The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area Engine Shop Please tell me I didn't screw this up

I took off the oil pan to rebuild the oil pump in my 41 1 1/2 ton. Put eveything back together. I then took off the distributer to prime the pump. Was i supposed to mark something somewhere when i did that? I now have nightmares that I have done something to screw up the timing and will end up braking something.

Please help

Thanks
Andy

You may have installed the dizzy 180 degrees off, it's kinda hard to mark it and then reinstall in the same place after spinning the pump unless maybe you marked the 'screwdriver' shaft before spinning and then making sure to realign it before disengaging.
At this point I'd just realign the ball in the flywheel with TDC #1 and go from there.

The distributor can be installed 180 degrees out of position, even if the flywheel ball is aligned with the pointer. The ball aligns as #1 cylinder is on the top of the compression stroke, and again one turn of the crankshaft later when #6 is ready to fire. You need to determine which cylinder is compressing and line up the distributor rotor with that plug wire.

Remove the valve cover and watch the valves for the #6 cylinder as you turn the crankshaft clockwise from the front. The last valve in line is the #6 exhaust valve. Watch it open (spring compressing) and closing again. Just as the exhaust valve closes, the next one in line will begin to open. At this point the #1 cylinder is at top dead center of the compression stroke with the plug ready to fire. The flywheel BB should be at, or very near alignment with the pointer in the hole above the starter.

Align the oil pump drive with a long screwdriver, and drop the distributor into the hole so the rotor aligns with the #1 spark plug wire. Turn the distributor housing clockwise until the points close, then turn it CCW until the points just barely open. Lock the distributor housing down at that point, and the timing should be close enough to start the engine. Good luck!
Jerry

Thanks for that addition of the "compression" stroke of the TDC Jerry.
I often have the expectation 'that' is already known or maybe I just like to see if they can work their way past that as well?

Have you ever seen an engine that would only run if one spark plug is removed? It took me about 3 hours to figure that one out!
Jerry

OK I will bite. 1 spark plug removed to run? Closest I have to that was when the rocker arm shaft came loose in the back half only. #6 Exhaust was not opening. Intake was, so every other rotation was a dead stop. I still feel lucky the rod was not bent. It took a bit to figure that one out.

I'm working on memorizing this quote; this procedure works perfect.

I'll bite on the 'engine that would only run with one spark plug removed' as well...
Piston installed upside down? Somehow?

Brad

A neighbor who runs a shade tree tractor shop called me one day to see if I could help him get an engine started after an in-the-frame overhaul. He had installed piston rings and rod bearings, had the cylinder head reworked by a machine shop, etc., on a Dodge Ram 50 (Mitsubishi) 4 cylinder overhead cam engine. It would run for about 5 seconds, backfire, and refuse to even hit again on subsequent attempts at starting it. After 5 minutes or so, it would do the same thing- - -run a few seconds and quit- - - -repeatedly!

I checked ignition timing, compression, even cam timing- - - -all good and right on specification. After about 5 or 6 timing checks, I cranked the engine and it ran- - - -and kept running- - - -but it made some nasty noises because I had left the #1 spark plug out after checking for compression one more time! Put the plug in- - -crank the engine- - -run 5 seconds and quit! I could remove any spark plug, 1,2,3,or 4- - -and it would run! It WOULD NOT keep running with all the plugs installed!

Got any guesses now?
Jerry

Plugged exhaust?

My guess is there was something blocking the intake air...

Am I close?

Mike B

Pretty close- - - -I finally noticed that the exhaust manifold was a big box-shaped item, and I remembered that the primary catalytic converter was in the manifold on some engines. Since the engine was rebuilt for excessive oil consumption, it suddenly became obvious that the honeycomb converter element in the exhaust manifold was plugged up so tight with coked oil the exhaust gas couldn't get out the normal way! By removing a spark plug, the exhaust had somewhere else to go. When we loosened the manifold bolts about 1/4", the engine ran with all the plugs installed.

