The Stovebolt Site Forums The Parking Lot Big Bolts New disk brake kit for 2 ton

I received the long awaited disk brake kit from RDomeck.
workmanship and quality looks very good. Certainly over built.

I expected a possible problem or two since his truck was a '46 and this one is a '48 but that has been minimal so far. The caliper mounting brackets fit perfectly. Mounting the rotor adapters to the hubs had a slight interference with bolt heads getting them into the holes.
Found the 7/16 holes in the hub flange needed to be drilled out to 1/2 to match the mounting bolts. easily fixed.

Rotors and calipers won't be here until Monday and Tuesday, so we'll see how that goes.

I anticipate any big problems will come mounting the brake booster/master/mounting bracket assembly. This truck has a 700R4 and cross member for the trans mount. Take that on tomorrow.

I found two problems in mounting the booster master so far.
As expected, can't mount it as far forward as designed because of the 700R4 transmission. This was expected.

Unexpected - '46 and earlier had the master mounted ahead of the peddle and the pushrod attached to the peddle above the shaft. push the peddle down and the pushrod moves toward the front of the truck.
On the '48-'53? the peddle has the master behind the peddle, facing to the rear and the pushrod attaches below the shaft. This causes the rod to move to the rear when the peddle goes down.
Solution 1 drill a hole in the peddle casting the propper distance above the shaft and put a 46 and earlier rod attaching bracket on.
I'm looking at solution 2 (because I have to change the location anyway) to mount the booster/master assembly in reverse so the pushrod direction is the same as original.

Got the rotors today, perfect fit.

pictures so far
http://s1276.photobucket.com/user/jsdesign2/library/

Nice work !

Hey Jim...lookin' good. Yours is a 2 Ton, right?

Yes. A 1948

Had no trouble finding the rotors, master and booster from the part # Randy supplied.
The calipers were another story. None of the local suppliers could get me a cross reference on the Cardone part numbers.
After some searching I found this:
http://www.kakapart.com/oem/partscrossinterchange/cardone-18b5023.html
Problem solved.

I found the mounting holes on the caliper brackets are about .030" or so off on the spacing.
Not a big deal, a little work with a rat tail though.

One other thing to mention, the mounting studs on the booster (4 for mounting, 2 for the master)are metric.
For you guys that have a 2 hr. round trip to the hardware store, remember to pick up a half dozen 10 x 1.5 mm nuts before you need them and don't have them.

Ran into a problem doing the drivers side.
Passenger side is finished, added pic's to the photobucket.

Worked any issues out on the first side, painted the rest of the parts and assembled the second side.
The rotor wasn't centered in the caliper. Before the bolts were tight the rotor was hard against the top outside of the caliper and just touching the inside of the bottom.

Thought the kit mounting bracket must be bent (sorry Randy) Measured everything and dis assembled. When I put the bracket on a flat plate and measured it was fine.

Oh Sh*t. There is only one other thing that could cause that.
A bent spindle.
Measured it and there it was. Never thought to check that when I rebuilt the axle.

Now I have to find a drivers side spindle to fit a '48 2 ton. Haven't checked the master part list to see what years fit.

Guess it is easier to replace it now than when the truck was done and found the alignment was way out.

Jim,

My 1951 Parts Book says the Steering Knuckles are the same for 2-ton trucks from 1946 to 1949 (1st Design). They have a 1-9/16" bearing diameter. P/N 609735

As a note, the 1949 (2nd Design) to 1959 used a 1-3/4" diameter bearing. Cast number 3697466, P/N 3703565.

Hope this helps,

Mike B

Thanks
I remember that the king pins fit 2 ton and school bus but couldn't remember the years.

Hey Jim...looking good but sorry to hear about the spindle. But as you noted...better to find out now than later.

I noticed your pics of the clearance issue on the bolts for the top hat. Mine appear to hit that little lip when I try to fit them in from the backside too. How did you go about getting yours in?

How bent is yours? I have one I've been using (with hub) as the swivel function on my shop stool and I suppose I could trade for a slightly bent one if it still worked for me.

Grigg

Tango,
First I drilled out the holes so the bolts slipped through
Then I touched the ridge with a 5" angle grinder. That ridge is just a feature from the sand casting,and very uneven. Each bolt head required between 0 and 3/16 touch to slip past.

Grigg

Thanks for the offer.
If the stool was 15" in diameter from center to edge would be 1/4" off.

I think you would have to shim the seat.

I don't think that would bother me, I'll dig it out this weekend.

PM sent.

Aw heck...I just want to see a pic of the stool guys!

PS...still trying to track down a pair of kingpin rebuild kits for the 2 ton axle.

https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/qci8_L1z11ogoiyxQR5l9tMTjNZETYmyPJy0liipFm0?feat=directlink
See if that works.

I had planned to head to the post office first thing this morning but the snow is not cooperating..

Grigg

Kinkpins, what size?
The kit I like is Napa 262-1016 for the GM 1.109" kingpin. This kit is most common and therefore cheap, also has thrust bearings not washer and steel backed bronze bushings, not plastic. It however does not have the freeze plugs as used in older spindles. If you need those look in the kingpin kit book at NAPA and look up the kit you need, several choices for the 1.109" kingpin. List all other kits by size too if you need something different.

Unfortunately I have not found a good price for individual bushings, better off buying a kit at Napa or eBay.

SWEET stool Grigg! --- Any idea where a feller might find kingpin rebuild stuff for the 2 ton axle?

Errr...Never mind, just saw your post above. Many thanks.

