Kevin 1951 Chevy 3100 work truck Follow this saga in Project Journal Photos 1929 Ford pickup restored from the ground up. | 1929 Ford Special Coupe (First car) Busting rust since the mid-60's If you're smart enough to take it apart, you darn well better be smart enough to put it back together.
There are currently 273 million cars in the U.S. Can you imagine the overload on the electrical grid if even half those were switched to EVs? And what about the elephant in the room that is the battery disposal nightmare? We will be foisting an environmental disaster akin to Love Canal or Hanford Nuclear Reservation on our children's future. Now keep in mind that the majority of US electric production is coal-fired, and you see that EVs don't eliminate pollution, they just transfer it somewhere else.
“ . . . Now keep in mind that the majority of US electric production is coal-fired, and you see that EVs don't eliminate pollution, they just transfer it somewhere else.”
Not quite . . .
FACTS from the US Dept of Energy:
Fossil fuels is about 63% The #1 source of electrical energy production is from natural gas. Coal (#2 source) is a little bit more than nuclear energy (#3 source). Renewable energy sources are a little bit less than nuclear energy.
Speculation: EV power will take off when it is readily available at fast “refill stations”.
Yes, recycling and disposal of waste will be a problem (similar to dealing with carbon-based waste and nuclear reactor waste).
Kinda takes away from the nostalgia of the old vehicles we grew up with. And the price tag, $50K, ouch! I would love a Tesla though.
Phil Moderator, The Engine Shop, Interiors and Project Journals
1952 Chevrolet 3100, Three on the Tree, 4:11 torque tube Updated to: ‘59 235 w/hydraulic lifters, 12v w/alternator, HEI, PCV and Power front Disc Brakes Project Journals Stovebolt Gallery Forum
We can't even figure out a bad voltage regulator on our truck, Don't need no more electrics. Don't need to wait in line at a charging station. Ships and subs and some military equipment run on electric propulsion.............from an on board jet engine or two....or a nuclear reactor. I have worked at companies involved in that. In space they use photovoltaics. Seriously: 1. Our trucks are too heavy. 2. There are 40 brazillian gas motors in this world. They are not going away is the next 100 years. 3. I have a really neat Ryobi EGO electric cordless mower. I have used electric mowers for 65 years. Corded. 4. Interesting to chose the name Tesla. He was an AC guy. Edison was the DC guy.
Right is right, even if everyone is against it, and wrong is wrong, even if everyone is for it. - William Penn
Sorry for stirring up a hornet's nest guys. At $50 K the conversion is definitely a rich guy's toy. That's not me. Lots of opinions about this.
Kevin 1951 Chevy 3100 work truck Follow this saga in Project Journal Photos 1929 Ford pickup restored from the ground up. | 1929 Ford Special Coupe (First car) Busting rust since the mid-60's If you're smart enough to take it apart, you darn well better be smart enough to put it back together.
I don't golf, but if I did I would get an older gas powered cart. Nothing wrong with going electric for new vehicles. I just prefer my old trucks to burn fossil fuel.
John
~ J Lucas 2006 GMC Envoy 4.2 I6 2023 Ram 2500/Cumins 6.7 I6 2010 Jeep Grand Cherokee (Wife’s) 2002 Silverado 2500 Gas 6.0 1941 Chevy 1/2-Ton 1942 Chevy 1.5-Ton SWB In the Gallery My Flicker Photos!
Honestly I AM interested in an electric kit for these; leaving the nostalgia aside the HP and TORQUE that these electric conversions can develop is astounding. I can see kits for other vehicles under 10K Canuck funds (which are like Pesos or Yen these days). I'm sure a kit for say a Ranger (about 8k Canuck) could be made to work well in an AD. Not sure if that includes batteries, but battery efficiency and cost seems to be coming down every year.
1949 Chevrolet 3/4 Ton - Still Solid. Regular Driver OT Vehicles: 1925 Hudson Brougham Super Six 1950 Chevrolet Styline (Parts) 1952 Canuck Pontiac Sedan Delivery (Well Underway) 1973 F250 4x4 Highboy 1977 F250 4x4 Lowboy
....but battery efficiency and cost seems to be coming down every year.
