The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area Driveline 59 apache 4speed conv

Hey everyone, first time posting on this forum. I just picked up my 1959 apache 3100 last week, it's all original except it has a 1970 350/th350 swapped in. I want to convert it to a 4 speed but I'm not sure what the best trans for this swap would be. Also trying to find a diagram or pictures of how the clutch pedal/linkage would get hooked up since mine has all been removed. Any thoughts??? Thanks

I just did the same thing to my 58 GMC. You'll need to find a bellhousing from a V8 version, I believe 56 up to about late 60's someone will correct me here. Then you'll need the flywheel from the same source. I'm using flywheel and 11" clutch for a 67 Chevy. The clutch linkage can be had from classic parts and lmc. I've replaced all my linkage and have usable spares if you need them, just let me know.

Was your truck originally a 3 spd truck or was it one of the hydamatic trucks. If it was the 3spd truck it will already have the clutch pedal parts in the cab.

I'm coming down home stretch with mine now and hope to have it running soon. This is a conversion I've done several times, but 30 years ago. I can't wait to hit the road with mine so good luck with yours. Larry

Well I thought it was a 3 speed manual but now I'm not so sure what trans was in it. I can't find any of the factory clutch linkage or where it would even mount

all the manual stuff will have been scrapped, including likely the rear engine mounts [on manual bell housing] and cross member, the clutch stuff is really part of the bell housing .... a 3100 would most commonly have had a column shift 3 speed, and you might find 2 screw holes on the column where the column shift lever mounted, just below the wheel

your best bet will be to get shop manuals [need the 55 manual with 58/9 supplements] [online here], and the 55-59 assembly manual to see what all is missing

you'll need the correct bell housing for the engine [235 or 283?], a complete clutch pack, all the clutch linkage pieces including a pedal, and some shift linkage to suit the particular trans, a modern 4 speed will need to be floor shifted and that'd need to be modified to deal with the bench seat ... might be way easier to go for a 700R4 automatic 4 speed w/ overdrive 4th

Bill

I definitely don't want an automatic trans, I actually might have found a sm420 and bell housing from a 70 c10. Figure that will be the best way to go

depends on what engine you have in the 59 and what engine the bell house is off of, they're not all directly interchangeable, but the '70 trans would be better than an older one

Bill

the 1970 trans is likely the sm465... the sm420 predecessor.

I won't say it can't be done, but ... You have your work cut out for you! I steer away from trucks that have the 350/TH350 swap. You never know what was cut out of them to make it work. As mentioned previously, you will be missing a crossmember. If you have decent metal fabrication skills, this won't be much of a problem. You might be better off flipping this truck and getting one with a 4 speed, or 5 speed, or 3 speed with OD...

Part of the fun is building them. I just don't enjoy fixing previous owners eff-ups.

Don't some of the 4 spds out of chevy cars, Camaro, chevelle etc, have rear mounts on them. I don't think the no clutch pedal inside the cab would be that big a problem. Hell back in the 70's I had a 59 elcomino with a 389 GTO motor with a 4 spd in it. It was a tight fit so I used another brake master cylinder on a slave cylinder to activate the clutch. I wouldn't give up on that truck just for that reason, especially if it had a decent body on it. I'm like you, I don't like automatics either.

Also if it has a 350 in it now more than likely it is side mounted and making a trans mount for the back of the transmission shouldn't be a big deal. Larry

If it has the motor mounts on the front of the engine and are going to use a transmission mount on the tail I'd recommend putting side mounts on the engine.

..... would a 5 speed T5 transmission work ? Tons of info on them on this site.

The guy who has the trans from the 70 says it's not a 465. The 350 that's in my 59 is a 1970, so that bell housing should work fine I would think. As for the motor mounts... The truck is a 350/th350, it has the front mounts on the engine and rear mount on the tail of the trans. The 4 spd will be shorter and is cast iron unlike the th350 so I don't see why I couldn't mount the 4 spd the same way. It's a stronger case then the auto

Also the guy I got the truck from said the swap was done in the 70's so if the mounts held up this long I would think it'll be ok...

I'm not saying that it won't work using the front mounts on the engine and then a mount on the transmission tailshaft. The way the engine was originally mounted the bellhousing mounts tied the frame together and offered support to the frame. In my opinion that span without something is asking for trouble.

you can't mount the 4 speed the same as the automatic because the manual trans bell housing uses the crossmember mounts and the 4 speed doesn't have any tail mount, it hangs off the bell housing .... if the cross member was removed [usual for the conversion], you'll need to replace it regardless whether you use the front or side engine mounts .... if the 350 has the front bird legs and they're not bent, then the truck wasn't ever used hard, the distance between the bird leg mounts and the automatic tail mount is waaay to long to withstand much stressing, especially with a manual/clutch setup [car 3 speeds have a tail mount]

Bill

What are my options for side motor mounts? Are there kits available for that?

http://www.classicparts.com/Trk2Flip/index.html

Try this mount. Its what I used. Page 79 part # 79-405. Larry

Would that just use the regular small block side rubber mounts then?

all the vendors have an adapter cross-bar for small block side mounts - pics here, including the standard rubber mount [available from your local parts store], only problem with it is it makes working under there a problem sometimes - you might also find the conversion trans cross member shown has been added to your truck

Bill

Yes it does and like red58 says, it can be had at lots of places Jim Carters, Classic Parts, LMC etc.Larry