The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area Engine Shop 4sp saginaw

I decided to go with the saginaw 4 sp instead of the t-5. now that i have it i measured and every thing lines up except the bottom left bolt is set out farther than on the stock transmission. What can i do to make this work without changing the bellhousing. Thanks,
Mike

Buck,
I am wondering why you went with the Saginaw vs. the T-5? What motor are you mounting it to? I have a GMC 302 and am very undecided on what 4-spd to go with. Any help would be appreciated? Also, what is the price range on the saginaw??

I paid $150 for the saginaw. I went with the saginaw because i didt want to change anything with the clutch. The saginaw has the same shaft as the stock transmission. 10 splines. i dont knwo what my motor is its either a 228 or 248.
mike

The disc is the only thing you have to change with the clutch (60 bucks new) everthing else you use stock parts. Which bolt does not line up on your bellhousing?? Cause you are pretty much stuck with it if it dont line up.Do you know what the trans came out of?? I have seen a couple of vega trans that have a weird pattern.

Phat,
What should I look for on a used trans? How do I know it's a saginaw? Are they all geared the same?

You are talking car 4 spd right, not the heavy truck tranny?The Saginaw will bolt up to any 48 or newer truck or 55 newer car housing.Some Vegas used Saginaws some used a smaller tranny.The Saginaws have rings on the imput shaft to ID ratios. No rings, 2.85 first gear,1 ring,2.56, 2 rings,3.11 and 3 rings is the usual Vega model with a 3.50 first gear.The 2nd and 3 rd gears are spaced differently also to follow the first gear.The Saginaw is all cast iron, all three shifter shafts are on the side cover, the shift levers bolt on,the side cover is sorta square with 8 bolt I think.The trans is 21 inches long overall and has a 10 spline input and a fine spline output

[ 01-01-2002: Message edited by: Tony ]

Formula1 If you are runnin a 302 i would go with a borg warner or a muncie.The saginaw was not a very good box and spit the cluster shaft out the bottom a lot on higher torque stuff.(i think its weaker than the t-5 plus the shifter is back farther) Dont allways go by the rings,if it was ever rebuilt and got a new cluster and input(they broke a lot of them in the chevelle's camaro's)the new ones did not have rings on the input. Pull the cover and check the teeth on the input.

Every bolt lines up except for the bottom left on if you are looking at it from the front of the transmission . Every other one lines up except for that single one . is ther anything that i can do with this or should i get a different bellhousing.

Oh yea the transmission came out of a 68 camaro.

Buck-O-nine,

Sell the 4-speed to some one who's restoring a '68 Camaro, for a reasonable profit, and either go with the T-5 or a four speed that matches your bell housing pattern.

There are no bell-housing swaps for the stovebolt six, except perhaps to the pre-'47 bell housing, which is not helpful.
You'd have to change to a later engine (post '62) to have bell housing "swappability".

There is a Dodge truck 4-speed from the '70's that has OD as 4th gear, and is supposedly a direct bolt-in; it's usually found in 2wd trucks w/ slant-sixes.

Good luck.

Buck you got to look close at that again.If its out of a camaro it supposed to be the same pattern .something aint right. Check it again.How far is it off???

Buck-o-nine,

I looked through the posts and I did not see what year truck you have.

Rick

Tony and Phat,
THanks again for your input, I really appreciate it. But, now you have me confused. I know everyone has their opinion, but what is my option here? I want a trouble free installation without having to re-invent the wheel.

my truck is a 1948 GMC Pickup. I really dont want to sell this id rater make it work am i not measuring something right? or what.

Buck, all the Saginaws and Muncies T-5's etc have the same bolt pattern.your 48 ,first year of the AD model may still have the older style small bolt pattern.You may have to change the bellhousing.I owned a true 49 GMC that had the newer style bolt pattern. Formula, some guys say a 302 is too much for a T-5 Some guys say its too much for a Saginaw.I have personally known 2 or 3 guys that used Saginaws with no problem and one guy with a 302 T-5 combo that towed a trailer with no problems. And I tore the cluster gear out of a T-5 behind a feeble 2.8 v-6 S10 .Try the tranny of your choice and let us know if it lasts.Then we will have a first hand account.There's a certain guy with a 341 inch roller cam GMC 6 cylinder that Phat is not too fond of.He runs a Camaro T-5 in that car with no problem. So either the trans is strong enough or his engine is all show. If you get the same answer out of two truck nuts, one is lying.

Here's a few photos of some of the transmissions dicussed above. The first photo is a Saginaw 4spd. You can see the ratio ID rings on the imput shaft.Although I have never seen one without ID rings, Phat's comment about the lack of the rings may apply to replacement parts.The second photo is the A833 4 spd OD trans.Note that this one has a oddball bolt pattern that requires the special housing to bolt up to Chevy V8 or 230-292 6's.The third photo is a genuine 49 Chevy truck bellhousing on the top and the factory housing on the bottom, that is for the 4 spd OD trans in the previous photo.Buck, check out the bolt holes on the Saginaw and the 49 housing.Muncies car 4spd use the same bolt pattern.All the trannys in the photos are 21 inches long overall.
[img]http://pstr-m02.ygpweb.aol.com/data/00F/5F/EE/4D/8C/UTA0KXu8iAP3lQICBboQyGYf3yDfLwQp0180.jpg[/img]
[img]http://pstr-m05.ygpweb.aol.com/data/006/00/78/85/F4/4178fwtEtiQyig0ZBaLzeuw5v-hxMbbh0180.jpg[/img]
[img]http://pstr-m01.ygpweb.aol.com/data/005/67/1E/D3/16/Clit0Kx1ISfK-fcraR9cymLYeaNR4gBw0180.jpg[/img]

Buck,

What tranny was originally in your '48 GMC?

Was it by chance a floor-shift 3-speed?

Column shift 3-speed?

The earlier tranny pattern on the truck (and car through'54) had the top two holes fairly close together(?).
The aluminum bell housing in the bottom photo appears to be cast in such a way that it can be drilled to accept any of the post-54 trannys.
If the bolt pattern on your bell is different from the one on the green bell housing in the picture, than I'd say you have the early pattern housing on your engine, which is very limiting: you'd need to change to the '49 to '53 bell housing to mate the later trannys.

It is a 4sp. tranny. The 49 bellhousing looks like the same bolt pattern as my saginaw but my bellhousing isnt that far off.