot of opinions. thanks everyone. what i would like to do is take the entire drivetrain from an '01-'07 Chevy 2500hd. if the axles arent the correct width to do that than i would be more than willing to use the ford axles. i know that i will have to have custom driveshafts made for the front and back because of the wheel base difference in the newer models and older models. i was planning on just finding a salvage one and taking the ZF ZF6-S650 and the transfer case and axles that it came with and putting them in the K20. that ZF6 looks so big i think i would hav to do some sheet metal modification to the tranny tunnel but that wouldnt be too difficult. i am after all going for a very unique truck build. also to clarify what i will do with this truck i will explain shortly. this is my everyday driver dream truck. i work on my family farm and haul 16-20 foot cattle trailers at least once a month. i also like to drive on 4x4 trails when i am on vacation in colorado but i dont need a rock crawler and i wont take this truck on anything that a normal 4x4 setup couldnt handle. i dont think i will need an atlas t/c or custom axles or lockers or anything. just a unique drivetrain behind a 283 or 350 small block with newer heads, four barrel carb and a powerful cam upgrade. no superchargers or anything like that. just a normal 4x4 with a little extra attitude. once again thank you everyone for your incredible amount of knowledge. i cant wait to actually start turning wrenches on this truck and post pics through the process.
Jonathan

What is the total weight of those cattle trailers when you are pulling them? I cringed when I saw that in the same post as a 283.

A 3/4-ton four-wheel-drive is not light to begin with. A loaded trailer behind it means you need real good brakes unless you're just pulling it around the yard. And you need some real power if you want to achieve highway speeds with that load.

i have also been contemplating that. do you know how much HP a stock 283 has? always been curious about that. i was leaning more towards the 350cid setup out of the may edition of hot rod magazine. it is a 2600 dollar system that pushes 380HP. i usually only have to pull trailers and implements a few miles. five at most. i love the 283 motor but i think you are right. i think i need to push more HP for this truck. oh and the we never put more then 6000 pounds of cattle in the trailer but that was just to be easy on the c20.
Jonathan

It all depends what you are happy with. the 283 will do that job. A lot of people are always in a hurry to go nowhere. one just has to relax and make the journey and enjoy the view
ron

Can anyone answer whether the axle width on a 2001-2007 chevy2500hd or f-250 with the ZF 6speed are the same width as the stock axles on a 65 K20? i have scoured the net and cant find any documents that list the standard axle widths for vehicles.
Jonathan

The axle from the '01-'07 Silverado will not work, as those trucks are IFS. The F250 axle might be a bit wider, but should be prety close. You would want to use one from leaf spring 250, the Twin Traction Beam axle (coil spring) won't work and is not as strong.
Also, just my $.02, if you're planning to do any towing, you might consider a Deisel. Far more efficient for towing. You'll want an engine that makes good low end torque, not high hosepower, as it's torque that gets you going. Deisels have that in abundance. Another option would be a 383 stroker if you want to go gas engine. But stay mild on the cam, no need for a wild cam in a towing engine.

A 283 has a 3.875 bore and a 3 inch stroke if my memory is accurate tonight. A 327 has a 4 inch bore and 3.25 inch stroke. A 350 has a 4 inch bore and a 3.48 inch stroke.

All things being equal the longer the stoke the more torque you make. You can make a 283 do many things a larger motor will do, but the 283 is going to be higher stressed and turning faster if you're working it hard pulling a loaded trailer.

I would estimate an enclosed cattle trailer is going to weigh 3,000 or more pounds, so you're talking a 9,000 pound load. Yes you can do it with a 283, but you'll be going slow and wishing you had a granny gear.

I love 283's also. I currently own at least three of them. I won't put one in something I plan to use for towing.

yes but he is only going 5 mi max and he doesn't do it that often. depends on what gearing that he will end up with. it is not what you got, but how you use it
ron

Ok thanks very much for the info once again. honestly i have been looking and doing research on alot of crate motors and i foundone that i am leaning heavily towards putting into the K20. it is a 383 stroker with 380HP and 418ft/lbs of torque. it is also an excellent price. as for the axles i did not know that the newer chevys were IFS. i know i need a solid axle 4x4 to take the parts from and i have been doing alot of research and find that most newer ones are coil suspension. i dontknow if it is of any consequence to whether i can use it or change it or what not. i am trying to learn about axles cause i know i ask you guys alot of questions about them. i have told by many folks on here that my best option for the front axle would be a dana super 60. good all around axle. are the rear axles something different or are they dana 60's as well? that is still a little hazy to me. i was thinking of taking the T/C and axles from a shift on the fly 4x4 but since they are vacuum powered i dont know if that is very doable or not. just a neat thought worth exploring. i dont mind manually locking my hubs. so the ford axles will be close enough to work for axle swaps. that is great to know. what ford axles are they? what models do they come from?
sorry for so many questions. trying to learn and get this truck planned out most of the way before i get home from this deployment. thanks guys
Jonathan