Hopefully, you meant battery efficiency is going up?
From where I usually sit, the technology isn't there yet. The latest thing I get to observe is a Tesla battery trailer that is supposed to replace a generator during a power outage. At the moment, it looks like it is too heavy and will be a permit load. We'll see where it goes from there.
I agree it's a while back but for playing around on the weekend, might be a neat project.
All that said, and despite my apparent enthusiasm above, the co$t is still WAAAYYY above where I'd care to "play", though. But it seems to be improving, slowly. So I should clarify I'm "hypothetically" interested but financially, I can build a lot of engines and burn a lot of gasoline for that price yet
1949 Chevrolet 3/4 Ton - Still Solid. Regular Driver OT Vehicles: 1925 Hudson Brougham Super Six 1950 Chevrolet Styline (Parts) 1952 Canuck Pontiac Sedan Delivery (Well Underway) 1973 F250 4x4 Highboy 1977 F250 4x4 Lowboy
Interesting story on the TV news... Apparently owners of older Nissan Leafs (Leaves?) are getting screwed by Nissan. The batteries are coming to end of life and Nissan doesn't have replacements. Nissan suggests that the owners buy new cars. They say that the batteries on the new cars will last almost indefinitely.
It seems to me that soon you will be able to pick up a Nissan Leaf in good shape for next to nothing. Salvage the motor and electronics. Buy new batteries and you should have all you need to convert your truck to electric.
Interesting. My Daughter and Son in Law in Juneau have a Leaf. It's perfect for them, as there's only 50 miles of road from one end to the other. Don't know how old it is though. They've had it for quite a few years. I just sent him the above post and he says that NAPA now has Leaf batteries.
Last edited by klhansen; 10/27/202012:55 AM.
Kevin 1951 Chevy 3100 work truck Follow this saga in Project Journal Photos 1929 Ford pickup restored from the ground up. | 1929 Ford Special Coupe (First car) Busting rust since the mid-60's If you're smart enough to take it apart, you darn well better be smart enough to put it back together.
There is nothing in place to recycle or safely dispose of EV batteries? I donated a car to charity and one of the questions asked, is this a battery car? So it takes a technician to safely remove a battery, is this something the car manufacturer will provide free? Will wreck yards take cars with EV batteries? You bet! What if a battery leaks? Which is worse, toxic chemicals inside a EV battery or black oil leaking from a stovebolt engine? Since California is going non-fossil, I guess they'll figure out EV battery disposal as long as the US government (taxpayer) pays the bill?
"Adding CFM to a truck will only help at engine speeds you don't want to use." "I found there was nothing to gain beyond 400 CFM."
You don’t have to worry about EV battery disposal They are worth a lot of money to the recyclers. Put them on the curb and they will disappear You can also bring them to me for free The “toxic” chemicals in a Li-Ion ev battery are much safer for the environment than lead and oil There is much less of it and it’s very volatile and easily breaks down It burns like lighter fluid. Your EV gets 100K miles on a battery with a couple liters of electrolyte Your gas car gets 100k miles burning many many barrels of hydrocarbons It’s a very good trade for the environment
The rest of the battery that isn’t the electrolyte is a bit of Mylar, aluminum, copper, graphite and the valuable part which is the lithium compound. -s
I'm not pro or con on this topic. Just curious and want to learn. Cut-n-paste off the net:
In the U.S., there’s no federal guidelines on how to handle the spent batteries, but companies like Toyota, Tesla and Nissan have their own refurbishing programs. My comment here. Remember the issues with airbag failures and the numerous lawsuits to force the manufacturers to take action. We trust manufacturers to self-police?
Lithium-ion car batteries are required to be recycled under North Carolina (my state) state law. They’re banned from NC landfills.
Cobalt, is one of today’s preferred components used to make the lithium-ion batteries that power EVs. Cobalt is mined all over the world, but 50 to 60 percent of the global supply comes from the Democratic Republic of Congo (DRC), which has a poor human rights track record. According to UNICEF and Amnesty International, around 40,000 children are involved in cobalt mining.
