The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area Engine Shop 216 Rebuild

I have pulled the pan on my 41 AK w/216 and the engine needs to be rebuilt . Any "sage" advice or suggestions ?

Find someone who knows how to aim the spray nozzles in the oil pan when the engine is reassembled. That's critical to the connecting rods staying put because the troughs in the oil pan only lube the rods at idle. Aluminum pistons for a 235 will work with a .060" overbore, and you'll get better acceleration and less rod bearing wear than with the original cast iron pistons. It's also possible to machine the rods out for removable bearings instead of running the Babbit-lined rods. Those bearings are getting scarce, but a rod bearing for a 3 cylinder Perkins Diesel engine will work if you regrind the crankshaft to the right diameter. Good luck!
Jerry

ronsway That is a tough build even for seasoned mechanics because it is so hard to find the parts ,bore and crank work is crtical to a lasting build plus if you haven't had hands-on experience with old fashioned ways you just have to go to bolters. It's hard to explain it to you. I haven't had to deal with a shimmed rod since 1982,has run and done hard work all that time (wood hauler) still just fine. Have 2 a 216 and 235 48 2-ton. Now once it's fixed you'll swell with pride !!

New update on my 216: We pulled the engine and the oil pickup tube is cracked, one of the soft plugs is corroded out and the block is full of debris to the head, crank is scored and machine shop said that they didn't think the block is useable. I am going to take it to them on Tues to verify condition.
Also the transmission is junk and the rear end needs to be completely rebuilt.
A friend says he has a 235 w/bell housing and clutch (it needs to be rebuilt) available.
What is involved to convert to the 235? Is there a reference for the conversion?
What about transmission, drive line and rear end conversions?

I speak "machinist"- - - - -they're going to tell you it's "junk" which translates to "Even if it was in brand new condition, we don't know how to work on it!"

Depending on the year, the 235 might be a drop-in swap, or there might be some issues with the position of the water pump and fan. The simplest 235 swap will be a 1954 or early 55 engine. In mid-year 55, they dropped the fan and water pump down on the block about 3 inches for hood clearance, which puts the fan too low on the earlier trucks. There is a conversion plate available to reposition the pump to the higher position when installing a late model engine in an early chassis.
Jerry

ronsway,

Just a note that you should start a new post in the Driveline forum to discuss your question "What about transmission, drive line and rear end conversions?".

You can refer folks back to this conversation so they know you are considering a 235 swap to go along with upgrading/converting the rest of the driveline to match.

Doing that will help folks provide better on-topic answers and suggestions to help you manage your way through this.

Dan

Replacing a 216 with a 235, is almost a bolt in replacement. No need to replace any of the drivetrain as the 235 uses the same bell housing. You can even use the same flywheel and clutch as long as you use the 6V starter. No issues using the 6V starter on a 12V system as I’ve been doing it for 4 years.

If you get a later model 235 (late 55 thru 62) as Jerry pointed out, the fan will be too low to effectively cool the engine. A fellow bolter “Pre 68 Dave”, invented and sells an adapter plate to relocate the original 216 water to its original position . I bought and installed this plate on my ‘59 235. The installation was fairly easy and it works perfectly.

If your interested, you can PM “Pre 68 Dave” thru Stovebolt.

I emailed Pre68Dave and he is not listed as a user. Do I have the name wrong if not is there an alternative source or way to contact him?

Thanks I just emailed him.

ronsway,

Dave's actual screen name is: Pre '68 Dave. Try a PM for him as Phak1 suggested.

I started to prep my new (to me ) 235, the number next to distributor is F1016PF. I was under the impression that this was going to be a pretty straight forward swap for the 216. I even ordered the water pump plate. But, now the bell housing is not nearly the same as the 216 so I am not sure how to or what use for a transmission , drive line & rear end. If I change transmissions what about the brake and clutch pedals? Let's not forget motor mounts.

I have any experience with this generation of Chev's. I have a friend who is more experienced and he says it can be done with a lot of modifications. I looked at 1955 235 and it looked like the same bell housing.

What are my options?

You can bolt your 216 bellhousing to your 235. The bolt pattern is the same. That will allow you to use all of the original drive train.

Here is what my bell housing looks like and it bolts right up to a ‘59 235.

I swapped a 216 for a 235 in my 1950 1 ton
I kept all the original accessories and even the manifolds
I swapped the harmonic balancer
Kept my old generator and water pump
Moved the distributor over
It all worked out just fine
216 block 3835327
235 block 5843350
You wouldn’t know the engine swapped
It looks like a 216 with the tiny bolts ontop of the valve cover
-s

The bell housing on the 235 looks same as "small" block V8. I just did a quick visual and the 2 top mounting holes on 235 bell housing are 2" further apart than the 216.
It is my understanding this motor was in passenger car would that make a difference? Based on the number on the block it appears to be a 1961 block.

I have seen the pictures and I wish mine looked like that....

