The Stovebolt Site Forums The Parking Lot Big Bolts '58 Viking goes too slow, and revs too fast

I got myself a '58 viking 2 ton last August, and got it rolling this spring. I've read many posts here about the top speed of this truck being 55, and that won't work for me: There's too much highway to go that slow. I need some way to get an overdrive for this truck, and I'm asking you all for some ideas.

I have some caveats for this, though.

1. The rear axle will not change. The GM 2 speed still works, and I need to pull my engine for a rebuild anyway. Unless someone knows of a higher geared 2 speed vacuum differential, I'll keep it as is. No point dropping the rear axle, when the engine can move to accommodate.

2. I'd rather keep the current Muncie 420 transmission. I just poured $600 into rebuilding it, and while my Apache will take it, I really do not relish the thought of a spare transmission taking up very limited space.

3. The transmission has the parking brake on it, so I'll need either a brownie box approach, or a divorced transfer case.

4. The solution should accommodate remote control. The original floor pan is in remarkable shape, and I don't want to mess it up with cutting holes through it. This is a preference, not a requirement.

I hate to railroad you like this, but I like too many of the trucks quirks to be changing them.

Sounds like you already narrowed it down for yourself by deciding not to change rear or transmission.
Do you have a 235 or 261? The 261 would be useful for the little extra power to pull a higher gear.

About all you have left then are taller tires and an auxiliary transmission.
A Spicer 5831 would be a good option, and pick one with an OD ratio to suit. The parking brake needs to be on the back of the last transmission, not between them.

There is something called a "Ranger torque splitter" that offers overdrive before the main transmission, sandwiched between engine and transmission. I don't have any experience with one but I hear they're generally well liked.

leaving the stock rear end and transmission leaves a brownie box as about your only option. I also have a 58 2-ton, original rear and tranny, Mine has a 327 in it. I can roll about 70 down the freeway but the engine is spinning about 4200 RPM. Unfortunately, there is not much magic to going faster, tires need to roll farther per engine RPM, that leaves you 3 options:

1. spin the driveshaft faster (, higher engine RPM, OD tranny, or separate OD box)
2. Change rear end gears
3. Taller tires in rear

If you plan on running 70 mph you need to upgrade the brakes. You won't like the stopping distance required when going that fast, neither will the little car that just pulled in front of you at the upcoming red light!

I run my fire engine and tow truck at 65 mph on the interstate running close to 4k rpm...any faster takes me out of my comfort zone.

Will you be running loaded or empty?

Mike B

You are right, I did narrow it down pretty far, but what I am looking for are specific models, and numbers. I can buy v8 chevy spark plug wires, and get 30 answers-most don't work for me. I was wondering if you would have anything to add.

On that note, the truck was refitted with a mid 70s 350 small block v8, so power isn't an issue... when the engine is rebuilt.

I like the torque splitter idea, since the engine needs to move forward anyway(the heads are too close to the firewall, I can barely take the covers off) but the manual shift is a put off. Got any ideas on a vacuum or electric shift? The Spicer 5831 is probably going to be a bigger pain than solution, but as stated, I did not give myself many options.

My fears of running at 4k for half an hour at a time is the engine suddenly coming unglued, not to mention the terrible gas mileage.

This truck is a workhorse, intended to carry anything too large to fit in a pickup utility bed, and pull a 40ft trailer my dad owns, along with a 4 ton backhoe. The brakes will be upgraded, however I deem that necessary, but currently I think the Hydrovac is seized: the brakes are really stiff, but they work well, even with an 8 ton load.

If you have a two piece driveshaft, that is where a Brownie goes, if you are lucky, you can reuse one shaft if the U-joints are compatable, just shorten one.

Ed

A 350 V8 at 4K is just loafing along- - - -I've built plenty of them that live comfortably at 7K on the round tracks. Just match the camshaft and valve system to the speed you want to run. I'd reccomend a Comp Cams 260H RV cam and springs that will allow operation without valve float up to 6K RPM or so. Use about 9:1 compression and regular gas. The RV cam has a pretty flat torque curve that begins to produce usable torque in the 1800-2K range, and HP that tops out just under 5K. Perfect for hauling heavy loads on long upgrades.
Jerry

My tow truck has a 350 V8 with a 2-barrel carb and it will run 65 mph all day long! With that said my truck only weighs 10,400 pounds and I almost never pull anything. I'm guessing I get about 6-7 mpg.

I also have a 322 Buick Nail Head V8 in my Fire Engine and I've driven it over 30k miles going to shows. It runs very well at about 63 mph turning about 3700 rpm and gets 6.8 mpg. It weighs 14,200 pounds.

