The Stovebolt Site Forums The Parking Lot Big Bolts Building a new VIN decoder

Web development is my profession, and after going to the VIN decoder link for the 10th or so time to have it tell me that a '41 1.5 ton built in WI is actually a 3/4 ton built in Canada of unknown year, I thought.. dude.. maybe I should build a VIN decoder!

You think there's any need? As often as I come across these trucks, it would be handy to write one to run on my PDA so I can check VIN numbers "in the field".. so i'm thinking a JAVA or Flash based application that isn't platform dependent (i.e. would run in a web browser, as a stand along application, and be compatible with PC, MAC and many portable PDAs)

Of course, if I built one, i'd give it to The Stovebolt Page (if the admin staff wanted it, that is)

Thoughts? Suggestions? Feature requests?

go for it - be a great addition to the site!! make it cover the widest range of years you can - at least the range the 'bolt accepts, and java would be better than flash for my money

Bill

Fumblin,

We'll be waiting here with open disc space

If you can get that done, we can somehow swaggle all the different tech tips we have that relate to the "what have I got" question.

It seems like that section is growing enough to need a better road map.

Somewhat like the gallery. Some of the breakdown years are really long pages. John is pondering that one still.

Opps. Didn't mean to digress. Good luck writing it. I'm sure Bill will let you bounce things off of him. He's pretty familiar with how we've been trying to organize this virtual garage.

Thanks ... much!

Peg

The Series/Model list that John put together for the Tech Tips page is very helpful, but I guess it would be neat to "automate" it.

There are lots of requests on the forum for engine identification, too. While there is much info on casting numbers on the web, I haven't found much good stuff concerning early 6 cylinder engine serial number prefixes (or suffixes). John did a brief list of those, too, but it's kind of limited as to exact ID (what the engine was originally installed in). Sorry, John . A decoder for those would really be nice.

I'm working with the data provided at the Stovebolt TechTips section.

What I got so far is you type in your VIN/Cowl tag number, and it tells you year, wheelbase, type, plant of mfg.. at the moment it works from 1929 to 1946.

[img]http://www.geekoasis.com/images/vincalc.gif[/img]

It will also work with partial numbers, like the example screenshot above.

I've thought about building a decoder too. Where I'm currently stuck is gathering details from other countries where trucks were made.

I pictured a page that allowed you to enter the complete serial number and then it would either decode the number, or ask questions if the number might be ambiguous.

For instance, "Where is the number found?" is it from a serial number plate, the motor, or the title. Or does the truck look like A, B or C, with one being Art Deco, one Advance Design and the third Task Force.

I was moving along nicely until I saw a South African serial number and then a possibly Swedish serial number. Then I realized I've no idea how many international factories there may have been, or how to find out how those trucks were numbered.

So that project went back on the shelf while I work on others...

Fumblin46!

If this is any help here's a key to Canadian serial number ID's.

It says, starting in 1935, a system was developed for GM vehicles produced in Canada. As an example---

A truck built in 1941 with a number such as:

1144300440 would be 1- first number for the year(2 would be for 1942 and so on)--14-means one ton (13 is half ton)---43 means cab and chassis--00440 means vehicle number.

The first 3/4 ton I see listed is in 1946 so if it's Canadian built it will have a VIN number starting with 6 followed by 14.

Hope this helps.

Cheers, George

I'm going to focus on US made Chevrolet trucks from 1929 to 1964, since thats what I have the data for.

Making an international "VIN cruncher" would be a huge undertaking, unless you were to find some solid data on different countries numbering schemes.. and it would take a person far more "in the know" than I to know what years had the cowl tag where, etc etc.

Where is your sense of adventure?

Maybe we should start a thead asking for information on international serial numbers and get serious about acquiring that information. A US only tool is better than nothing, but this is an international group.

Since Stovebolts are defined here as pre-73 I suggest extending through '72.

Well for starters, it's USA ALL THE WAY.. and only up till 1952.

Capabilities for the "VIN CRUNCHER" to calculate other countries/model years are going to be entierly contingent on having the data.

But mostly, here it is as a test to see if it works so far!

The "VIN CRUNCHER" is presently configured to accept the first batch of numbers in the VIN.. example:

5PWG 12978

You'd just type in the 5PWG part and hit the ENTER key (make sure you type letters in CAPS) and it outta work.

