The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area The Electrical Bay Taillight, brake, turn signal wiring

I'm wiring my original 6v system on 1950 Chevy 3100 with reproduction taillights and doing toggle switch turn signals.

The problem I'm running into is, the housing has 2 single filament bulbs so I need to run the turn signals and brake through the same wire..

This site is the only one I've found that seems to have a solution, it's suppose to have the turn signal override the brake.
http://www.how-to-build-hotrods.com/turn-signals.html

I got the adapter piece but it doesn't work.
Bypassing the adapter, the brakes and turn signals work independently when hooked up to the lights. With the adapter hooked up though neither the brakes or turn signals work. So it is definitely something with the adapter and my money's on I just received a defective one or its a 12v adapter or something but couldn't find out if voltage mattered with adapter anywhere.

Can you add to that?
What is happening?

Are both rear bulbs dead?
Do the parks work?
Fronts?
Brakes?

Or is it just the signals not working.

On a side note
I would recommend using a 7 wire column clamp switch.

Edited OP:

Bypassing the adapter, the brakes and turn signals work independently when hooked up to the lights. With the adapter hooked up though neither the brakes or turn signals work.

My thought is they sent me a defective adapter more than likely

Interesting site

Not sure how to troubleshoot that board

How did you wire the brakes with that?
Did the wire go straight to the stop switch from the board?

Being that the brakes are a separate circuit I would think that at least they should work .

What adaptor did you get? If it's the one specifically linked to on that web page it states it is a 12v unit. Can you provide a part number and manufacturer of your adaptor?

When you test it, you need to provide loads on the car side of the adapter. That is, connect blinker and brake light bulbs on the car side. If you didn't do that, you should try it. The blinker bulbs would represent the load given by your front blinker lights.

I used one of those trailer adapters for years and I had no problems with it.

Turns out the adapter was defective and wasn't allowing charge to go through. Sent it back and I'll have to see if I can find a better 6v one somewhere or figure out how to wire it up myself with some relays or something.
Does anyone have experience with wiring up your own in this way?

Did some research and think I understand how to run the brakes and turn signals together using 2 S.P.D.T relays.
Here's my example drawn up:
example relay setup

what's wrong with using an aftermarket signal unit? work well, wiring is a no-brainer, and if you don't want it on the column you can mount it elsewhere

Bill

Personal preference, I like the toggle switch over the aftermarket unit. Plus it was mostly wired up for this way when bought it and only have to mess with it due to getting original taillights installed.

If anyone is ever interested it is possible to do it with two relays...

I decided it was best for me to just change the sockets inside my taillights to hold 1 single filament and 1 dual filament bulbs instead of just 2 single filaments. It probably isn't going to look the prettiest but won't be seen and will get the job done.

Doing this also allows me to put a little bit bigger of a bulb in and increase the brightness of my lights in.
My plan is to have the taillights and brakes run on the low/high of the dual filament and then have the turn signals run on the single filament.

Can I hijack this thread for a similar problem instead of creating a new thread? I have a 1953 3100, with a 12v conversion.

I bought an aftermarket switch from one of the big suppliers, 7 wire. It says it's for 6 or 12v. I pulled the bulb out, and it says it's 12v. I also bought the aftermarket flasher relay.

I wired it accordingly. The difference is that my tail lights are a three bulb type. It has a separate stop, running, and turn signal bulb.

The stop lights work, as do the running lights.

When I put power on the flasher relay, with the turn signal positioned OFF, the 4 way flashers start flashing though the light on the turn signal unit itself does not illuminate.

If I switch the turn signal unit to left or right, the flasher turns off, but the respective turn signal does not flash.

I'm thinking that since the other lights work, it's not a ground issue.

What I am concerned about is that the wiring diagrams instruct me to connect the red wire from the turn signal switch to the brake switch. I'm assuming this is to allow the brake light bulb to be used as both a brake light and a turn signal light. But, I have independent bulbs for both. Could this be the issue, and how could I resolve it?

Also, the bulb in the turn signal unit itself never illuminates. I took it out and put it in something else, and physically it works, but not in the unit. Does this pass current to the other signal wires?

Thanks,
Steven

I'm assuming all three bulbs are in the same housing.

Tie two of the bulbs together and use as the brake/turn function.

The pilot light in the switch may not be working because the switch housing is not grounded. Try cleaning some paint off where the housing touches the column

DADS50 has got it. You have a set up(the lights any way) for a 4 wire turn signal like mine. The extra lights are for turn signal only. Just tie them to the brake lights and the 7 wire unit will work just fine. It might flash a bit faster than most but blink they will. Also remember to ground the housing to the column as suggested.

