The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area The HiPo Shop Frame Related Questions- New Member

Hello All,
Thanks for the welcomes! Please pardon my lack of knowledge.
I will rope together a few photos and vin number for help identifying my GMC dually model in a subsequent post.
As mentioned, I have two five window half ton sized cabs. Neither great, but might be made serviceable with new floors.
So I am looking for one original frame for a half ton original truck to be built.
As for the second cab project, here is my question. For a half ton driver, what is/ are good frame choice alternatives? I would be looking for
IFS possibly, modern brakes, SBC, highway speed gear ratios, etc., in other words an advanced design top, and a more modern driver truck below.
Wouldn't need a show truck. As long as it runs, stops, and doesn't get a ticket. I know on paper the 73- 88 frame is close, but a bit wider track width.
The 99- 20--s is IFS, and would have several of these features. So if you know a great choice, or alternatively, can tell my why a possible choice is a
bad idea, please give me your input, and help me avoid a bad mistake. I am not a welder, and have no idea how hard it would it fab cab mounts for an
advanced design cab onto a newer gm frame. Can anyone point me to a book, articles, expert, etc., to get some help on this? Please? I don't have enough
years left to correct all the possible mistakes by trial and error, haha. Someone must have tried some of these. What works? Thank you for any input! For
example, I have heard of the S-10 swap, some might like it, but it appears tiny to me. I don't want to chop a good original frame for an IFS kit, if possible.

You are in a dilemma: You want IFS, but don't want to chop a good original frame for IFS. You're considering a chassis swap, but you're not a welder and that entails lots of fabrication. Plus you said you don't have many years left - both strategies take time.

I guess you could always buy an Art Morrison or Roadster Shop chassis. They're expensive, but they're what the pro shops all use to get projects done in a few weeks. They're custom-made for your year, make and model truck. You just paint 'em and assemble the truck like a big model car kit. There's also a guy on Ebay who'll build your truck to your specs; last I saw he was charging about $20K depending on how you want it equipped.

My advice: Don't get in over your head by trying to build two trucks at once. Build the first truck on an original frame and original suspension (all refurbished of course) as you planned. You can add disc brakes and dropped axle for stopping power and a cool stance. Enjoy the heck out of it for a few years, then if you feel like doing the second cab you can always do it later.

My build is pretty radical. I looked into a custom chassis but nobody made anything close to what I wanted. They all seem to be IFS with rack and pinon and I needed straight drop axle with electric P/S on stock steering box. They were also all set up for SBC or BBC and I'm running a blown 292 I6. Also set up for exhaust down both sides and I need 2 on driver side. The rears were 4 link or bagged with ford 9" and I'm running a Frankland quick change, lief springs and Bicknel torque arm. So I'm building my own with original frame rails. I spent 6k on a bender, notcher, TIG and other tools and will still come out ahead. Also since my time is free I can make it super cool. Tube is not that expensive. I suppose you could sell the tools when your done but probably wont. It's not that hard to weld and you will be good by the time your done. It's just steel if you mess up grind it off and try again. Just my $.02 worth. Don't forget it's your truck do what you want. Get all the advice you can and then make it yours. Enjoy the journey.

Agreed. I tried both the frame swap, then ifs route and, let me tell you, you need some skill. I have since acquired said skills, but after building one truck to nearly stock standards, and having put over 1,300 miles on it, I’d still lean toward doing your truck mostly stock. I read somewhere (most likely here) that the best frame for your truck is the one it is sitting on. 😉 Weird.

Stock(or ish)
Pros-
Everything fits together because it was engineered to do so.
Cheaper.
Less frustrating.
More likely to be finished.
Easier maintenance (not necessarily less maintenance, but easier).
People are always interested in talking about the old straight 6 under the hood. 350? No one will bat an eyelash.

Cons
Not exactly what you wanted in the first place. (But the old stock charm might grow on you. It did for me.)


Home IFS install/ Frame swap.

Pros-
Could handle VERY nicely if it doesn’t bumpsteer. Scary when they do.
Modern drivetrain and parts availability.
More power
“Possible” better mpg

Cons
Expensive
No skills? You’d better have deep pockets to help pay for someone to help fix your goofs, because goof up you will.
One “tiny” modification will snow ball out of control when the next piece doesn’t fit, then the next, then the next, then the next, and then you get crabby, sell it for 25% of what you sunk into it and then likely start over with a stock (ish) build. (Ask me how I know this one.)



Alternatives?

Frame purchase- what do these start at these days? $12,000? Bare! Dressed out? $20,000? That old stock frame looks pretty good now, doesn’t it? Still, if I had unlimited funds I’d likely do it too!

Buy one to your taste that is done using the money you got from selling the two cabs/truck projects= instant gratification and then you’re driving it. Tomorrow! If time isn’t on your side, both a complete stock rebuild or hot rod modified “resto-mod” are not in your favor.

I built my complete stock ish GMC 1 ton in just over 3 years. I did everything mysefl(except rechroming and engine block machining) and often put in 8 hour days on it in the summer when I wasn’t in school teaching. I was in the shop everyday for at least an hour. I have well over 1500 hours of my time. Did I goof? You bet. Did I have some skills? Yes, and they continue to grow. I screwed up royally my first couple go rounds and don’t like seeing others make my mistakes.

“Stop...and think it through.”–-Cookie Monster–Sesame Street.

Weigh the options, all of them, critically. Your wallet and sanity will thank you.
Good luck whatever you choose. We are here to help both ways, and I hope that doesn’t scare you off. 😎

Rant over.

“Stop...and think it through.”–-Cookie Monster–Sesame Street.