Hey Jim --- I noticed the steering stops on your axle appears to be cast...are they? I am missing one and the other looks to be fabbed from heavy, stamped sheetmetal and not in very good shape. Would love to find replacements if they are any better made.

No, they are the original heavy formed steel.
Haven't had to look for others.

On mine, it appears that there was a lot of strain on them. One was sheared completely off and the other banged up pretty bad. The other retaining pin for the kingpin (which also serves as the bolt for the stop) was bent over pretty badly and looked close to letting go. I may fab something different for stops. I'm adding power steering which could slam them even harder.

Received the spindle from Grigg today.
Good to get back on that part of the project. Get down to my bearing supplier tomorrow and get the kingpin bushings and ream them to fit.

Another note for people doing the brake project; my calipers did not come with the banjo bolts, just the copper washers. Some brands do some don't.

This is turning into an unexpected problem. I have 7 auto parts stores within 5 miles of the house (5 different companies).
Went to 3 today and nobody had any to fit. The lookups referenced "not available" or a Dorman # that isn't stocked anymore. Went through the behind the counter trays of universal brake parts and none matched the thread or diameter (both metric and SAE).
Still have hope tomorrow with 2 good sources left.

But just heads up.

Im assuming the caliper goes to this model vehicle listed below http://www.stockwiseauto.com/product_info.php/products_id/740210

have you tried the dealership? I find it hard to believe that no one else would have it

Look in the online Brakequip catalogs. If no dealer near by or even if so you may be able to order from them directly, I have.

I was just amazed I didn't find them at the first 3 stores.
Have a dealer in the same area, but my bet is on O'Rileys or the old NAPA store (went to the new Big NAPA today -I find then generally useless)).

I was just feeling sorry for the guy doing his brakes in the driveway on Sunday and loosing one.

Stopped by 3 other parts stores today. 2 said banjo bolts for those calipers not available.
O'Rileys had the Dorman part in stock.

They are just 3/8-24 banjo bolts. What's with that? Maybe a special length????

Anyway they wouldn't fit. Had tried other 3/8-32 at the parts store, 1/2 turn and bind up. Thread pitch seemed off.

Put some sticky grease on a tap and ran the threads. Now they work great. 2 calipers with bad threads????

Is a common (or in your case uncommon) metric size banjo bolt real close? Some metric threads are almost interchangeable with inch thread/bolt sizes except they aren't.

Actually a 9 x 1.25mm bolt is very close (and Ford was known for using this uncommon size) and that was the size I was expecting when the bolt was so hard to find, but that tap was just a bit loose when I tried it.
Anyway, this is how it's going together.
Hope none of you run into the same problem.

Jim, I will make note of this and supply the kits with the correct bolt. I don't remember having any issues with finding those bolts.... But it has been a couple of years since I put those on!

Hey Jim...were the calipers new or rebuilt? Seems every time I get something that has been rehabbed, there are always minor issues...like threads that are screwed.

Hey Randy ... if you could just post the correct size & thread that would work for me.

Jim...have you started hanging the master & booster yet? Would love to see some pix. I am shopping for a hydraulic booster that will work since diesels (my engine)don't do vacuum and I don' want to rely on a separate pump.

Tango,

Started on that but got distracted by the bent spindle.

Yes the calipers are reman.

3 problems to deal with.
I have an unusual issue that most of you won't have; 700R4 transmission. It is twice as wide as the stock 4 speed and has a cross member added for the rear trans mount.
That creates issues with placement.
Second The 48 has dual exhaust. 2" pipes side by side at about the original height.
Third, Randy's '46 has the rod for the master mounted above the peddle shaft. It pushed forward into the master. That is why he built that great mount assembly that has the master facing forward (like original) and the bell crank behind.

'47 on had the original master mounted behind the peddle and the linkage below the shaft pushing to the rear.

The 11" booster was giving me a lot of trouble finding a place it would fit. Had to be behind the cross member, touching the exhaust etc.
I ordered an 8" dual diaphragm to see how it works. I might even be able to fit a 9" dual.

To use Randy's mount it will have to be flipped over and mounted backwards for the push rod direction to be correct, or drill a hole in the peddle the correct distance above the shaft to mimic the 46 setup.

Still in the thinking stage until the booster gets here.

Sounds adaptable. Like your rig...mine is NOT what the kit was built for so "adjustments" were expected. Just about every part I buy is like that. Watching the counter guys faces is always a trip.

"What make & model?"
1946 Chevy/Wayne school bus
"What engine?"
Cummins 4BT, turbo diesel.
"Standard or auto?"
Allison 6 speed automatic

"Uh...I can't like find it on my computer dude"
Really?

Yea, That Allison takes up some space too.
An interesting point is that it doesn't matter how far back you mount it. Just takes a longer link rod. You '46 would have the same peddle as Randy, just keep sliding it back on the frame until it fits. I will be making a new access plate in the floor to get to the master no matter what.

I used a hydrobooster and MC under the floor of mine. At the time I cut and welded the stock pedal bracket to adapt the hydrobooster. Had I realized it back then it would have been quite simple to leave the stock pedal bracket alone. Them make a bracket and mount it all further back on the frame with a long tubular(stiff) pushrod to reach the pedal.

If you'll have power steering (or even if not) hydroboost is a very nice way to go. Very small and quite strong, makes for great brakes.

Grigg

Hey Grigg --- Roger the hydro set up for brakes & steering. No vac on a diesel and I don't want to rely on an electric pump. Especially for brakes. . And there are some small units these days that should help ease the installation a bit.