The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area Engine Shop 1949 (1950) Chevy 235 oil pump-to-block oil line

I am restoring a 1949 Chevy 4400 ton and a half hydraulic bed (dump truck). I'm almost finished with the engine overhaul. The oil line was split from the block to the rockers and I ruined the line from the pump to the block trying to change it. Long story.

When I took off the brass fitting at the block, engine coolant ran out. Lots of it. So, I am assuming that the pump to block part of the oil line passes through the cylinder block water jacket. Is this true? If it passes through the water jacket, how does one replace it? Or is the block broken and that's why engine coolant came out the hole for the block fitting?

I have failed to find a replacement brass fitting to the block. I ordered an oil line kit from EGGE, but it has the wrong fittings. The original fitting is not fully open on the pipe thread end. It is blocked off with a 3/16" hole in the middle to receive the oil line from the pump and it has a compression fitting seat inside it. Does anyone have one of these or know where I can get one (EGGE doesn't).

Any help would be greatfully appreciated!

Thanks,

Harrell Sellers
Brookings, SD

Yes it runs through the water jacket. You can get replacement lines which include fittings at about any of the vendors. Jim Carter, The Filling Station, Chevs of the 40s, etc. Since I've not had to actually replace mine I'm not aware of the fitting you refer to. Someone should be along shortly that can help you. Good luck.

I called EGGE (866-996-EGGE), The Filling Station (800 841 6622) and Chevys of the 40s (800 999 2438) and none of them have the correct fittings for the oil line as it passes through the water jacket.

Harrell Sellers
Brookings, SD

Harrell,

I haven't done this tube routine in many moons so this might not be 100% accurate.

Your tube kit should have come with the tube and soldered nut at one end and a male adapter and compression fitting that make up the seal on the lower, or oil distributor end. The male adapter screws into the block and the compression nut (sleeve) goes around the copper tube and into the male adapter.

As you tighten it, it compresses and seals the water jacket/tube area. I have included a link to the fittings that I think make up the lower portion of the tube..the ones near the oil distributor valve.

The proper kit should have had the proper fittings. Jim Carter Trucks shows the kit and fittings in their catalog.

Once the tube has been crushed by the compression nut, the copper tube is deformed. I'm not sure you get a second chance on this! This is how I remember it.

http://www.fastfittings.com/page/11442216

Stuart

I guess I'll find out when I drop the oil pan (again) to get at the line from the pump ... I'm wondering how one replaces the oil line that goes through the water jacket. There must be a fitting that seals as the line enters the water jacket from the pump side. Then presumably, the replacement involves getting the old line out and threading in the new line, replacing the sealing fittings, et cetera.

Harrell Sellers
Brookings, SD

Harrell,

I must be on a different page than you are. I thought my previous post explained how to replace the oil line that goes through the water jacket...am I missing something here?

Stuart

hmmm.... perhaps I am missing something here. My last post was concerned with getting the old, lower part of the oil line out from the water hacket. You wrote about fittings and such - I may be missing something in your post. The oil pump is in the oil sump and the oil line has to go through the cylinder block water jacket without causing a water leak. So, there must also be a water-tight fitting on the 'bottom' side of the water jacket that receives the oil line from the pump and conveys it into the water jacket. Then, of course there is the water-tight fitting on the outside of the block where the oil line comes out of the block (water jacket) and up to the rockers.

I was trying to visualize the process of getting the old, ruined oil line from inside the water jacket and putting a new one in. I suppose it will be obvious when I get the oil pan off again and look for what needs to be done. It's probable that one can not reach one's hand inside the water jacket to place the new lower part of the oil line where it is supposed to be, so there might be some 'threading' that has to be done, which may be easier with two people instead of just one.

Harrell Sellers
Brookings, SD

Harrell,

I might still be lost on this! There is no plumbed connection between engine oil pump and the external tubing. The pump supplies pressurized oil into a galley (gallery) which feeds the oil distributor located on the drivers side of the engine.

From the oil distributor valve, a external line goes through the side of the block via a compression fitting and tubing, through the water jacket and exits the passengers side under the side cover.

This copper tube then goes UP through the head and attaches to the center oiler to supply the rocker assembly.

Any R&R of the supply line doesn't require a removal of the pan or any work on the pump itself. It is all done from the outside.

The fitting underneath the side cover that screws into the block is factory soldered to the tube. The tube is inserted from this side and screwed in tight. The other end poking through the lower side of the block is now sealed with an adapter fitting and a double compression fitting. It will become water tight.

The little pigtail of copper tubing is now bent around and attached to the oil distributor with more compression (different) fittings.

The tube merely runs through the water jacket to reach the other side. Chevrolet says the water temp stabilizes the oil but I think that is Voo Doo.

Whenever this tube is disturbed, it is twisted off and ruined and must be replaced.

I don't know if I have this exactly right but I think so. Is this how you understand it?

Stuart

Thank you, Stuart. I'm still trying to visualize this. Your previous post is helping, but I don't have a good picture in my mind yet. I'm re-reading your post a few more times.

I ruined the tube that is inside the water jacket. Replacing it is what I am obsessing on. The part under the side panel that runs up to the rockers is easy.

You wrote: "The fitting underneath the side cover that screws into the block is factory soldered to the tube. The tube is inserted from this side and screwed in tight. The other end poking through the lower side of the block is now sealed with an adapter fitting and a double compression fitting. It will become water tight."