Here's the link for your testing pleasure

http://www.geekoasis.com/vincalc/

Sweeeet! Looks and works very cool. Can hardly wait until you get the rest of the data it.

Fumblin,

Besides the email I just sent to you, I've got more info. (We have updated the series page but missing one column yet.)

So email me ... and I can send the rest. That will give you almost all the data we have.

Peg

Quote "Well for starters, it's USA ALL THE WAY.. and only up till 1952"

Hope this was tongue in cheek as was stated before about this being an international site...

Anyway my 1946 bolt has a Holden body...

cheers
Jason.

(spoken in my best Scotty from Star Trek accent)

"I'm a programmer, not a historian!"

Had it not been for the wonderful and well laid out information regarding VIN decoding here on The Stovebolt Page, i'd have never been able to build the decoder at all!

With that said, i'm happy to include VIN decoding capabilities for model years up to the early 70's, and even decoders for Chevrolet trucks sold outside the U.S. but in order to do that, i'll need simular refrence material to what I used to build the current decoder.

So to all my fellow Stovebolters living down under, in the great white north, and across the pond, please don't feel i'm neglecting you or discounting your controbutions to the Stovebolt community.. it's just that I personally don't know jack squat about decoding VIN numbers for vehicles sold in my own country without the aid of refrence materials, let alone know what two character code "GM Zimbabwe" used to identify a 1954 Schoolbus!

Sometime on 5/25/05 i'll increase the "VIN CRUNCHER"s capabilities to include VIN decoding for later model U.S. trucks, and am anxiously awaiting Peggys updated information.

In the meantime, I am eager to hear from folks with information or links regarding the VIN decoding of "outside the USA" trucks, for either inclusion in the current "VIN Cruncher" or for possible country specific versions of the program.

Will this thing do GMCs, too?

In order to build a accurate VIN decoder, i'd have to know all the possible values, and what they mean.

For example, if 14 means 1 ton, and 13 means half ton, what would 3/4, 1.5 and 2 ton be? Is there a way to differenciate between different wheelbases within the same "tonnage" truck?

Also, if 43 means cab and chassis, what other numbers were used and what did they mean? Where there any additional numbers to help identify the city of origin?

If you have a link to a page or resource that has more detail, that would help greatly.

I seem to recall reading that when you order a Resto pack from GM Canada, they can give you an awful lot of specific information regarding your truck based on the VIN.. i'm not sure how much of that information is concealed in the VIN number, and how much of it is a matter of their own internal record keeping after the sale, tho.. but i'd like to make a Canadian Stovebolt VIN Cruncher thats as accurate and provides as much detail as possible.

At the time of this reply, the VIN Cruncher is only capable of decoding VIN numbers from the "cowl plate" of Chevrolet trucks made in the U.S. between 1929 and 1952.

If there is a simular resource for GMC trucks as the one for Chevrolet trucks found in in the Tech Tips section of this board, please point me to it, and i'll add GMC VIN Crunching capabilities to the program (or create a GMC Specific version) in the very near future.

See if my web site helps with the 55-59 Chevrolet's

http://www.chevytrucks.org/mikesgarage

Mike

Fumblin'
Just to let you know that the decoder is not working with my number (J53S), all I get is "unknown". Is that due to not having all of the data in yet?

Thanks for taking on this project.

I haven't updated the decoder page to reflect the new database changes.. so the reason your J53S is comming up as "unknown" is because the latest it can currently crunch is 1952.

Hopefully by the end of the day, the cruncher will replace unknown when you enter that VIN with "3600 Commercial 3/4 ton truck (forward) with a 125.25 Wheel Base"

I will be slowly adding images to the VIN Cruncher.. so not only will you get the data for the VIN you entered, but it will also display a "Stock" photo of the truck as well.

That's what I thought. Thanks again.

This is a really huge project!! Fumblin has the big part done. Getting more data will help. Once we get it majorly done, we may solicit some volunteers to help gather more numbers to crunch in there.

I know Fumblin is working on the stack from Mike Boetler now (I think 55 to 59) !!!

It's gonna be cooooooooolamundo!

Peg

Fumblin, there is an error in the '53-'55.1 section of the Stovebolt Model/Series page. The size descriptions are shifted up/down relative to the model/series/WB columns by the word "chassis" wrapping to the next line for the forward controls.

