The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area Engine Shop 235 won’t start

I’m humbly asking this group for their help and directions in getting my 235 engine started. Here’s what I’ve done this far on my 55 Chevy first series: cleaned and resealed the oil pan (with fresh oil), replaced the original generator with a new one wire alternator, had the starter rebuilt, had the carb rebuilt, installed a new mechanical fuel pump (that is working as evidenced by the fuel in the clear fuel filter), installed a new 12 volt battery, installed a new 12v coil with internal resistance of 3 ohms, and installed a new ground strap (I also made sure I had a good clean connection on the negative cable from the battery to the bell housing). I also replaced the points and condenser but I did not upgrade the condenser to a 12v condenser. Would not changing the condenser be enough to prevent the engine from firing? I am NOT a savvy mechanic by any stretch of the imagination but am trying to learn and get this old engine to revive after being idle for several decades. I am soliciting your ideas on what may be preventing the engine from starting and what I can specifically check/do to get the motor to bust off. Thanks in advance for your help.

Modern condensers are total pieces of junk that sometimes don't work straight out of the box. A member of this board has 200,000 hr condensers that he makes and sells to others for $12.00.

https://www.stovebolt.com/ubbthread...west-condenser-update-8-2024#Post1555045

I would expect your engine to at least attempt to fire, though.

What exactly is your engine doing? Is it turning over but not firing? Have you verified that the dizzy is getting electricity? How about the plugs? You can use a plug tester which is a little inline light that flashes when sparked or a screwdriver in the boot held over a good ground.

Can you describe what happens when you try to start it?

I am not an expert on those engines, but I would start by double checking the timing and firing order.

The engine is turning over but not firing. How do I verify that the distributor is getting electricity?

A condenser is really only there to protect the points as they open. It contains the power that would normally cause arcing across the points as they open. That would burn the points.

If you have a voltmeter, check for voltage on each terminal of the coil. On the one with the wire that does NOT go to the distributor, you should have 12V when the ignition switch is on. If not, check b ack along that wire at each connection point to the ignition switch. If you have 12V into the coil, at the distributor, take the cap off and with the points open, check for voltage at the terminal connected to the wire from the coil.

Pull the center wire off and see if it will spark to a clean metal ground on the truck. Hold the boot with the metal connector about 1/8 -1/16' away from a ground while somebody turns the ignition on and steps on the starter. You should see a spark.

By the way, you are turning the key to ON and then stepping on the starter button, right?

Many times I've forgotten to turn the key.

Also make sure you put the rotor back in the dizzy.

Thank you. Is there a certain voltage level I should be looking for when testing the terminal that is connected to the wire from the coil?

Thank you. I’ll try that tomorrow and I have had the key in the on position when attempting to crank.

Remove the cap from the distributor. Bump the starter or turn by hand to get the points lifting block on a flat of the distributor lobe. Turn the ignition to the on position, and with a small screwdriver, open the points at the lift block to see if a spark is evident. If there is no spark then it's time to check power to the coil. No power to coil then time to check wiring. This is how I would proceed.

Did the engine run before you started "fixing" it? there are several things all gasoline engines need to run, and all of them are equally important.

Fuel
Air
Compression
Spark
correct timing- - - -both valve and spark timing.

DO NOT SKIP CONFIRMING ANY STEPS IN THE DIAGNOSIS- - - -"It sounds good" or "It looks good" is not a positive test.

Item #1- - - -make sure the distributor turns, and the valve rocker arms move. Yes, you'll need to remove the valve cover- - - -no shortcuts! You're going to need to watch the valve action soon. A compression tester is handy to have, but it's not an absolute necessity. Have a helper spin the engine over while you watch the valves. Ditto for the distributor- - - -remove the cap and watch for the rotor to turn (clockwise) as you look down on it. Make sure the points are opening and closing fully. Don't do any ignition electrical guesswork yet- - - -that will come later. If the valves and/or the distributor don't move, you've got mechanical problems- - - -a stripped timing gear or a broken camshaft. Pull a spark plug and place your thumb over the open hole- - - - -have a helper spin the engine. The compression pressure should forcefully escape around your thumb. Low or no compression will be caused by sticky or burned valves, or really bad piston rings. Check all the cylinders the same way, or do a compression test. Compression pressure of at least 60 PSI or more is enough to make an engine run. Compression should be close to equal on all cylinders, but I've seen engines run (badly) on only 3 or 4 cylinders with good compression

Now- - - -watch the two valves at the very back of the cylinder head- - - -#6 cylinder. The rearmost valve is exhaust- - - -tap the starter repeatedly until that valve spring compresses fully. keep tapping the starter until that spring relaxes and the next one in line (intake) starts to compress. Look at the distributor rotor and its relationship to the spark plug wires- - - -the tip of the rotor should be pointing to the #1 cylinder plug wire. Arrange the rest of the wires clockwise to 5-3-6-2-4. If the firing order is incorrect, fix it.

Back to the distributor and point electrical circuit- - - -Tap the starter until the rubbing block on that new point set is on one of the high spots of the distributor cam- - - -you've got six choices- - - -which one doesn't matter. Adjust the point gap to approximately .015"- - -a business card folded in half will be about right for an initial setting. With the points open and the ignition switch turned on, the small electrical terminal on the side of the distributor should read battery voltage when measured with a voltmeter, or an ice pick style test light should illuminate if you don't have a voltmeter handy. With the points closed, the voltage should go to zero, and/or the test light will go out.

Follow these steps- - - - -EXACTLY- - - - -and get back to us if the engine doesn't start.
Jerry

Thank you for the recommendations and I’ll go through these steps. To answer your first question regarding whether the engine ran before I started working on it, the truck looked to be original and completely unrestored when I purchased it. I don’t know anything about when it ran last but from looking at the semisolid state of the oil in the oil pan when I pulled it off I’d say it’s safe to say that the engine hasn’t run in around 30+ years. Before I started doing anything I sprayed some penetrating oil in the cylinders and let it set for a week. Everything turned over smoothly by hand and there appeared to be no issues with any of the valves/lifters when I previously turned the engine over by hand. I’ll be in touch and let you know what I find out. Thanks again.

Condition of the carb? Are you getting fuel to the carb?

One precaution I didn't think to mention- - - - -DO NOT try to use the original fuel tank when trying to wake up a Rip Van Winkle truck. Even if you drain the tank, there will be enough varnish and crud left over to make the valves seize up in their guides after a couple of short runs. It's a very common problem that a lot of stovebolters have encountered. Run a clean temporary fuel tank like one for an outboard motor, and steam clean or replace the tank before trying to put the truck on the road.
Jerry

That is one that I did do correctly - before I ever tried to start the truck I set up a small clean external tank with ethanol free gas. Thanks.

It was likely parked years ago for a reason. All you need to do is systematically go through each system which provides what it needs to run.

1)Spark to the plugs at the right time.
2)Fuel to the carburetor.
3)Compression.

I always test in the order above. Simple tests first.
I always save the carburetor for last unless its pouring gas all over the place or there is no squirt of fuel from the accelerator pump when you goose the throttle.
I save the rebuilding the carburetor for last because if you take your perfectly fine carburetor apart and put it back together wrong, then you will have the dreaded "two problems at the same time" scenario.