If you've got a SBC V8 bellhousing bolt pattern, it's not a 235. The 194, 230, 250, and 292 sixes have the same bolt pattern as a V8. Does the cylinder head have shaft mounted rocker arms, or are there individual studs that mount the rockers?
Jerry

Can engine be identified by stamped number next distributor? That number is F1016PF.

Ron,

I did some searching on the web to try and identify your engine based on the provided "F1016PF" info.

Can't find any listings for any Chevy I6 engines (216, 235 or the later style 194, 230, 250 and 292) that listed "PF" as an engine identifying "suffix" code.

We need more information to try and determine what this particular engine is. Please provide pictures of:

Overall view of left and right sides of this "235" in question.

Stamped engine serial number.

Engine block "casting number" (should be on the passenger side of block lower down near the oil pan mounting surface between front of engine and starter).

Engine block "casting date" (should be on lower passenger side of block near engine serial number stamping pad).

Once we have these pictures, it will help us help you in knowing exactly what engine you have before further conversation on mating this up (possibly) to your '41 AK.

Looking forward to seeing what you can provide.

Dan

Here are pictures of #'s on passenger side:

ronsway, your picture shows a block with side motor mounts, that would mean it's a much later engine. As HRL (Jerry) said if the bell housing is indeed a SBC bolt pattern than it would most likely be a 194, 230 or 250. the 292 has a taller lifter galley cover. There should be a series of number "Stamped" into a machined area on the block.

That casting number is for a 230 or 250 cubic inch Chevy or Oldsmobile inline six. The difference in the displacement will be determined by the crankshaft stroke- - -both engines have a 3 7/8" bore size.

castingnumbers.info/site/detail/18266/3921968

Jerry

The numbers stamped next to the distributor are: F1016PF

Ron,

Sorry for the delay in getting an answer back to you. I had to go find and dig out my pocket sized resource book. Jerry is correct in the info that the "casting code" # 3921968 could indicate either a 230 or 250 engine from 1967-1979. The key to which engine you have is your stamped engine number.

According to my resource book "Chevy Inline 6 Engines 1929-1989" by Mark S. Allen (Edition Copyright 2008 and last updated April 2008), your stamped engine number/letter sequence decodes as:

F = Flint assembly plant
10 = November
16 = 16th day of November
PF = 1968 C/K-10 or 20 truck - 250CI, 155HP equipped with a 4-speed trans and RPO K19 Heavy Duty Clutch*

*NOTE: the 1968 model year is most likely based on what can be seen in one of your earlier posted pictures as the block casting date codes "CON 2 J _1 7" would indicate it was cast on Conveyor 2 (CON 2) in October (Code Letter J) something (next 2 numbers aren't clear but would indicate day of that month) 1967 (7 standing for the year cast). This would make sense as 1968 model year vehicles were on sale well before the actual start of the actual 1968 calendar year. The "PF" suffix code was also used in 1969, but the likelihood that a block cast in '67 wasn't used until '69 model year is not realistic.

Now that you have identified what you have, you can ask more questions about how you may be able to adapt this engine to your '41 AK.

Suggest you ask questions on adapting or upgrading your '41 AK drive train to use this engine be asked in the Driveline forum.

Hope this is helpful info.

Dan

My suggestion would be to find an actual 235 as you intended and drop it in without any fuss.

A drop-in, bolt-on conversion, utilizing your existing transmission, torque tube and rear end is a much better solution than trying to re-engineer the wheel, especially since you mentioned that this isn't something you do all the time.

You can probably sell or trade the 230/250 to get the 235 you want.

I just had a conversation with Tim Schwanke, who said he could build a complete 235 engine that would bolt right in. Which is what I am looking for. Any thoughts on using a Schwanke engine.

Never heard of him (that doesn't mean squat, though) but if he knows what he's doing, that sounds like an excellent solution.

Tim mentioned using a 54/55 center section to convert to open drive line. I will post my questions in the Driveline forum

As mentioned before, you can use your existing drive train, so there is no need to change unless that was you plan all along.

My problem is that the transmission I have is beyond repair. Can't find a good rebuildable one and all the other options I have found require a open drive line.

I see, now might be a good time to convert to a T5 transmission You can discuss that on the Driveline forum.

I don't know if this applies, but I think the clutch and brake pedal assembly bolts on the bell housing on the pre 47 trucks. I didn't see the place to do that on you r bell housing. I had to get a modified bell housing to bolt on a SM 420 in my 47 Panel truck.

Ronsway If I were you I'd find an insert bearing 235 to work over or 261. Might even find an OK used engine to bolt in, those 2 systems are designed to be easier to work on and repair. That special sick feeling you get when shimmed bearings spin and ruin your expensive and tedious build are not worth it ! Especially if your not experienced in shim bearing work. I'm glad my shim days are over,I'll be able to finish off the 2 I have then go to insert bearing modern system.