The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area Paint and Body Shop Consensus on Patch Panel Vendors?

Ok, time to jump in with the rest of yous guys and fix some inner/outer cowls. (Solo - I hope you don't minde, I am using your projects as illustrations here.) The passenger side cowl on my burb likes a lot like wookies floor / firewall / cowl area. The curved part between the inner and outer cowls looks like his K5 fender - I am thinking the previous owner wanted more ventilation so they poked holes in it.

At any rate, the lower outer cowl is pretty solid except for the bottom 3 inches or so, same for the inner cowl. Also the center part of the firewall has been sawn out from the curved section all the way down to the floor access panel. Drivers side floor is shot as well. Drivers side inner and outer cowl are perfect with glossy paint still on all exposed surfaces.

Which vendors have the best panels for replacing the floor / lower firewall area, and curved inter-cowl piece? I want to retain the below the floor battery location but this burb will get an auto tranny so the access panel doesn't need to exist. Should I just replace the entire floor with one piece of sheet metal? Would kinda like to get the recess back on the firewall. What do you all think?

[img]http://www.kinemation.com/Trucks/Images/firewallhole.jpg[/img]

Ken, I tried getting this going once before, it seemed like most were interested in whining and something about farts :confused: I believe that Phat is using bitchin products, they come without any holes and the floorboards are custom including the transmission tunnel (you would have to cut out for the battery hole). I have a NOS left inner cowl that is 100 times better than any repro panel. If you can talk the Metal Man into making repros out of it I will send it to him. My suggestion is to pay him what it is worth, I don't think he is interested in a six pack! I was not happy with the ones that I got from Back to The Forties or Chevy Duty although they will work. The floorboards from Chevy Duty were ok adn the floor braces were great (metalman recomended the braces and he was right) My interest is to keep this a fun hobby, posting a Patch Panel rating system would help us all. ..................g

The post GM refers to
http://www.stovebolt.com/bboard/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=4&t=000511&p=
Unless you have a donor for a firewall, the only replacements I found were the Bitchin hot rod style. Your choice for firewall will dictate the toeboard and perhaps floorboards.
If the inner-to-outer cowl panel is at all salvageable, I think you'll be ahead of the game to save the original. I didn't care for the ChevyDuty replacements.

Ctt. Thanks for getting me back to the original post. I bagged it after a couple of days. I would like to see more of this stuff than the farting dogs and big guys whinning! You did a nice job rating! I am waiting for the better weather so that I can help my brother get this rig ready for sandblasting and primer. Maybe I should build a garage first? ...............g

I figure you'll have to find a donor truck for the center section of the firewall if you want to keep it original. So far I,ve made all my patch panels for my truck. I purchased the inner to outer panel from Jim Carter years ago and it seemed to be to tall when I tried it in place, they may be better now though. I ended up making my own inner to outer panels out of galvanized metal 16 gauge. I've also made outercowl panels just shy of the lead line. I was able to retain the door edge of the original. On the passenger side I salvage the upper portion of the outer cowl from a junk AD and I did purchase the lower portion of the outer cowl panel because I needed the door lip and couldnot fabricate a compound curve that it took. Haven't installed these panels yet so can't say how it fits. Made lower firewall and floor panels and cab mounts, bought two cab corners but haven't installed them yet.

Not sure what I am going to do with the piece that is between the inner and outer panels. It has a dozen 3/8" holes "punched" through it up near the top, looks like swiss cheese ala .38 caliber. I can probably fold the splintered holes shut again from the inside through the fresh air vent/heater attachment opening and then weld from the outside. Inner and outer panels only need a few inches of new metal, I should be able to cobble something together and make it stong / decent looking.

I think I'll buy repop ribbed floor panels to retain as much of the original look as possible and chop the firewall out of the white burb I have to get the compound curve/engine recess back.

Anybody "like" any of the floor patch panels they have bought?