Rechargeable Lithium Ion batteries are potentially hazardous and can present a serious FIRE HAZARD if damaged, defective or improperly used. My comment here. I recall exploding laptops and cell phones from past battery designs. I was at my local tire/automotive shop today and was told that a Tesla owner run over something and was asking them if they could fix it. The shop tech found that the EV battery was punctured. Tesla quoted the shop $18,000 for a new battery, the local shop didn't have a trained tech to do a replacement plus the shop was not able to deal with recycling a leaking battery.
Last edited by buoymaker; 10/27/20203:51 PM.
"Adding CFM to a truck will only help at engine speeds you don't want to use." "I found there was nothing to gain beyond 400 CFM."
How about shoehorning an LS in a Nissan Leaf? Zoooooooooommmmmmmm!
1970 Chevrolet C10 Grandpa's -- My first truck -- In progress to shiny Follow the build in the Project Journal 1950 Chevrolet 1-Ton Dually "Ole Red Girl" In the Stovebolt Gallery More pictures here 1951 GMC 9430 1 ton dually--Shiny! | 1972 Chevrolet C20- Rusty- the puzzle box lid for the C10 | 1962 AMC Rambler American- my wife's Parts trucks- 1951 GMC 9300 | 1951-GMC 9430 | 1951- Chevrolet 1300
General Motors has announced a recall of 50,932 2017 through 2019 Chevrolet Bolt EVs in the U.S. The problem is the chance of a fire in the high-voltage battery pack, which could occur even when the vehicle is stopped, parked, and not plugged in to charge. GM said owners should park the vehicles outside and away from houses until repairs can take place. NHTSA's report on its investigation of three vehicles that caught fire–one each from 2017, 2018, and 2019 model years–said "fire damage appeared to be concentrated in the EV battery compartment area with penetration into the passenger compartment from under the rear seat. The root cause of these fires is unknown.
"Adding CFM to a truck will only help at engine speeds you don't want to use." "I found there was nothing to gain beyond 400 CFM."
High voltage plus spark and/or heat from a loose connection and combustible material adjacent = fire.
Kevin 1951 Chevy 3100 work truck Follow this saga in Project Journal Photos 1929 Ford pickup restored from the ground up. | 1929 Ford Special Coupe (First car) Busting rust since the mid-60's If you're smart enough to take it apart, you darn well better be smart enough to put it back together.
Am I up for an electric stovebolt? Only after I also become a latte' swilling, man bun wearing alleged "male" with lace on his drawers and a compulsion for apologizing for being alive and contributing to polluting the atmosphere with the CO2 I exhale! Think about how much better place the world would be of those guys would simply hold their breath for about 15 minutes! LOL! Jerry
"It is better to be silent and be thought a fool than to speak and eliminate all doubt!" - Abraham Lincoln Cringe and wail in fear, Eloi- - - - -we Morlocks are on the hunt! There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self. - Ernest Hemingway Love your enemies and drive 'em nuts!
Am I up for an electric stovebolt? Only after I also become a latte' swilling, man bun wearing alleged "male" with lace on his drawers and a compulsion for apologizing for being alive and contributing to polluting the atmosphere with the CO2 I exhale! Think about how much better place the world would be of those guys would simply hold their breath for about 15 minutes! LOL! Jerry
Jerry, as a friend, I really must urge you to not hold back these opinions of yours and sugarcoat them so much -- bottling it up so much will be your undoing some day.
But seriously folks ... "latte' swilling, man bun wearing alleged "male" with lace on his drawers and a compulsion for apologizing for being alive" is a pretty creative, if not altogether inaccurate, a word picture ... even if you forgot to add "and who puts catsup on his vegan hotdogs"
John Non latte swilling, non apologetic boxer wearing omnivore. My carbon footprint probably covers the island of Manhattan.
~ John
A kid raised on Hotwheels, Matchbox and Tonka cannot be reasonably expected to own only one vehicle as an adult.
1949 Chevrolet 3804 In the Legacy Gallery | In the Gallery Forum 1973 IH 1310 Dump 1963 Kaiser M38A1 2001 International/AmTran RE3000 "Skoolie" 2014 Ford E-350 4x4 (Quigley)
I really love Stovebolt. It's the place where community dogs come to mark their spot. My turn.
