The Stovebolt Site Forums The Shop Area General Truck Talk 47 - 54 rear end width

Hoping someone can take a moment and measure the stock width (outside drum to outside drum) of a stock 47-54 3100 rear end. Mine is obviously not stock and measures 65". I've searched every possible site and only find conflicting information .... 59.5", 60 - 62", 62.25". Hoping someone can ease my mind.
Thanks.

I'm not going to pull the wheels for drum-to-drum measurement, but I just crawled under my 'burb and measured about 57" between backing plates.

I thought it was 62". Why do you want to know?

I'd like to install a 5-lug drum rear end it that is as as close to stock as possible. Again, I've read so many different ideas and opinions my newbie head is spinning. I realize almost anything can be made to fit but since I don't have a rear end in my possession that will work, my plan was with the stock measurement I figure I can make a sound decision off of that. My goal is a truck that looks stock with standard rims and tires.
Thx.

Here is some information you might be able to use.

Suspension Measurements
Information provided by:
Joe Garcia
The Resto Rod Shop
REAR SUSPENSION:
The following is a general list of rear ends and their dimensions to help narrow the search for a possible candidate to replace the torque tube rear end or just get a better set of gears for highway driving.
Advance Design Trucks seem to be using rear ends with widths ranging from 58"- 62". I'm not sure of the Task Force width ranges at this time.
Contributing information were Bob Welch, J Forbes and various locations throughout the Web and Automotive Magazines.
Rear Axle Measurements
MEASURED ACROSS WHEEL MOUNTING SURFACE
56 1/2" 71-77 Ford Maverick 8",
57" 71-74 V-8 Mavericks 8", All '75-77 6's & 8's Maverick 5 Lug 8", 49-51 Ford, 57-59 Ford 9"
57 1/4" 64 1/2 - 65 Mustang
58" 78-88 Mid sized GM Car, Malibu/Monte Carlo (82 up Metric Studs), 80 Granada & Lincoln Versailles,
67-70 Mustang/Cougar/Fairlane, Regal with 10 bolt axle, S-10 P.U., 65-67 Nova
58 1/2 " Ford Grenada
59" 68-83 Corvette
60" 55-64 Chevy Car, 67-69 Camaro, 64-67 Chevelle, 68-74 Nova, 71-73 Mustang/Cougar, 84-95 Corvette
60-61" 64-69 1/2 ton 2wd Chevy/ Some GMC 6 lug rear end 12 bolt Coil spring set up Possible gear ratio's 3.70
62" 64-77 Chevelle, 73-76 Torino, 89 Trans Am,
70 2wd 6 lug rear end 12 bolt Possible gear ratio's 3:08, 3:40, 3:73
70-81 4wd 6 lug reared ...............................................................
71- Newer 2wd trucks use a 5 on 5 lug pattern
71-76 Full Size Cars " "" "" "
60" 60's GMC and some Chevy's Dana 44 or Dana 60 with leaf springs 6 lug, Gear ratio's 3.21 to 3.92. GMC V-6 used a 3.21 Dana 44 used a standard chevy 1310 yoke, Dana 60 used the heavy duty yoke which takes the larger 1350 yoke.
Approximate rear end widths measured from backing plate to backing plate.
Add Width to compensate for drums as follows:
4" - 5" for small cars 5" - 6" for intermediate cars 6" - 8" for large cars
48" - 49" 50" - 51" 52" - 53"
'71 Colt
'72 Cricket
'72-75 Datsun Pickup
'72-73 Mazda '65 Ram American
'74 Valiant '28-40 Ford , '57 - 59 Ford
'62 Buick Skylark, '67 Chevrolet Six
'67 Mustang Six , '68 AMX
'69 Javelin Six , '70 dodge
'70 Duster , '71-77 Maverick
'71 Comet , '71- 72 Pinto
54" -55" 56" -57" 58" - 59"
'39 -48 Chevrolet, '68 GTO
'41 -48 Ford, '68-72 Chevelle
'55 -57 Chevrolet, 68-69 Fair lane 6 or 8
'66 Falcon, '69 Chevrolet
'67 Mustang V-8, '69 Firebird
'69 Cougar, '71 -73 Nova
'73 Ventura, '73 Mustang '36 Plymouth, '54-56 Ford Pickup
'67 Lincoln, '69 Dodge
'69 Dodge Van, '71 Torino
'72 Cougar, '74 Pontiac '49 Plymouth, '61 Chevrolet Impala
'65 Cadillac, '66 Buick Wildcat
'66-67 Chevrolet Big Car, '72 Charger
'69 Oldsmobile 88, '72 Chrysler
'72-73 Torino
STOCK CENTER TO CENTER SPRING PERCH DISTANCE
25" 39" 42" 42 �"
'68 - 72 Chevelle '71 Colt
'73 Mazda '68 -71 Fairlane/Torino
'49-51 Ford '69 Chevrolet
'69 Nova
'71 - 72 Pinto
'73 Ventura
43" 43 �" 44" 46 �"
'65 Ram American
'64 1/2-'65 Mustang
'67 Mustang
'70's Ford Grenada
'69 Firebird
'70 Dodge '71-77 Maverick
'70 Duster
'70 Nova
'71 Comet
'72 Dart
'72 Cougar
'74 Valiant '57 Ford
'67 Chevrolet Six
'68 AMX
'69 Javelin Six '69 Dodge
47 �" 48" 51" 57 �"
'39 -48 Chevrolet
'67 Chevrolet big car
'72 Charger
'72 Chrysler '69 Dodge Van '69 Ford Van '67 Lincoln