J should be the 3600 Comm. 3/4-ton conventional, not forward. K is 3700 forward control. Also, the Utility 1.5 ton should start with N 4100.

Ok, the VIN Cruncher is now updated to crunch numbers from 1929 thru 1955 First Series trucks.

http://www.geekoasis.com/vincalc/

For those of you who have seen it before, it'll look a little different than my first version.. here's a screen shot:

[img]http://www.geekoasis.com/vincalc/screenshot.gif[/img]

The idea is to put a picture of a truck in the spot to the left that says "VIN CRUNCHER".

So if you enter a VIN for a '46 2 Ton, not only will you get the listing with WB and Plant information, but you'll also get a picture of what the truck outta look like.. which might come in handy for some folks!

I'll be working on the next batch of data (the 55 second series thru 1959) in the next day or so.. in the meantime, feel free to plug your '29 thru '55 First Series numbers in there and see if it's working right!

Fumblin, the type descriptions are still shifted for the '53-'55.1. Here's a correct list:

3100 H 1/2 Ton - Comm. 116"
3600 J 3/4 Ton - Comm. 125.25"
3700 K 3/4 Ton - Forward Control 125.25"
3800 L 1 Ton - Comm. 137"
3900 M 1 Ton - Forward Control 137"
4100 N 1-1/2 Ton 137"
4400 P 1-1/2 Ton 161"
4500 R 1-1/2 Ton - School Bus Chassis 161"
5100 S 2 Ton COE 110"
5400 T 2 Ton COE 134"
5700 U 2 Ton COE 158"
6100 V 2 Ton 137"
6400 W 2 Ton 161"
6500 X 2 Ton 179"
6700 Y 2 Ton - School Bus Chassis 199"
6800 Z 2 Ton - School Bus Chassis 212"

The AD trucks also had what they called 1-1/2 Ton Specials in the 5000 and 6000 series that aren't included in this list. These are identical to the 2 Ton trucks, but use lower rated tires and include a "derated" max. GVW VIN plate. I could elaborate if you would like to include them. It adds an S to the series prefixes to end up with a 3-letter prefix for '47.2-'52, and 2-letter for '53-'55.1. I don't know how many of these "Specials" are actually out there.

Xram53,

I've updated the software to reflect your corrected data. Thank you for your help!

I'm looking over the data provided on MikeB's website, and i'm somewhat confused as to the descriptions.

Up untill now, descriptions have always been pretty much the "tonnage" of the truck like

1.5 Ton Schoolbus
or
1/2 Ton Pickup

Mike B's descriptions are things like:

Flat Face Cowl Chassis, Cab Chassis%, Pickup%, Panel%, Suburban%, W/S Cowl Chassis & Cameo.

Anybody know where I can get the short sweet descriptions i'm so fond of?

That may make perfect sence to the veteran 'bolters out there, but for the greenhorn 'bolter like myself, I like to simply see the kind of description i've got for the '29 thru 55.1's.

The series numbers for '56-'59 up thru the 6000 series are the same "tonnage" as the previous years.

31-32-34-3500 1/2 Ton
36-3700 3/4 Ton
3800 1 Ton
4000 series 1-1/2 Ton
5000 series 2 Ton LCF*
6000 series 2 Ton

*LCF=low cab forward, formerly known as COE.

In 1956, Chevy added even bigger trucks, which I believe are as follows (someone please correct me if I got the tonnage wrong):

7000 series 2-1/2 Ton LCF
8000 series 2-1/2 Ton (Conventional)
9000 series 3 Ton LCF
10000 series 3 Ton (Conventional)

Note that MikeB's lists also show the "special" and "heavy duty" models. I'm not sure how these designations affect the nominal rating of the trucks. For instance, for the AD trucks, the 6000S series was called a 1-1/2 Ton Special, rather than the usual 2 Ton. Something similar may or may not apply to the TF special trucks. Heavy Duty options may increase the actual GVW without affecting the nominal rating.

Fumblin46,

Said, "Mike B's descriptions are things like:

Flat Face Cowl Chassis, Cab Chassis%, Pickup%, Panel%, Suburban%, W/S Cowl Chassis & Cameo."

Those are all of the different Model configurations available in the 3100 Series (1/2 ton). The same applies to the other Series trucks listed on my page.