Weigh the options, all of them, critically. Your wallet and sanity will thank you.
Good luck whatever you choose. We are here to help both ways, and I hope that doesn’t scare you off. 😎

Rant over. (Fox)

AMEN!!!!

I second the recommendation to keeping it mostly stock and I‘ll use myself as an example.

I bought our ‘52 3100 truck (complete truck mostly stock) in February on 2019 thinking I could wrap up the mechanical issues in one year then get to doing the bodywork the next. I had it running and driving by March, one month later, but once I looked into why it didn’t stop very well or why it felt like I was trying to heard cattle driving it down the road or why the engine didn’t maintain oil pressure or why the drivetrain was makIng noise, did I realize how much mechanical work it was really going to take. At this point, my block is at the machine shop being fully re-machined, my transmission has been rebuilt and I’m waiting for a replacement bell housing and rear axles. It seems with every issue I tackle, I’m opening up a can of worms.

Fox’s timeline for restoring a ‘mostly stock’ truck in three years is spot on. I’m hoping to finally complete the mechanical issues by next spring.

Once you get one restored truck under your belt, you will have gained the skills to tackle your next project, the old truck on a modern chassis. Good luck, you have us fellow “Stovebolters” to learn from and lean on!

Just a guess, but I believe for every "resto-mod" truck that gets completed there are probably a dozen or more that end up gathering dust or getting scrapped before the project gets completed because of inexperience, loss of interest, or inadequate budget by someone who began the job with the best of intentions. All of us know (or should) where the road that's paved with those ends up! I'd suggest that you get the truck going by bringing it back to as close to original as possible, and then tackling "upgrades" one at a time as your schedule and budget allows. You just might discover that something "modern" isn't always as desirable as you might have been led to believe. These old rigs managed to travel millions of miles and haul thousands of tons of cargo in their original condition, and one that's put back in good shape will probably outlive the ones that get butchered up and hotrodded. Just my "nickel's worth"- - - -two cents adjusted for inflation!
Jerry

I agree with most here,ive done up grades on my 50 3100,such as newer 235,SM-465, 3.08 rear axel gear dana, and really haven't had any issues in the last 35 years I've been driving it! Logged about 20,000 miles

Thanks to Everyone for all the thoughts. All good information to think about. Follow up questions:
(1) Several messages in various topic threads mention frame swaps but don't mention what frames are being used to swap onto for the change.
Chevy and GMC trucks half ton started using factory IFS frames in 1988 (?) and soon added 3/4, one ton, etc. What little I have been able to find
online suggests wheel bases on the 88-91 frames are very close to Advanced design, but track width is wider by 3-4 inches. Similar, but not quite
the same for 91-99. 2000 to 2020 I just don't know SO......Has anyone heard of a frame swap onto a 88 to 2020 chevy/ gmc frame? Any source of
info. you could send me to read or ask? I don't have any frame now to start with, so all info. is useful!
(2) As some have noted, restomod projects get started but most are not finished. Does anyone know of a stalled project for sale anywhere? Maybe
I will get lucky!

I don't yet have the authorization to send individuals private messages, and I can't yet open sent files here to see photos, or read details. I'm
sure that will happen in due course. For now, I would need someone to send me a private message so I could read it, if they didn't want to post on
the general thread. Thanks for all the advise! I will come up with a project soon! Mike Stone.

Mike, What I found missing in your thread is what year your truck is. Is it a 1953 as possibly indicated by your username? That's important information for what you might be asking for.

As far as Private Messages, you have 6 posts at this point, and you should be able to send and receive PM's as well as insert pictures in your posts.

Re 1953: I myself am a product of 1953, lol. In storage, I have mentioned I have a fairly complete 1953 GMC dually, two speed rear, 270 ( I think ?). Don't know what model
since all the numbers emblems are missing off the truck. Probably a one ton or a two ton, but I am not sure. Want to get photos, and ask you all to help identify the beast.
I do not intend to tear it apart trying to cobble a half ton driver out of it. I saved it from the crusher. I have spent more on storage than it's worth. I just couldn't let it die.
I have two five window cabs, both need a lot of body work. I have no other frame, no front clip, no other engine to rebuild yet. Just a dream for an Advanced Design. So,
I keep asking frame swap related questions to get ideas on where to start. In short, the cabs are 50 and 52 I believe, but trying to figure out where to turn next. So I don't
really have a truck except one trade or sell or ??? to someone who wants a big truck restoration. I'm trying to get ideas for a 47-53 A.D. half ton type driver, restomod., etc.

See if you can trade the “Big Bolt” for a “Small Bolt” and proceed to your intended goal of a 1/2 ton Hotrod.

So has anyone heard of a frame swap of an advanced design onto a 1988 to 2020 chevy or gmc IFS factory frame??? Any sources of information you could direct me to check? Thanks for any ideas!

Those newer frames are going to be really wide for an AD.

Gm/Chevy trucks started using IFS (torsion bars up front I believe from 60-62) in 1960. Full, modern style in 1963. The footprint of all trucks after this are wider than the AD. Most frame swap guys go for an 1980’s S10 longbox frame. The wheel base is very, very close, and the front end is just a twitch narrower than the ADframe. Slightly offset rims get it close. It is MUCH more apparent when people try to move the rims “in” on a full size (63-00) frame swap. It just looks funny. The rim is darn near rubbing the fenders and it looks wrong.

As for a BIG bolt, i am not sure of the dimension of the front sheetmetal. This could change your mind.

The 1 ton sheet metal IS THE SAME as the 1/2 ton’s.

Pm Coilover. He might shed more light for you.

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John