I was thinking about my earlier post and was wondering how in the world someone (expletive) manages to punch a hole in the floor of a Tesla...then it came to me. I was travelling south on a very crowded I-75 in Florida trying to keep up with the fast moving traffic. In a nanosecond an object is bouncing on the road. No time to react. Fortunately it only takes out the fog light on my Subaru. Then I see a Winnebago pulling to the side with a short aluminum ladder dangling off the side but not yet separated from the back. Given the speed and proper angle, that ladder could have fallen off and impaled a car or maybe a Tesla battery box.
"Adding CFM to a truck will only help at engine speeds you don't want to use." "I found there was nothing to gain beyond 400 CFM."
Why would someone put a clutch and 3-speed tranny in an electric motor powered vehicle?? All you need is a voltage controller and direct drive.
Kevin 1951 Chevy 3100 work truck Follow this saga in Project Journal Photos 1929 Ford pickup restored from the ground up. | 1929 Ford Special Coupe (First car) Busting rust since the mid-60's If you're smart enough to take it apart, you darn well better be smart enough to put it back together.
From "theVerge.com": General Motors teased the “future of hot rodding”. The franken-truck, dubbed “E-10,” is not the only wonderful....ONE-OFF....oddity to come out of this year’s Specialty Equipment Market Association (SEMA) trade show. 450 horsepower, and is capable of making it from 0 to 60 miles per hour in five seconds. Those modifications still require handing over a lot of money to a specialty shop. also: 1968 Porsche 912 doing smoky burnouts, thanks to the motor from a Tesla Model S P85. EV West – now has a wait list measured in years, full of customers waiting to plunk down up to (and sometimes more than) $100,000 for a car. EV West plans to sell a 912 conversion kit for roughly $50,000 (work to be done by a specialty shop).
First, I don't have money to burn (like EV battery fluid) that some good folks in California have. My wife won't let me mortgage our house. She yells something about a fixed income. Second, to do an EV AD truck correctly, it needs to be safe. Steering and brakes need to be modernized to be safe on our roads. I have an electronics background and I know these motors can have a terrible amount of torque which has to be limited by software, computer hardware and feedback sensors. You need strong brakes and great steering as a fail-safe should a sensor go bad or a software/hardware glitch arises. Don't believe me? I've seen what happens when a AGV contacts a factory steel fire door. It bows them like a potato chip and the rear tires don't stop spinning..more like smoking. Third, the modified truck has to pass the state's DMV inspection for a custom vehicle. Fourth, the insurance company needs paperwork from the specialty shop so the truck owner is not legally liable for design defects. This pretty much eliminates the DIYers.
Oh yes! There needs to be a thick steel skid plate, underneath the battery array, in case you are driving down Florida I-75 and the Winnebago in front of you drops an aluminum ladder.
Last edited by buoymaker; 11/20/20204:03 AM.
"Adding CFM to a truck will only help at engine speeds you don't want to use." "I found there was nothing to gain beyond 400 CFM."
I wonder how many folks think it through when it comes to electric vehicles. There are still folks who don't believe we need farmers because "I buy all of my food at the A&P!" Electric "might" be a/the solution. I suspect technology will evolve that fossil fuels can be used and not harm the environment. Follow the money trail on this one. We shouldn't leave a footprint on Mother Earth from our existence...the goal. In the near term it would behoove the rest of the world if they would have the emission standards that the U.S. currently does.
Max 250 mile range. I talked to one of my people and the plan is to run it only 100 miles. It will take a 1 hour quick charge. It won't top it off, but will extend the range. So, with a little planning, load in the morning, deliver the load, plug in, go to lunch, come back and return run. That should get him through LA traffic with enough to get home.
The biggest problem ANYWHERE is no infrastructure. Even the companies running these trucks don't have enough juice. Some people are adding generators to their houses because the power companies can't keep the lights on and their tired of having no power. What makes them think they have enough to charge a bunch of electric vehicles.