Since Lincoln County Tennessee doesn't have mandatory exhaust emissions testing, a hammer and a big screwdriver took care of the plugged-up manifold! Problem solved!
Jerry

Hi, Jerry . It sounds like a ignition problem. I will list the problems that I have found working on motorcycles and outboards and sterndrives. When I first got my 1950 Ariel Square. 4, when I came to a stop it would stall or stay at 2500 rpm. I found that the distributor bushings were worn out.( I could change the point gap about .040 pushing back and forth on the distributor shaft, normal point setting .018 ), On a 3L OMC ( Big ford pinto engine) it would run fine then lose power or stop, we found that the roll pin that held the gear on the bottom of the distributer shaft had sheared. On Kawasaki 4 cylinder bikes, (650, 750,900,1000,cc )customers would try to turn the motor over with out removing the spark plugs and shear off the drive pin for the point cam. I would also check the drive pin for the points cam or the trigger if eletronic ign. Have Fun, Brian

I too had a Dodge D50 (Mitsubishi) with a plugged cat converter. It ran with all plugs, but would barely make it up a hill to work. I found the plugged converter and decided to bang it out as you did. Ran great. I could only get a new converter from the dealer. It was big bucks. It was time for emissions test so thought, what the heck. Might as well give it a go. Guess what? It passed and I don't mean by just a little either. It passed easily. So I said screw it. Never did replace it. Looked legal from the outside too.

Dennis

This situation was about 30 years ago, but it taught me a lot about not taking anything for granted when doing engine diagnosis. Plugged/restricted exhaust systems can cause a lot of oddball symptoms that are awfully hard to find!
Jerry

Reminds me of an old 72 or 73 Chevy w/a 305 that had similar problems. It would atleast idle but had no power and was basically undrivable. Ends up the inner exhaust pipe had deteriorated and plugged up the single exhaust. Took more time than I care to share to find that one

Carry on
Dave

I have attempted to reinstall the distributor. Two things are giving me trouble. First, the engine has a PTO, how can I turn it, is the a makeshift tool I can build?
Second, is does not seem to seat right, the arm hovers about an 1/8 of an inch above the block. Please help me out

Thanks

Andy

Drop the cover off the bottom of the bellhousing and turn the engine by using a big screwdriver or the chisel tip of a short shepherd's crook pry bar in the flywheel teeth. You might have to enlist a volunteer to do the turning or observe the valve action- - -hard to be underneath and watch the valves at the same time. The failure of the distributor to drop all the way in means the tab on the distributor shaft isn't engaging the slot on the oil pump drive. Use a screwdriver to rotate the oil pump a little so the dizzy will drop in, but be absolutely sure the #1 cylinder is on TDC compression.
Jerry

To save a little turning, hold your finger over #1 spark plug hole while someone bumps the starter. When you feel air blowing out, that is compression. The timing marks should be coming up pretty quick. Or you can use a push button switch with wires run down to the starter, then you can bump the starter while watching valves and checking for compression. Any momentary on/off switch will work, one lead to the (+) terminal of the battery, the other to the ( s ) terminal on the starter solenoid.

Always double check the valves opening and closing on #6 and #1.
Rotate the oil pump to align the slot for the distributor, most of the time you need to turn it a few degrees farther to compensate for the spiral of the timing gears.

Joe

Can I watch while he uses a remote starter button on a 1941 stomp starter? That would be entertaining!
Jerry

Is lining up the oil pump a crap shoot? Or is there a secret to doing it the first time

You really only get two options.
If you haven't changed the wires on the dizzy from when it was pulled then you can select option 1 or option 6.
2-5 will sit the hand out.

A total crap shoot! Have to move it a smidge at a time until its just right.
Carl

It's all done!! Thanks for the help everyone that chimed it.

I took a 1"X 1" wood stick,about 2-1/2 feet long,and used it as a bump starter,on my '55 261. just place it between the firewall and starter button. when you want to bump the engine,simply pull the bar toward you. Makes valve adjustments and timing a breeze,for 1 person!