Original Vehicles
Rear Suspension Width (Flange to Flange)
Year Classic Vehicles Width
26-39 Plymouth-Dodge car/pick up 56-58"
40-52 Plymouth-Dodge car 60-62"
29-39 Chrysler / DeSoto Car 60"
Most Early Mopar's 56-62"
25-39 Chevy Car 56-58"
26-46 Chevy Truck 58-58"
40-48 Chevy Car 58-60"
49-54 Chevy Car 58-60"
47-54 & 55 1st Series Chevy Truck 60-62"
Most Early Buick, Olds, Pontiac 58-61"
28-31 Ford Car / Pickup 57 �"
32 & 33-34 Ford Car / Pickup 56 �"
34-48 Ford Car 57-60"
35-41 Ford Pickup 56-60"
49-58 Ford Car 57-58"
49-56 Mercury 57-58"
49-51 Mercury 61"
64 Falcon 58"
67 Cougar 60"
55-59 Chevy Pickup 62"
Donor Vehicles Front and Rear
Suspension Width (Flange to Flange)
Year Classic Vehicles Width Front Width Rear
74-79 Ford Mustang II/Pinto & Mercury Capri/Bobcat 55 �" 55 �"
71-77 Ford Maverick with 8" axle 56 �"
75-80 Ford Granada with 8" axle 57 �"
64-66 Mustang 57"
67-71 Mustang 59"
72-73 Mustang 60"
67-69 & 60" Camaro 60"
64-67 Chevelle 60"
55-64 Chevy car 60"
65-67 Nova 58"
68-72 Nova 60" 60"
78 & up Monte Carlo, Regal, etc. with 10 bolt axle 58" 58"
68-72 Chevelle with 10 bolt axle 61 �"
89 Trans AM (Disc brake) 62"
76-80 Camaro / Firebird 61 �" 60 �"
68-83 Corvette 58 �" 59 �"
84-95 Corvette 59 �" 60 �"
Early 70's "A" body (Dart/Duster) with V8&3/4 axle 58"
"E" Body (Cuda) with V8&3/4 axle 58"
Dodge Dart 59" 55 �"
Plymouth Volare & Dodge Aspen 61" 60 �"
71 Blazer (6 lug) 63 �"
75-78 Granada 9" (43" perch to perch) 52 �"
75-78 Maverick 9" (43" perch to perch) 56 �"
81-87 Olds Cutlass 58 �"
________________________________________
FRONT SUSPENSION INFORMATION
Track Width of Popular Donor Car Clips
Manufacture Model Years Track Front/Rear Curb Weight
Chevrolet Nova 68-74 59.8-59.6 3,770
Buick Apollo 68-74 59.1-58.8 3,760
Pontiac GTO 68-74 59.9-59.6 3,880
Chevrolet Corvette 68-83 58.7-59.5 3,655
84-95 59.6-60.4 3,890
Chevrolet Camaro (Z28) 76-80 61.3-60.5 3,820
Pontiac Firebird (TA) 76-80 61.3-60.5 3,900
Ford Mustang II 74-79 55.6-55.8 3,305
Pinto 74-79 55.6-55.8 3,305
Mercury Capri 74-79 55.6-55.8 3,305
Bobcat 74-79 55.6-55.8 3,305
Chevrolet Monte Carlo 78-86 58.5-58.8 3,235
Buick Century 78-86 59.0-58.8 3,700
Pontiac Grand Prix 78-86 58.9-59.0 3,735
Plymouth Volare 75-79 61.0-60.5 3,395
Dodge Aspen 75-79 61.0-60.5 3,395
Dodge Dart 76 59.2-55.6 3,600