Your truck was available from the factory with a V8. Valve covers will be close to the fire wall, tall covers will not work without body wody to the fire wall.

I say wind her up and see what she'll do! BUT before you do that FIX the hydrovac, it adds about 900 additional pounds of stopping force in the brake lines. To test if it's working, on your first engine start of the day, step on the brake pedal and hold it with medium leg pressure, then start the engine...as the engine vacuum increases the pedal should slowly move towards the floor, if it does it's working.

Mike B

Well, the driveshaft is a two piece, that is why I am okay with a divorced box. I figured I could shorten one shaft and make it work. I was going to just rebuild the v8 to stock, but that is a good point, since I'm rebuilding, why not tune it to my needs? My biggest concern about grenading, is that I have no idea what this engine has been through, but after rebuild, it shouldn't be a problem. My main drive towards an overdrive is because gas mileage. I just filled it an hour ago, and it has used 11 gallons, and I'm sure I haven't driven over 12 miles. At this rate, I won't even make it to the next town over. Do these v8s have a direct injection fuel system available?

So, 1.1 MPG? Seriously? Are you sure you're not pumping the gas out on the ground somewhere? That kind of mileage is downright ghastly...

what Paul said .... no way a 350 could use 11 gallons in 12 miles, you must have misjudged how full the tank was to start, even a 454 in a 25,000# bus can get 10 mpg

Bill

maybe 120 miles

My truck has an aftermarket option. It's very own mosquito fogger. Everytime I rev the engine, I can smell my money blowing past me. It is really bad, should I try to get the quadrajet rebuilt, or am I better served buying an edelbrock? I am tight in money now, since my car swamped and seized 2 hours ago, but I'd like a little help in which direction I should go.

I have thought about it, and I really like the torque splitter option; I can kill multiple birds with one stone if I just install one. Does anyone here have any leads? I don't mind used, as long as it isn't abused.

Rebuilding a quadrajet isn't too bad. If you're burning as much gas as you say, I'm surprised it even runs and makes power. Running that rich, you ought to be putting out a nice cloud of smoke behind you. I wonder if there's some sort of leak or missing/damaged jet or something?

Casey, I have what you need. Call me. DaveV 262-903-3880

Personal buying/selling should take place in email or Private Messages.

All I'm seeing there are manual shift boxes. I can't use those with the case passing under the firewall. Anyone know of a variant with a solenoid or vacuum piston?

I don't understand how/why you can't use a manual shift auxiliary. If the lever does not come out where you want it fabricate linkage under the truck so it will come out in a more acceptable place. Or switch to heavy duty push pull cable https://www.midwestcontrol.com/part_family.php?id=3

I suppose you could make an air shifted version but I doubt it would shift as smoothly and kindly (for the transmission) as a lever. Here are some other peoples thoughts about the same.
http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/general-4x4-discussion/619676-ranger-overdrive.html

There have been electric shift shift versions by other manufacturers
http://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/917000-auxillary-transmission-between-bellhousing-and-trans.html

Here is a current electric OD that goes after the transmission I hear mixed reviews for these and the price is quite steep.
https://www.gearvendors.com/

I agree with Grigg, I am looking at the Ranger for my 58 2-ton (Viking 60, same as you have) and don't see any issues with using a manual shifter.

It is mostly personal preference, I will admit. I have a 2 speed rear, and with a mount on the shifter, I can easily change from D-1-LO, to OD-1-LO, to OD-1-HI, without flailing all over the cab, searching for levers.

Upon closer inspection, I realize I have made a massive mistake. By not moving my transmission, the splitter will not be under the floorboard, but in the engine bay(I thought the trans sat about 3-4 inches further back). This, quite frankly, is a better solution than I could hope for. If I get a linear actuator, I can achieve my dreams with only minimal fabrication.

My only remaining concerns are the throw of the lever. Can anyone tell me the approxxommate travel of the lever's upper bolt hole? I found an actuator with a 1.97 inch stroke, is that enough?

The other issue is cost. $1600 is pretty steep, I'm still open to the used market, if one is available.

I tried to send a PM. Didn't go thru. What's the trick. DaveV

The throw is determined on how far from the pivot point you mount the actuator.

Ed

DaveV, Does the site throw an error, or does it simply not post a message? You may be able to get a moderator to look into it for you.

http://www.advanceadapters.com/downloads/RANGER_OD2.pdf This is how far from the pivot I'm going; the outer lever mounting bolt. I am asking if anyone is using these splitters, if they would be willing to measure the travel of the outer hole.