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| | | | Joined: Apr 2002 Posts: 2,168 A teacher, but always an apprentice. | | A teacher, but always an apprentice. Joined: Apr 2002 Posts: 2,168 | Have you ever heard of these? If you haven’t, do some google research into JIS and you might discover why you’ve been stripping Phillips headed screws and such so much. I think I’m going to get a set of vessels. I have done the dreaded stripped bolt head on rotors before. What a PITA.
Last edited by Fox; 10/31/2019 3:51 AM.
| | | | | Joined: Feb 2019 Posts: 4,482 AD Addict & Tinkerer | | AD Addict & Tinkerer Joined: Feb 2019 Posts: 4,482 | Interesting Fox. I just googled it and JIS stands for ”Japanese Industry Standard”. Hopefully we won’t find them on our “Stovebolts”. I do know what you mean about stripping screw heads. Now I know what to look for. https://chapmanmfg.com/blogs/news/phillips-bits-vs-jis-bits-whats-the-differenceThanks Fox!
Phil Moderator, The Engine Shop, Interiors and Project Journals1952 Chevrolet 3100, Three on the Tree, 4:11 torque tube Updated to: ‘59 235 w/hydraulic lifters, 12v w/alternator, HEI, PCV and Power front Disc BrakesProject JournalsStovebolt Gallery Forum | | | | | Joined: Aug 2001 Posts: 3,599 Moderator | | Moderator Joined: Aug 2001 Posts: 3,599 | Good info! I did not know that.
Thanks For Sharing
Don
1967 GMC 9500 Fire Ladder Truck"The Flag Pole"In the Stovebolt Gallery1946 2-Ton grain truck 1946 3/4-ton pickup, 1953 1-ton pickup 1957 1-ton flatbed dually, 1954 Pontiac Straight Eight Of all the things I've lost in my life, I miss my mind the most! | | | | | Joined: Dec 2015 Posts: 2,063 Big Bolt Forum Moderator | | Big Bolt Forum Moderator Joined: Dec 2015 Posts: 2,063 | | | | | | Joined: Nov 2004 Posts: 2,409 Former Workshop Owner | | Former Workshop Owner Joined: Nov 2004 Posts: 2,409 | I have noticed screws with that marking in the past. Now I know what it stands for. I will be buying a set of JIS screwdrivers in the near future.  Thanks for the info. John
~ J Lucas 2006 GMC Envoy 4.2 I6 2023 Ram 2500/Cumins 6.7 I6 2010 Jeep Grand Cherokee (Wife’s) 2002 Silverado 2500 Gas 6.0 1941 Chevy 1/2-Ton 1942 Chevy 1.5-Ton SWBIn the Gallery My Flicker Photos! | | | | | Joined: May 2015 Posts: 11,067 Housekeeping (Moderator) Making a Stovebolt Bed & Paint and Body Shop Forums | | Housekeeping (Moderator) Making a Stovebolt Bed & Paint and Body Shop Forums Joined: May 2015 Posts: 11,067 | So does a JIS screwdriver work in Phillips screws (not cam out like Phillips drivers tend to do)?
Phillips screws and drivers were designed so that it limited the torque applied to keep ham handed assembly workers from stripping threads on the screws.
From the info presented, JIS screws and drivers eliminate the cam-out issue, but it's not clear that a JIS driver will work any better than a Phillips driver in a Phillips screw.
Robertson (square drive), Allen (hex recess), and torx (modified hex) serve the same function (eliminate cam-out) but of course you can't use those on Phillips screws.
Kevin 1951 Chevy 3100 work truckFollow this saga in Project JournalPhotos 1929 Ford pickup restored from the ground up. | 1929 Ford Special Coupe (First car) Busting rust since the mid-60's If you're smart enough to take it apart, you darn well better be smart enough to put it back together. | | | | | Joined: Feb 2019 Posts: 4,482 AD Addict & Tinkerer | | AD Addict & Tinkerer Joined: Feb 2019 Posts: 4,482 | I’ve looked on several sites and they all said the JIS drivers work on Phillips heads. None said they worked any better than a Phillips bit. The reason I found it really interesting is, in the past I’ve ran across many screws heads that I thought to be Phillips screws and a brand new driver didn’t fit tight, so they would strip before getting them tight. I surmised they were cheep Chinese made fasteners but I may have been wrong. I’ll buy some JIS bits and maybe that will solve that problem.
Phil Moderator, The Engine Shop, Interiors and Project Journals1952 Chevrolet 3100, Three on the Tree, 4:11 torque tube Updated to: ‘59 235 w/hydraulic lifters, 12v w/alternator, HEI, PCV and Power front Disc BrakesProject JournalsStovebolt Gallery Forum | | | | | Joined: Apr 2002 Posts: 2,168 A teacher, but always an apprentice. | | A teacher, but always an apprentice. Joined: Apr 2002 Posts: 2,168 | My friend told me about this. He said he will never by a Phillips again. Vessels work both ways, but the Phillips does not. It can’t hurt to try.