Ok. Worked on this a bit today. I did as suggested:

1. Ground the signal switch: fixed the problem with the indicator light on the switch itself.
2. When you say 'just tie them to the brake lights'....What I took this as to do was to put a jumper wire from the turn signal wire to the stop light wire on both sides. This did not fix the problem. Instead I had a variation of all three bulbs on each side illuminating.

So, still when I switch on the ignition key switch, the flashers immediately start flashing, except it alternates between STOP and RUNNING on the rear. If I pull out the plunger switch to activate the flashers, it operates normally. Placing the turn signal lever in the cab to turn left or right, it stops the flashers, but does nothing else......UNLESS, I turn on the headlights with the right turn signal ON, THEN the front right signal flashes, but not the rear.....

I'm at a loss.

I may have mis read the initial problem


Are you wired something like this

...link...

You see two bulbs are wired together to one wire on each side then run to the signal switch


But it now sounds like your tails are flashing also?

More to the story....

I went out today and wrote out a kind of trouble shooting matrix. It is here...

Turn Signal Info

At this same link is the turn signal wiring diagram. I have wired it exactly. As the stop lights are a three bulb light (stop, turn, running), I connected the turn signal wire to the turn signal.

The wiring harness is from LMC equipped for the turn signal installation, the turn signal a generic from the same vendor. I have confirmed time and again, that the correct wires have been connected.

The trouble shooting matrix might be a little confusing, sorry for that. It appears that:

1. Four way flashers seem the only thing working correctly, except that it is flashing also the brake lights. Normal?
2. Anytime the rear turn signals work the brake lights are on too.
3. All lights seem to work at one time or another, so I can't imagine a grounding issue.

Could the turn signal itself be bad? Do I need some other relay in the mix?

Thanks for anyone willing to take a look.

Steven

No relay needed. I think what you have done is to separate the "Brake" light function from the "Signal" function with the extra tail lights. If I have followed the post correctly. You have 2 brake lights, 2 tail lights, and 2 signal lights. All in the back. Did I get this right? I have the same setup but a different signal stat. Mine has fewer wires than yours and is not integrated. You have the "integrated" signal stat and you do not need the extra lights in the back. For a simple test, remove the wires from the second set of lights. The ones used as signal lights. Wire the brake lights to the signal wires and remove the Brake light wire. Just cover it with tape for the time being. Try the Brake pedal, got brake lights? Power from the brake switch is through the signal stat and you should have brake lights. Turn on the signal for a Right turn. one brake light should blink. Power for that light is through the signal stat and not the brake switch. Step on the brake, one blinks and the other is on steady. Power from the brake switch through the signal stat is to the steady light and power from the signal stat is to the blinking light. Note, the signal stat serves as the link to the brake lights. Not the brake light wire. It is the brake light wire that is causing the issue. When it all works, then if you want, tie the second set of lights to the brake/turn signal wires if you want.

Steve_H, thanks for that. I may have made a mistake as the instructions weren't clear, and my conceptual knowledge isn't so good on this. When the wiring diagram instructed to connect the red wire from the signal stat to the brake light switch, it didn't say to remove the original brake light wire, and so I left them both connected. Maybe that is part of the problem. I was thinking about that last night. I'll try the same set up but remove that wire, do what you suggested and see how it goes. Thanks so much.
Steven

Ok. I connected the red wire to the brake switch, and removed the original wire. The stop lights, obviously, quit flashing as well.

I configured the tail lights a mentioned above, but still the signals don't work.

Is it possible that the turn signal doesn't work? Is there any diagrams or images of the inside of the switch that can help me figure out if anything is wrong?

There is more than one way to skin the rat as it were. Here are some diagrams for different signal stats. From a Jeep site but the same principles apply:
http://cj3b.info/Tech/SignalWiring.html
At the bottom of the page is a link to the "Tech Tip" from this site. And to clarify, the power from the brake switch comes after the switch. I know sounds funny, the switch has to function to tell the signal stat the brake pedal is depressed. So power to the brake switch. Then from the other side power for the brake input on the signal stat. The old brake light wire that used to go from the switch to the brake lights is not hooked to the brake lights any more. It goes to the signal stat and, then goes to the tail lights. The problem is the existing brake light wires running under the truck. Those are the wires I suggested you disconnect for the testing. I don't think the signal stat is bed yet. There is more to troubleshoot before you get to that point. Follow the wires carefully. Use an Ohm meter to confirm all connections are right. Good luck and let us know how you do.

i'll work on it some more.