To do what you wrote, which seems to me to be what I need to do to replace the "inside the water jacket" part of the oil line, wouldn't you have to drop the oil pan to get to the fitting on the lower side of the block?

The part that can be replaced without taking off the oil pan is just the part running from the side of the cylinder block to the rockers, isn't it?

To replace the 'pigtail' that is inside the water jacket needs the oil pan off, correct?

Thanks, Stuart

Harrell Sellers
Brookings, SD

Harrell,

I might have lead you down the wrong path on this, hence the confusion. This was a break over year for how oil was supplied to the rocker assembly. I won't blabber anymore, it would be easier to look at the links I provided and see if they make sense.

The top link is what I thought you had. Evidently it's possible to have the system described in the second link depending on the true engine size and year. Keep us posted.

http://chevy.oldcarmanualproject.com/shop/1938/38csm149.html


http://chevy.oldcarmanualproject.com/shop/1948_51truck/51ctsm0638.htm

Stuart

The new oil crossover line is one continuous piece of 3/16”copper tubing. It starts on the lower left in the picture at a standard compression fitting in the block using a standard compression nut and sleeve, it is bent around to thread thru the special compression nut and fitting in the upper right part of the picture and threaded through the water jacket. This seals water jacket and the feed thru on the drivers side.
http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2215889110098611668RGuHts
It comes out in the tappet/pushrod cover on the passenger side and is sealed with the same special compression nut and fitting that is used on the other side. It is then bent to clear the push rods and threaded thru the head and into the rocker arm shaft oil connector where another standard compression nut and sleeve terminate it.
The kits that the Advance Design vendors sell should have all of the tubing and fittings and instructions that you need to replace this crossover tube. Your local flaps or hardware store will not be of any help on this. As was the original crossover, this is a one shot deal and if for some reason you need to take things loose from the water jacket penetration then you will need to replace the entire tube again.
Denny Graham
Sandwich, IL

Thank you very much, Stuart, that helps me very much. Jim Carter Classic Truck Parts believes they have the correct oil line whereas EGGE, Chevys of the 40s, and The Filling Station do not (due to their supplier building them incorrectly, so they say). I have one on order and the links you posted will be of great help. I believe what I have is the second one. The engine block number begins with HAA which, according to one website is a 1950 engine. The truck is a 1949 Chevy 4400. The enigne is a 235 and of this I am certain. I don't know that it is the original engine, but I am the second owner and the first owner says it is. If some of the 1950 engine blocks were cast in late 1949, then it could be the original engine or the website that identifies the HAA prefix as 1950 could be wrong.

Harrell Sellers
Brookings, SD

OK, I believe I understand it now. The piece that runs through the water jacket actually traverses the whole block from side to side. I believe threading the new one into the block, from the push rod side to the driver's side, is better done with two people. One person doing the threading on the passenger's side and another watching from the driver's side to tell the threading person when the far end (driver's side end) of the line is close to the exit hole on the driver's side. Then the driver's side end is connected to the oil distributor. The oil pan does not need to come down for this operation.

Is this what you understand as well, Stuart?

Thanks,

Harrell Sellers
Brookings, SD

Harrell,

If you buy a kit you will hopefully get detailed install directions because you only get one chance to do it per kit! The tube is plenty long enough to thread through the water jacket before screwing the soldered fitting into the block on the pushrod side.

Be sure to use thread sealant on all fittings into the block and even on the special compression nut on the oil distributor side. It's a mechanical seal but the goop helps it crimp down on the tube.

Assemble all the fittings into the drivers side block before you bend or kink the tube or they might not slide on.

Threading the tube through the water jacket can fill it with debris...be sure to blow it out before final assembly.

Once the compression nut is cinched down, it's a done deal, it can't be removed from the tube. Good luck and keep us posted.

Stuart

Thank you, Denny. That helps a lot. I appreciate it!

Harrell Sellers
Brookings, SD

How do you run a line from the pressure gauge to the rockers , how and where do you tap into it to supply oil to the rockers on a 1950 chev 3100 with 235 engine .. thanks

Absolutely DO NOT try to oil the rockers with a bypass line from the oil pressure port. You will flood the rocker shaft with far too much oil, and starve the connecting rods. The purpose of the triangular sheet metal oil distributor on the driver's side of the block is to meter the oil flow to the rockers and protect the lower end of the engine. If pressure at the connecting rods drops below 15 PSI, the oil distributor restricts the flow to the cylinder head to protect the rods from oil starvation.
Jerry

I want to illustrate how little oil is needed for the rockers.

On my old trucks (1927 and 1928), the oil pump does not deliver ANY oil to the rockers. That changed in 1929 with the introduction of the inline six.

When I go out for a drive, I put a drop or two of oil on top of each rocker arm (over the rocker shaft) and give a squirt of oil to the felt pad that lays on top of the rockers.

This is all the oil that the rockers need for a 50 mile drive. If I'm going farther than that, the little guys get another squirt of oil. ;-)

So, they need oil, but very little.

Cheers, Dean

One sneaky trick that makes installing a new oil line through the water jacket simpler is to use a piece of acetylene welding rod as a guide. A piece of 1/16" or 3/32" uncoated steel rod is the right size to put through the block from side to side, and once the copper line is straightened it will slip over the welding rod. That's a lot less hassle than trying to fish a piece of soft copper from side to side.
Jerry