The most popular rear end around is no doubt the Ford 9 inch unit, it is used by restorers, street rodders and racers alike, regardless of what brand of car the axle is going in. Many custom made axle housings for the GM boys utilize the 9 inch Ford, even though they hate to admit it. Ford used the axle from around the 1957 model year right up until the early 1980�s in cars and trucks. It was not the only axle used, but was by far one of the best. Variations by Ford exist in the size of the outer axle bearings in the housings and carriers both, as well as with the spline count on the axle shafts. Generally most cars received the small axle bearings and 28 spline axle shafts. Exceptions to this were the ultra Hi performance Boss 302�s, Boss 429�s, 427�s, 428 CJ/SCJ and the 429 cars which received the 31 spline carriers and axle shafts. Some of the heavier cars like the Galaxies,later Tbirds and mid 70's Torinos also received the larger wheel bearing housings.The trucks varied more, early half ton trucks got the 28 spline axles and carriers, while sometime in the early 70�s the switch was made to mostly 31 spline axles and carriers for trucks while some vans remained 28 spline. Most of the later trucks also received the larger axle bearings housings.One exception to this was the Bronco�s from 1966 to 1977, they stayed with the 28 spline units and in mainly small bearing housings, although some of the later 74-77 it seems started getting the heavier axle housing with large bearings. A small bearing housing can be differentiated from a large bearing housing by the size of the nuts and thread used to retain the brake backing plates to the housing, the small bearing housings use 9/16 socket size nuts with 3/8� fine thread, while the larger bearing use 3/4� socket size and 1/2� fine thread. Gross Vehicle Weight ( GVW ) would determine which axle housing many cars and trucks received.(*Note-See New bearing information under Housing Section Below-updated 12/04)
Because many one half ton trucks continued to utilize the 9 inch (both 2 wheel & 4 wheel drives) right up until about 1982 these housings are by far the most abundant(*Note:Some 1/2 ton Vans and Trucks used the 9 inch right up until about 1985/86 or so in limited quantities*), and with many 1973 to 1979 pickups to still be found on the road and in junk yards,these are very plentiful. And since the �Limited slip� or Locking rear end (often referred to as a �POSI�) came to be a popular option starting in the early 1970�s, many of the units found today at car swap meets and shows are the units pulled from trucks with the 31 spline carriers with the �Traction Loc� style posi unit. The actual car posi units which were primarily 28 spline carriers can be much more difficult to locate since the supply is limited to the few cars and early Broncos (and some early trucks) which received them.When it comes down to actual shafts as well, since the truck lug pattern in most cases differed from the car, and due to the bearing size differences, 28 spline car axle shafts are much more abundant than car 31 spline axle shafts, and often aftermarket shafts have to be purchased if one wants to use a truck 31 spline carrier in a car.
The carrier case I see frequently is the C7AW-E, it is the one commonly found in the trucks,vans and cars throughout the late 60's and the 1970's, right up until around 1985 in some truck applications. I am not sure if this �E� version of the case came into use in 1967 or in subsequent years, but it is by far the most abundant case being used in both full size Ford cars and trucks throughout the 1970�s. I have heard that it has a higher nodular iron content and better casting than the earlier single ribbed cases it replaced and that is why it remained in use so long, and the double ribbed N case was no longer needed for passenger car/truck applications (this also coincided with the demise of most performance engine options in the 70�s)- I have never seen this substantiated however. Most carriers I have seen for sale at swap meets/ car shows are this C7AW-E case which leads me to believe they were pulled from trucks and cars from the 1970�s.
Axle housings as noted in the examples below also evolved over the years, the earlier housings used in cars from 1957 to mid 1960�s tended to be the weakest and had abrupt ending butt welded carrier centers to tubes and a smooth backside. Later housings appeared in 1966 with the familiar �Hump� in the backside middle and stronger tubes.The later truck housings received even beefier center carrier housings and tubes and this style of center carrier housing is best suited for drag cars or narrowed rear ends in my opinion due to the added strength in the middle (have heard it referred to as the "Banjo style"). In general the early housings are ok for the average street performance cars. The popular early swap being the 57 to 59 Ford for the 65/66 Mustang - this will also be the narrowest stock Ford 9" application (about 52" housing flange to flange).I haven�t completed an axle housing width chart yet, but here is what I can tell you about some that I have seen, they often group Mustangs and Fairlane axle housings together as often it is true they are the same width, but I can tell you for a fact, the distance between spring perches is different between Mustangs and Fairlanes.Spring perches must be cut and re-welded inorder for the swap to be performed. The �rough" widths I keep in mind for Mustangs are the following: 52� for 1965 to 1966 (the same width as 64-65 Falcons and 62 to 65 Fairlanes)(as in the Mustang line, most however never received a factory 9 inch), 54� for 1967 to 1970 (same as 66 to 69 Fairlane,Torino,Comet & Cyclone non station wagons)*cars with 351 and up engines received 9 inch units-as did some 302 4V cars-(mainly GT's in 68 with optional gear ratios)* and 56� for the 1971 to 1973 Mustangs/Cougars- (cars with 351 engines and up receiving the 9� housings).Keep in mind as mentioned, the Fairlane spring perch distances were not the same as the Mustang. All the Galaxies I have seen from throughout the 1960�s used the 9 inch rear, regardless of engine size.