Curt,

"9000 series 3 Ton LCF
10000 series 3 Ton (Conventional)"

The 9000 & 10000 are still rated at 2-1/2 ton at least through 1959.

"Note that MikeB's lists also show the "special" and "heavy duty" models. I'm not sure how these designations affect the nominal rating of the trucks. For instance, for the AD trucks, the 6000S series was called a 1-1/2 Ton Special, rather than the usual 2 Ton. Something similar may or may not apply to the TF special trucks. Heavy Duty options may increase the actual GVW without affecting the nominal rating."

That is correct for TF trucks as well,

5000S & 6000S Series = Heavy Duty 1-1/2 ton w/ 15,000# GVW.

5000 & 6000 Series = standard 2 ton w/ 19,500# GVW.

5000H & 6000H Series = Heavy Duty 2 ton w/ 21,000# GVW.

Clear as mud...right?!?

Mike

Fumbin, all the GMC data is available at the website in my signature.

Excellent!

Now the real question is this:

Should I incorperate the GMC data into the VIN Cruncher so it acts as a "one stop" for both Chevy and GMC, or should I make a seperate VIN Crunchers, one for Chevrolet and the other for GMC?

Fumblin,

I would think both in one would be good because it represents the Stovbolts (for us anyway).

Just MHO.

All this data is making me blind. I don't know how you do it.

But I'm GLAD you're going it.

Peg

I think both in one is ideal because often people don't know what the number is from. I also think ideally it would do engine serial numbers to, because sometimes trucks were titled using the engine number instead of the body number.

Fumblin I've intended to be more help here, but have been buried by other responsibilities. I'm amazed at how quickly you've been able to put this together.

Great job here!

The VIN Cruncher is now capable of "crunching" numbers from 1929 thru 1955 Second Series Chevrolet trucks.

I'd like to get support for model years thru 1959 by this evening, but we'll see how my day goes.. if the Stovebolt Gods are smiling on me today, I may have a new 50 1/2 ton to sit behind the wheel and pretend i'm driving.. which would cut slightly into my available programming time.

Rapid development for complex applications in a web enviroment is my specialty.. and compared to most of the projects i've put together this VIN Cruncher is really pretty simple and easy.

It would not be even remotely possible had it not been for the many hours of research done by the folks who've compiled the VIN/Serial number data, or from the tips, suggestions, and corrections of you folks here!

If someone would like to do the leg work on images, that would be terrific!

Basically, what I need is a representitive picture of vehicles for each model year and style.. for example, if I were to type 'L255S' into the cruncher, it would display a photo of a 1955 2nd Series 3800. (with a 135 Inch WB, of course!)

The images would be intended to give the person a general idea of what the truck should look like, so a single slight angle shot that showed the front and side of the truck would be ideal.

Also, if somebody could come up with a list that explained what the different series meant as far as tonnage is concerned, that would be swell.. like '3800 is a 1 ton' and '3100 is a 1/2 ton' so I could include that information with the MikeB data.

You old school and even slightly experienced bolters probably know that stuff off the top of your head.. but it might be nice for those amoung us who really don't know squat about it to have a "tonnage" rating along side the series number.

I'd like to get as wide a range of Chevy truck Serial numbers into the cruncher as possible, perhaps taking it as late as 1972.. but at this point, i'm tackling the project a year at a time.

If solid data exsists for engine numbers, i'll have to review it and see if incorperating that capability within the current VIN cruncher is possible.. depending on the numbering schemes, I may have to make a seperate cruncher for those numbers, or make a button that lets you toggle between "serial number" and "engine number".

Thanks again for all who have contributed information and corrections to this project! With your assistance, I hope to build a resource that the entire stovebolt community will find useful!

Fumblin, how about one cruncher with a radio button (or other selector) for Chevy/GMC?

that sounds like a cool idea, GMCPanel!

You have a graphic in mind you can send/post/link to?

great job i have a hard enough time just to find the on/off button, thanks to sticky notes can at least find my way. keep up the good work..mike j

Hey Fumblin46,

I updated my web site to show the ton ratings (for 55-2 thru 59) next to the Series designation.

Hope it helps!

Mike
http://www.chevytrucks.org/mikesgarage/

Excellent!

I'm hoping to get "VIN Crunching" capability thru 1959 soon.. a task that would be impossible without your data.

Thanks again!