A one off, specialty AD EV is a novelty. If it's your daily driver, you'll have to do some planning to be able to get around.
BTW, finding enough juice for a heavy truck like this is easier than a smaller vehicle. Some of the non-implemented ideas this engineer had were brilliant. But it seems that some of these vehicle manufacturers don't even want to build trucks. Must not be where the money is at.
The fixation with electric vehicles sort of reminds me of the backwoods Russian soldiers who captured Germany at the end of WW II. They were prone to rip the plumbing out of the buildings they occupied, take the pipes home with them, stuff them through a wall, expecting water to flow when they turned the tap. "I don't need gasoline- - - - -I've got electricity!" Didn't Forrest Gump's Mama have a saying about people like that? Jerry
"It is better to be silent and be thought a fool than to speak and eliminate all doubt!" - Abraham Lincoln Cringe and wail in fear, Eloi- - - - -we Morlocks are on the hunt! There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self. - Ernest Hemingway Love your enemies and drive 'em nuts!
I wonder if they'll send an electric-powered fire truck to put out the burning vehicle when its lithium-ion battery spontaneously combusts? I hope they've got a BIG battery to run that water pump and it doesn't also catch fire! LOL! Jerry
"It is better to be silent and be thought a fool than to speak and eliminate all doubt!" - Abraham Lincoln Cringe and wail in fear, Eloi- - - - -we Morlocks are on the hunt! There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self. - Ernest Hemingway Love your enemies and drive 'em nuts!
A few years ago Daimler did a promotional stunt with a autominious frieghtliner vehicle driving across a dam Times are changing for sure _______________________________________________________________________________
As for an EV stovebolt, I would of liked to see how that stovebolters project turned out.
I had. Co worker who put at least 60 k into his 50, he was hot rodding it. Good for him Ive seen show AD trucks , every inch chromed , custom etching, some gold plating, custom paint. Good for them Ive seen AD trucks rolling with weeds still stuck in the bumper, looked like it may have been just pulled out of the field .Good for them. An EV stovebolt, if thats your interest.....go for it....your truck...your money....enjoy
Id sit and shoot the chit with all those guys. Like the stovebolt monicker says “cheep beer and cigar smoke”
20 years ago I was in Hamburg, Germany for several months. The intercity electric train transportation is the S-bahn/U-bahn and a connecting bus system for outside the city. City to city trains were diesel. In the city, it is much easier to take the train than rent a car, take a taxi or drive your own car. Schools kids, grandma and grandpa, city workers and others used the train. Different classes and races of people. If you could afford to live outside the city, you drove your car to the car park and took the train or bus into the city. Naturally if you had to haul something like several bags of groceries, you would drive your car. If you took vacation, you drove your car or rented one.
German car inspection, compared to American, is severe. You can be fined for having a rusty fender. It's very difficult to have a specialized car on the road. There are old car/truck motor clubs in Germany like in the USA but the car has to be kept original (or repair parts made to original specs) or you can't drive it on the road.
Today gasoline averages $1.6 per liter or $6 a gallon in Germany. 2020 EV car sales are pushing 11%. I suspect by now, car parks have rental spots for EV plug-ins. Also I suspect there are some EV busses.
The German government has been, for a long time, very active in controlling (organization, rules, laws, government owned) public transportation where here in America it's basically left up to a free enterprise system. The transportation mindset of the German people has adapted to being efficient. In Germany the EV makes sense.
I searched the net for, "why is traffic in L.A. so bad". One official said, "As cities grow, and L.A. has become a global city and it’s continuing to densify it has very heavy traffic congestion, not because people drive a lot; people actually drive less in L.A. than they do in most cities. It’s because our densities are are moderately high. And so you have more people driving a modest amount, but crowded together and still depending largely on the automobile".
Using L.A. as an example, the EV car may be a significant improvement to reducing pollution but I think it's a temporary band-aid. The EV that makes sense in high population areas is the electric train.
Happy Turkey Day
Last edited by buoymaker; 11/26/20205:59 PM.
"Adding CFM to a truck will only help at engine speeds you don't want to use." "I found there was nothing to gain beyond 400 CFM."