The 82-newer Camaros are wider than the older ones, so you should stick with the 70-81 models. The 75-79 Nova uses the same rear as these older Camaros, I believe. The 68-74 Nova chassis is the same as a 67-69 Camaro; the 75-79 Nova chassis is the same as the 70-81 Camaro. The 82-newer Camaros used the small 7.5" rear-end design that the 78-newer Malibu/Monte Carlo/regal/cutlass etc used, but it's quite a bit wider. Some of the 82-newer Camaros used different rear ends, such as the Dana 44, and some weird Australian rear-end. Of course, if you want to make sure, get out your tape measure and check yourself! I may be wrong.
Here's another one from Jim on the subject---- There are lots of rear ends available! Some fit better than others. For 6 lug rear ends, the 64-69 1/2 ton 2wd Chevy (and some GMC) trucks have a 12 bolt rear, about 60-61" wide (I measure them where the wheels bolt on). The 70 2wd and 70-81 4wd have a 6 lug 12 bolt that is a couple inches wider, but will fit under an Advanced Design or Task Force truck as long as you don't get too wild with wheel/tire width. The heavy duty models have a 2.75’’ brake shoe, that’s stopping power. The 12 bolt truck rear ends from the 60s usually had 3.70 gears, which is a bit much for extended highway driving at 75 mph. You can swap the differential carrier and ring/pinion gears from a later TRUCK or VAN 12 bolt, the 70s trucks usually had 3.08 or 3.40 gears. Of course, you'll need to know how to set up ring/pinion gears, bearing preload, and all that other neat stuff to do this. These 60s truck 12 bolt rear ends are from coil spring trucks, so the perches are in the wrong place, and they have some extra stuff on the housing for a panhard bar, which you won't need with leaf springs. Most 60s GMC trucks, and some Chevys, had Dana 44 or Dana 60 rear ends, and leaf springs. These rear ends are 6 lug, about 60" wide, and will bolt into a Task Force truck (with some fudging, the perches are about 1/2" too far apart). The brakes use different parking brake cables, which is a problem, and the drums have a different offset. Gear ratios range from 3.21 to 3.92 normally, the 3.21 is found behind some GMC V-6 engines, and is a nice ratio for an old truck. The Dana 44 uses a standard Chevy 1310 yoke, but the Dana 60 uses a heavy duty yoke, which takes a larger 1350 series ujoint. A similar Dana 40 rear-end was available as an option in 59 Chevy trucks, equipped with positraction...rare, and with a 3.92 ratio. I have one of these rear ends; it was in my extended cab truck...I'm saving it for when I build a race truck (one of these years).
The 71 and newer 2wd trucks use a 5 lug 5" bolt pattern, same as the 71-76 full size cars. There is not much available in the way of matching front brake rotors that will fit an old truck, so this rear-end is not too popular a swap, unless you get the 70-up 4wd 6 lug axles. Chevy also used 10 or 12 bolt rear ends in lots of cars, in varying widths. The heavy duty models have a 2.75’’ brake shoe. A common one is the 61" wide 70s vintage Camaro/Chevelle/Nova (and clones) 8.5" rear-end. In Camaros/Novas it has leaf springs, but the perches won't work with old truck springs. In Chevelles, it has coil springs, with lots of extra brackets to cut off, and the cast in mounting "eyes" on top, where the upper control arm bushings fit. Wheel bolt pattern is 4.75", and there are front disk brake kits available to match, or you can use the 53-54 car front hubs/drums on the original 50s truck brakes, to get the same bolt pattern front/rear. This is a good rear-end for using in an old truck, the ratios are commonly 2.73-3.36, with higher gears available. The axle shafts are usually worn out in these things, so check them (pull the cover, lockpin, and C clips out to get them loose) where they ride in the wheel bearings...before buying the rear-end! The 55-57 Chevy car rear-end is almost a bolt in, the perches need to be relocated to the top of the housing though. It has the 4.75" bolt pattern, and ratios are usually 3.55-3.73, but sometimes you'll find a 3.36. The 78-88 mid size GM cars use a 7.5" 10 bolt, which is about 58/5" wide. This rear-end would work well in an early (older than 47) truck, but it is quite light duty. Ratios are usually 2.29-3.23, which means you want some torque in the engine to pull it...but rpm will be low. This is a coil spring rear-end, with all the mounting brackets that need to be cut off. The Ford 8" and 9" rear ends come in a whole bunch of varieties, and only a few are useful in oletrucks. The late 50s full size cars have a nice one, but it's not easy to find brake hardware, drum, etc anymore. The mid 60s midsize cars, such as the Fairlane, have a rear-end that is about the right width, and would be a good candidate...if you can find one. The Maverick/Granada is very narrow, about 56.5", and would not fit anything but a very early truck, or perhaps a tubbed Pro Street truck. The 60s full size Ford car rear ends are usually too wide, but if you find one, measure it and see! Most earlier full size, and all mid size, cars use the 4.5" bolt pattern, while later full size cars use the 5" pattern. The Ford trucks have a big 5 on 5.5" pattern, with a big center that takes some work to redrill to anything Chevy. Ratios range from 2.47 to 4.30, and the axles come in 28 or 31 spline varieties. There is lots of interchange possible with the 9" rear-end, which is why it's so popular...I have one in my 55 Belair, and in my 57 Suburban chassis. Unfortunately, they are getting expensive, especially when you have to shop around for just the right one that will fit. So...if you don't know if a rear-end will fit, or what it came from, get out your tape measure and see for yourself! The most important things are overall width, and wheel bolt pattern...then concern yourself with ratio. I like a 2.75-3.0 ratio for a V-8 powered truck that will spend lots of time on the highway; about 3.2-3.7 for a 6 cylinder or small V-8 for in town and limited highway use, and the stock 3.9-4.56 ratio is great if you have to use your truck to haul lotsa weight, and you don't have much engine...just don't plan on going much faster th

