The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area Engine Shop Vintage Water Injection

I bought a vintage Vanderpoel Water injection.

Is anybody familar with that?

I saw a device called Oct-a-gen wich looks similar.
I belive it goes above or under the carb.
How does it meter the amount of water?

[img]http://i10.ebayimg.com/05/i/000/96/5a/62bc_1.JPG[/img]

Thanks, Frank

This unit appears to mount on the air horn.

Should be a small hole of a metered size that allows the water to be drawn out of it by the lower pressure area in the venturi.

Cool find.

Back in the mid 70's, I made one by copying what was available at the local speed shop. All the popular water injection systems at that time used a reservoir with a small electric pump ( I used a windshield washer pump from a F#$d ). The system required a triggering device so that you were only using it when there was a load. I used a vacuum switch that triggered at 5" Hg. I also used an adjustable metering device ( from a fish tank ).
That Rube Goldberg system worked like jack the bear, I was able to run regular gas in a 10.25:1 350hp 396 with the timing set aggressively, without any knocking or pinging. I even carried a camper, so engine was loaded on the hills. It was a great system, but my new engine is 9:1 and I don't need the extra protection and the hassle of extra maintenance. You don't want that system to fail, or it is bye bye engine!
Bob

Cool Find!

I've seen them for aircraft but never for trucks. Be sure to keep your water from freezing in the winter. Aircraft used alcohol mixed with the water to lower the freezing point.

I took it appart and it much more sophisticated than I thougt. It has a float and a needle valve, a ventury with 2 jets, and a emulsifying rod and it works much like a verry simple carb. You can set the amount of fluid and when (at what vacuum) it starts to chime in.

In one of my old "Speed Secrets" Hotrod books from the 50s I found a identical device that was called OCTA-GEN. It was sold by J.C. Whitney for $25 and it was solid brass. You use it with a 50/50 mix of water and alcohol.

WOW $25! That was a lot of money back then.

On the next page of my book they show you how to build an water injection with an old fruit jar an some hoses.

Frank

we used to use a pop bottle and vacume line with a fishtank air valve to adjust the water flow the engine vacume would suck the water into a vacume port it kept the carbin off the pistions dont know if it worked wonders or not i was thinking of hooking one up on my geo.

I've been wondering about this system for years. Basic physics suggests that it could well make a difference. If you mix water with your air/fuel mixture the water should absorb some of the heat from the air/fuel, giving you a denser mixture, and, consequently, more power. The cooler mixture should also reduce the effects of high compression ratios or low octane fuel.

Next, when the air fuel mixture ignites in the cylinder the water will vaporize, increasing in volume, which should increase cylinder pressure, giving more power. The vaporized water, as steam, should have some cleaning effect from the combustion chamber on out.

On the other hand, if this system actually did make a noticeable difference, why don't we see them in use now?

Maybe my knowledge of physics is faulty.

They are in use. Formula 1 Racing cars used them till the regulations don`t alowwed Turbos anymore.

Rally cars still have them. Edelbrock makes one and many other companys.

If and how thay work? YES!
Check this out: http://www.turbotuning.net/Artikel/naca-wr-e-264.pdf

Frank

They were used for many years in jet engines to improve takeoff performance. My personal experience goes back to when I was flying the 747-200 with the Pratt and Whitney engines. We carried 7000 lbs of distilled water for a maximum gross weight takeoff. After takeoff, we would dump the remaining water because the weight of the water would reduce performance and there was no way to prevent it from freezing.
I pulled the heads on my 396 after running the water injection system for 10 years and the cylinders were beautifully clean, mind you I also run synthetic oil and that also helps to keep an engine cleaner.
I think the biggest reason for this systems lack of popularity, is the fact that if you run out of water in a high load situation, the engine could be destroyed by detonation. The car manufacturers have to think in terms of the fact that there are people who still don't think you have to check the oil until the red light illuminates.
Bob

Water injection works fine on a 235, it does help the h.p. output of any engine. When water turns to steam at 212 degrees it increases volume by 1,700 times, and this added to normal combustion gives a good boost. It also allows higher compression without detonation, and keeps carbon from forming on the piston tops.