I know what’s on my Christmas list now!
Last edited by Fox; 10/31/2019 3:50 AM.
| | | | | Joined: Feb 2004 Posts: 29,803 Kettle Custodian (pot stirrer) | | Kettle Custodian (pot stirrer) Joined: Feb 2004 Posts: 29,803 | There are several "cross point" screw head designs, and none of them interchange exactly.
Phillips
JIS
Posidriv
Reed & Prince
The R&P is especially troublesome, as makers of cheap screwdriver sets included them instead of Phillips. Phillips was a patened design a few years ago, and manufacturers had to pay a royalty to produce their drivers. If a cross point screwdriver has a sharp point and straight-taper flutes, it's a Reed & Prince, and it will destroy a Phillips screw instantly. R&P was used in assembling some types of furniture- - - -never in automotive applications.
"It is better to be silent and be thought a fool than to speak and eliminate all doubt!" - Abraham Lincoln
Cringe and wail in fear, Eloi- - - - -we Morlocks are on the hunt!
There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self. - Ernest Hemingway
Love your enemies and drive 'em nuts!
| | | | | Joined: Nov 2019 Posts: 2 Moderated | | Moderated Joined: Nov 2019 Posts: 2 | Glad to hear our website was helpful! Thanks for posting, there's a lot of confusion (understandably) about JIS vs. Phillips. Side note, we have a company '59 Apache that we restored, you can see the pictures here: https://www.facebook.com/pg/ChapmanMFG/photos/?tab=album&album_id=367021406703893Joel VP @ Chapman MFG
Joel
VP @ Chapman MFG
| | | | | Joined: Dec 2018 Posts: 473 Shop Shark | | Shop Shark Joined: Dec 2018 Posts: 473 | Glad to see another '59 Apache out there. The finished product looks GREAT! All that participated in the different stages of the build have allot to be proud of.
Last edited by Apache1; 11/13/2019 9:34 PM.
| | | | | Joined: Nov 2019 Posts: 2 Moderated | | Moderated Joined: Nov 2019 Posts: 2 | Thanks, it was a labor intensive but fun project! We love the truck, the color combo turns a lot of heads (especially kids) at car shows.
Joel
VP @ Chapman MFG
| | | | | Joined: Nov 1995 Posts: 5,723 24601 | | 24601 Joined: Nov 1995 Posts: 5,723 | Glad to see there is still some real industry/tool and die manufacturing in Connecticut And welcome to Stovebolt.com!
~ John A kid raised on Hotwheels, Matchbox and Tonka cannot be reasonably expected to own only one vehicle as an adult. 1949 Chevrolet 3804In the Legacy Gallery | In the Gallery Forum1973 IH 1310 Dump1963 Kaiser M38A12001 International/AmTran RE3000 "Skoolie"2014 Ford E-350 4x4 (Quigley) | | | | | Joined: Oct 2017 Posts: 54 'Bolter | | 'Bolter Joined: Oct 2017 Posts: 54 | I have a set of Vessel JIS screw drivers and use them on Japanese motorcycle carburator screws, and for that alone they are worth it! Three sizes cover most any need for these screws.
1959 Apache 31
| | | | | Joined: Mar 2010 Posts: 10,280 Renaissance Man | | Renaissance Man Joined: Mar 2010 Posts: 10,280 | Anyone ever use a square bit in a hand drill to drive Phillips deck screws? You would if you ended up at a job site 100 miles from the closest town which is 200 miles from where you can by Phillips bits.
Guess what? They work surprisingly well.
1952 5-window - return to "as built" condition | 1950 3100 with a 235 and a T-5 transmission
| | | | | Joined: Jul 2008 Posts: 326 'Bolter | | 'Bolter Joined: Jul 2008 Posts: 326 | @52Carl;
Some deck screws are "hybrid". They can be driven with both a square drive and/or a Phillips bit. I'm using the deck screws with a Torx drive. Pretty slick.
SimS | | | | | Joined: Mar 2010 Posts: 10,280 Renaissance Man | | Renaissance Man Joined: Mar 2010 Posts: 10,280 | @52Carl;
Some deck screws are "hybrid". They can be driven with both a square drive and/or a Phillips bit. I'm using the deck screws with a Torx drive. Pretty slick.
SimS You got that right about the Torx drive deck screws. The ones I buy come with a nice bit.
1952 5-window - return to "as built" condition | 1950 3100 with a 235 and a T-5 transmission
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