If I was going for IFS, I would use the 73-87 suspension and just buy inset rims so it would look stock. I think it would be best, besides I like the widetrack look .You could always get wider rims for the back to stick out farther.Personally I prefer the stock suspension. I just switched to a 76 Cutlass rear end and had my front hubs altered.Thet welded up the old stud holes and drilled new ones to match the 73-77 Chevelle and Cutlass patern, so now I can run Corvette ralley wheels. Oh, I used 55-57 Chev car wheel drums. Everything is as I want it.

I recall my 1954 3100 as 61" (drum face to drum face).

FYI: a 5 lug rearend will not be close to stock, will not use stock wheels or tire (sizes)or hubcaps.

I'm thinking the truck no longer has the enclosed driveshaft or stock transmission.

Consider more about what you want to achieve and ask questions how to get there. With a little more for us to chew on, we could be more helpful. Good Luck

Thanks for all the data Big Chevy 3600.

sfsutton - Open driveshaft, 4-speed manual transmission. I'm putting Scott Danforth's IFS kit on the front of my '50 3100 with a 1995 GMC Sonoma 2wd as the donor vehicle (5 lug, 4.75" bolt pattern). When I said stock, I should've been more specific meaning I have no plans to lower my truck, put super wide wheels or fancy rims on it, no performance tires. I want my truck to have more of a look that is true to 1950 rather than something that looks customized. Engine is a rebuilt '57 235. Truck will go on the highway and if I can cruise up to 70-75mph, I'll be happy.

So, which rear end would fit nicely beneath my '50 that will allow it to have a close-to-the-correct look and allow me to get up to highway speeds.
Thanks.

The look (height from the ground) can be most any rear end you want. The height is determined by other factors in your suspension. If it were I, and wanting to run a 235 but with a lower gear ratio, I would be looking for a 55-59 Chevy Pickup rear. Their rears are 62". I'm not an expert in these matters but someone will probably have a better suggestion.

To answer your measurement question, 62" outside to outside, that is what my 51 3100 measures.

most people I know use GM F-body rear ends with a new set of spring mounts