I bought the inner cowel pannels to save some time when I did my truck, I was sorry I did 10 seconds after I started to fit them Junk. The repo is made so there is no compound curvature in it. The original Has compound curves. If I was to make them they would fit BUT they would be expensive. I have learned to save the expensive stuff for the old car people. two parts same name one $25 one $75 the $75 part will not sell no matter how good it is or how bad the other is,

This is the stage I'm at also. I'm still a little unsure about which panels to buy and which to make. Make the inner cowl, the inner to outer cowl, but buy the outer cowl panel? I saw on chuckthetrucks page (great site by the way) that he liked the Chevy Duty outer panels. What exactly is the problem with the other two. Do they provide at least a decent starting point? Also, MetalMan what panels do you offer? I'd probably be interested, I don't mind paying for quality. Thanks.

I also used the outer cowel panel (deluxe) from Chevy duty and found it fit well and is worth the money, the others do not cover as much and the bends are not as sharp as they should be. the inner to outer and the inner whould be a starting point but for what the retail price is they should be finished parts not starting points.
The oldcarkook was nice enough to put a web page up for me in his site as I am not that good at that sort of thing. If you went to oldgmctrucks.com then clicked on the splash apron you could take a 'shop tour'
I make the following, inner door bottoms 37-55
inner cab corner 47-55
rear fender (runningboard area) patch panel 47-55
Side mount spare kit 53
Cab back panel (conects outer cab corners) 47-55
Splash apron 49-53 GMC
Rear fender center or crowm brace 47-55
and most of the work we do are one of a kind sheet metal restorations Thanks Ray

Tucker, they provide a starting point and I made 'em work, but I wouldn't call it decent. The inner cowl's biggest problem is the fit at the floor/toe junction. The inner-to-outer was too tall, too wide, and too narrow. Some banging, bending, and grinding got it in, but it sure ain't pretty. Can't tell when it's all together though.
The old saw about carpenters applies to my body work:
"A little putty, a little paint, makes a carpenter what he ain't."

Chuck- So you would suggest fabbing these pieces? I am a sheetmetal worker by trade, so maybe I ought to at least try. I make mostly ductwork and architectural components, I've never tried bodywork. Maybe its time I tried. Thanks.

After seeing what Chuck had to do to get some of those panels to fit I can understand the frustration a lot of people have with some panels.A few of them do leave a lot to be desired.
But also remember these trucks were pretty much hand built in the days before computer controlled laser cutters and robots.I've got a photo of the AD cabs being assembled and it was really nothing more than some jigs with a worker hand fitting the panels.There was probably a lot of trimming,tweaking,and cheating in the assembly,especially with the foreman breathing down your neck "To Get 'Em Out Of Here". If you look at old cab assembly blueprints you'll find a lot of tolerances in the 1/8 to 3/16 range. Go either way and you're talking almost 1/2" combined plus or minus. Throw in 50 years of bad roads, rust,abuse,and misalignment and it would be impossible to make a panel that fits every truck like a charm.
I'm not saying that there isn't a lot of room for improvement,but to expect a Made in Taiwan panel that was copied off of one truck to fit exactly perfect on every truck out there is never going to happen.

Brjr51 that's a poor excuse some of this stuff is not even close and the parts orininaly where stamped from dies made to a print that had to be a lot closer than 1/2"

I wasn't trying to excuse some of these panels. I know some are really bad, I've seen first hand what Chuck had to deal with. I just brought up the point that to buy a panel and expect it to fit like a charm is asking an awful lot. Back in the 70's when I started working at Caterpillar Tractor, the majority of the factory was still entrenched in 40's and 50's technology. Myself and another employee used to assemble the blades for the D9 tractors. Granted this was heavy steel,3/4 to 1 inch plate in most cases, but they were all cut out on those old tracer burners and formed on manually operated brakes and presses.We use to spend more time getting those supposed identical pieces together than actually welding up the blade.The most used tools were a torch,16 lb. sledge,and lots of wedges.Still ended up with lots of gaps,alot of times at least 1/2 inch to fill. Turn up the wire speed on that 3/32 dual shield and fill em up. I've often wondered how some of those blades held up.Of course the whole time the foreman was on you wondering why that blade was takin so long.

Ken , I can cut a nice firewall outta one of my cabs for ya .Email me if interested.